Fender is not honoring older Guild lifetime warranties.

[twocorgis]

Tough crowd.

I see no reason for Guild to be performing free maintenance work on 20 to 50 year-old guitars.

I've got to disagree with you there. The lifetime warranty is against defects in workmanship, which certainly applied in my case. The guitar had a defective neck set from the factory, and the subsequent neck reset (the one I was unaware of when I bought the guitar "new" three years later) was also defective. As far as I'm concerned defective is defective, even if I was too uninformed to realize it for a very long time.

Is Martin's warranty policy more liberal than Guild's? Certainly. But there are defects in workmanship on older Guilds that should fall under the auspices of their lifetime warranty. I personally think that a policy more like Martin's would help Guild play in the same sandbox as Martin and other high-end brands, which seems to be where they want to be.

Again, just my $.02...

 

[geoguy]

Yours seems like a one-of-a-kind issue, Sandy - a manufacturing defect that is not recognized by the purchaser for several decades. Seems fair in that rare instance for the manufacturer to decide those types of things on a case-by-case basis, as they did with you.

But if a pickguard shrinks over 30 years, or a flat-top acoustic guitar needs a neck reset after 35 years, I think an original owner should be willing to say: "hell, I got three decades of use out of this instrument, I want to keep it, & it is worth it to me to make this repair out-of-pocket".

If not, maybe sell the instrument & let the next guy/gal (who won't have benefit of a warranty anyways) decide whether to make that repair.

 

[capnjuan]

Hi GG:

Based on what Chazmo said

You mean this?

.

:wink:

... heads up that things are in flux ... Unfortunately, I can't talk about it publicly (and I'm really sorry about that). I'll just say that this may be a bad time to be seeking warrantee repair; I don't know. I do know that if you can wait a few months you might just want to sit tight a bit ... I'm sorry I can't be clearer.

This sounds a little like:
1. The guy who did the warranty work lost his job,
2. The guy who wrote the warranty policy lost his job,
3. "I have a secret plan to end the war"


Hi Sandy; unless Guild has some marketing intel that says for a certainty that people don't buy new Guilds because of warranty concerns, not sure wanting to Be Like Mike will make much difference.

I understand the distinction with your guitar; the neck was never set correctly; I wonder how many warranty-seekers are in your position or just want to cash in.

 

[taabru45]

I find it strange that the new Guilds only have the serial number on the paper label....I like the idea of it being stamped, because of theft i.d. and warranty....Larrivee burns them into the neck block.....Steffan

 

[Taylor Martin Guild]

I find it strange that the new Guilds only have the serial number on the paper label....I like the idea of it being stamped, because of theft i.d. and warranty....Larrivee burns them into the neck block.....Steffan

It makes sense to me.
When the sticker falls out, your warranty expires.

 

[twocorgis]

Yours seems like a one-of-a-kind issue, Sandy - a manufacturing defect that is not recognized by the purchaser for several decades.

While my case may be rare, certainly wouldn't call it one-of-a-kind. Surely there must be some other Guild buyers like me out there that are too stupid to realize that their guitar has a defective neck set. :lol:

 

[adorshki]

The end of that facility roughly coincides with the revised (cough cough) warranty requirement that any warrantable guitar has to have been purchased from an authorized Guild dealer.

That's what I see.

It would be understandable for Guild to require that its Authorized dealers have a qualified repairman on premises because, as a practical matter, there is nowhere else to send the guitars for repair; that is, can't send them to the non-existent custom shop and apparently NH Guild isn't carrying craftsmen on the payroll who do nothing but repair come-backers; similar to car dealerships and warranty work, the dealer does the work and bills the manufacturer. The dealer has the assurance that the manufacturer won't go around bidding the work to the cheapest garage.

