D-55 on its way to Guild for warranty service

[E-Type]

I’ve just done a little woodworking/staining. If you were going to pass off rosewood as ebony, India ink is the way to go. I have both rosewood and an ebony fretboards in the house and that looks like natural dark rosewood. But that’s just off the pic.

 

[cupric]

As a customer without knowledge of their workforce, it is up to them to provide a timeline. This whole post pandemic excuse is overused imho. 10 weeks is a long time! If my mind where to wander I might come to a conclusion that they have a lot of warranty work......which is not a good look. The work itself may be extensive or time consuming, but the "lost in the abyss" isn't great reassurance. And it is bad customer service.

 

[dwasifar]

Suck it up. Wait 8 weeks between calls. Customer service and communications are not what they once were. Many companies have more work than they can staff so somebody has to wait. Your hope and opinion as to how long it should take may not be grounded in reality. Hindsight being 20/20 if the amount of time the guitar was out of your hands was important then it should have been discussed beforehand. Perhaps they would have given you a realistic schedule or told you not to ship the guitar for a few weeks.

Eight weeks between calls? If you had a car in the shop for warranty service, would you wait that long?

If my "hope and opinion" is not grounded in reality, they've had ample opportunity to adjust my