Here's where things get a little sticky. In my experience in the computer biz and the car biz, warranty reimbursement is done by "schedule", a price list of what the manufacturer will pay for various warranty jobs. So yes, the dealer is guaranteed a certain flow of work, but the warranty reimbursement schedule may not pay him enough to WANT the work. THAT was why one of the guys I used recently decided not to be a Fender authorized repair guy anymore.
Also in practice the dealer may not have an actual repair guy on site but may actually farm it out to a "trade only" shop (the guy in the garage, who has lots of experience and ALL the tools neccessary), and is in fact "brokering" the warranty work, but still maintaining the correct "chain of custody" to keep the warranty intact.
Another complication could be something like a finish flaw. I suspect MOST shops will not have in house abliity to spray nitro, that work may in fact HAVE to be sent back to NH. So I think there WILL be some repair capacity in place, but it will be just enough to cover what can't be handled at the local level.

Anyway, I think this is the rationale for the current (cough cough) warranty policy of funneling warranty claimants to authorized dealers; the fact is that Guild can't repair the guitars themselves even if they wanted to and that there's at least some reason to believe that until their Warranty Reserves are replenished, (cough cough) warranty policy is going to be Nancy Reaganesque: 'Just Say No'.

I think you're correct about the rationale, I just think the mechanics will be a bit different than what you suspected. Also I think it's intended to be the permanent model since it WILL reduce overhead at New Hartford. And probably many other Fender-owned facilities....

 

[adorshki]

Yours seems like a one-of-a-kind issue, Sandy - a manufacturing defect that is not recognized by the purchaser for several decades.

While my case may be rare, certainly wouldn't call it one-of-a-kind. Surely there must be some other Guild buyers like me out there that are too stupid to realize that their guitar has a defective neck set. :lol:

Right, but one of 'em isn't the original owner and the other guy lost his receipt.

 

[capnjuan]

....I think you're correct about the rationale, I just think the mechanics will be a bit different than what you suspected. Also I think it's intended to be the permanent model since it WILL reduce overhead at New Hartford. And probably many other Fender-owned facilities....

Hi Al; not sure of the nuts and bolts but they need to do something ... and I don't mean go out and find/fix every Guild that owners allege have some factory defect; but some mechanism to fix at least a few of the older guitars ... justified or not ... if for no other reason so they don't look like they're chiseling on the warranty.

 

[fronobulax]

Right, but one of 'em isn't the original owner and the other guy lost his receipt.

Wrong on both counts for me and my JS II. I fall into twocorgi's category of being too "inexperienced" to realize it needs a neck reset.

I note the discussion seems to be mixing apples and oranges, in particular

• the warranty policy for pre-Fender (1995) Guilds

• the warranty for pre-New Hartford Guilds

• the warranty for new (presumably New Hartford) Guilds.

The issues are related because warranty work for any of the above could be performed at the same facility but they are different because we don't actually know what Fender's obligation is in the first case.

The discussion has also gotten a little fuzzy because there is a difference of opinion concerning whether a neck reset should be a lifetime or limited warranty item.

Several people have expressed the opinion that, for marketing reasons and the "good of the brand" that all three categories should be effectively the same - the original owner with documentation should receive some kind or warranty consideration regardless of the categories.

The opinion has also been expressed that since Martin treats a neck reset as a lifetime warranty item then Fender should feel obligated to do the same.

Not really sure why I feel compelled to summarize portions of the thread.

 

[davismanLV]

Not really sure why I feel compelled to summarize portions of the thread.

Well, frono, I think because it's a very complicated issue and people have gone in different directions. I, for one, appreciate a little summarization. I was pointing out some possible reasons why a big corporation in this situation might not want to honor the previous companies committment and how it could possibly hurt or impact the brand name they love so much, and some took that as my defending bad business practices or lack of support. I was merely pointing out another aspect of this very complicated issue. Playing "Devil's Advocate", if you will. There are unexpected consequences to almost everything.

Summarize all you want, I say. Do new, NH Guilds, bought from an authorized dealer carry a "lifetime warranty" just like the old ones do? Does anyone know?
Tom in Vegas

 

[jgwoods]

I posted the "Limited Lifetime Warranty" back on page 4. Yes it is lifetime but subject to a lot of gray areas for interpretation/disagreement.
My read on it tells me the manufacturer might not do neck resets down the road because they can - rightly?- say that is a wear and tear issue.
Martin can say the same thing but generally does neck resets on older guitars that still meet the warranty requirements. I suspect it is not all that many and that they view the cost as good will and good advertising.

 

[Taylor Martin Guild]

I still feel that the new cost of Martins include a neck reset, when needed.
Guilds were a lot less money, so I can see them not wanting to do as many resets down the road.

It all boils down to what Guild/ Fender wants to do for their customers.

 

[avagadro]

As Guild owners shouldn't we be making our voices heard at Fender corporate headquarters?

 

[adorshki]

Right, but one of 'em isn't the original owner and the other guy lost his receipt.

Wrong on both counts for me and my JS II. I fall into twocorgi's category of being too "inexperienced" to realize it needs a neck reset.

Sandy's case was that he was too inexperienced to realize it CAME with a defective neck set.
Is that what you're saying, that someone has evaluated that the JSII was never right, out of the box? That would also be a different problem than the neck gradually going out of alignment on a flat-top over time, and whether that's warrantable. In fact it kind of surprises me, being a solid body, the dynamics would be completely different. I could see a glued-on neck being problematic, but if it's a bolt on I'd think it's be a pretty cheap fix.
I was only making a humorous observation about how uncommon his specific situation probably is.

 

[adorshki]

As Guild owners shouldn't we be making our voices heard at Fender corporate headquarters?

In fact, I think Dave Gonzales, the Guild product manager, IS a member here, and this forum is now an official link on Guild's website, so I have a strong suspicion that somebody up there IS paying attention.
I could be wrong about Dave, but I seem to remember seeing that mentioned somewhere in one of the "Let's Meet Guild" threads, or in one of Twocorgi's threads about the progress of the neck re-set on hs D50.

 

[twocorgis]

As Guild owners shouldn't we be making our voices heard at Fender corporate headquarters?

In fact, I think Dave Gonzales, the Guild product manager, IS a member here, and this forum is now an official link on Guild's website, so I have a strong suspicion that somebody up there IS paying attention.
I could be wrong about Dave, but I seem to remember seeing that mentioned somewhere in one of the "Let's Meet Guild" threads, or in one of Twocorgi's threads about the progress of the neck re-set on hs D50.

Al, I don't think Dave G is a member here, or at least I've never seen one of his posts. Kim Keller is however, and I think he had a lot to do with Fender warranting the neck reset on my D50. If you're reading this Kim, THANKS BUDDY! 8)

 

[adorshki]

As Guild owners shouldn't we be making our voices heard at Fender corporate headquarters?

In fact, I think Dave Gonzales, the Guild product manager, IS a member here, and this forum is now an official link on Guild's website, so I have a strong suspicion that somebody up there IS paying attention.
I could be wrong about Dave, but I seem to remember seeing that mentioned somewhere in one of the "Let's Meet Guild" threads, or in one of Twocorgi's threads about the progress of the neck re-set on hs D50.

Al, I don't think Dave G is a member here, or at least I've never seen one of his posts. Kim Keller is however, and I think he had a lot to do with Fender warranting the neck reset on my D50. If you're reading this Kim, THANKS BUDDY! 8)

THERE we go, thanks for the clarification!

 

[kostask]

I still feel that the new cost of Martins include a neck reset, when needed.
Guilds were a lot less money, so I can see them not wanting to do as many resets down the road.

It all boils down to what Guild/ Fender wants to do for their customers.

On new Martin guitars, neck resets are no longer warranted for the life of the instrument. Happened a couple of years back. All of the guitars built prior to that change over are still covered, but any guitars bought since are NOT covered for neck resets (unless it is within the first year or so (forget exactly when the change over in warranty coverage occurred).

Kostas

 

[fronobulax]

I was only making a humorous observation about how uncommon his specific situation probably is.

As was I...

The discussion concerning neck resets for flat top acoustic guitars really doesn't not carry over to solid body electric basses.

Personally I have no idea whether my JS needs a neck reset or not but I'd like to believe I'd notice something different/wrong if it did

I am, however, the original owner and I rediscovered my receipt recently and expect to be able to present it if required. Thus, if a defect in workmanship or materials was discovered nearly 40 years later then I do meet the presumed prerequisites for a legitimate warranty claim.

Now there are two of them.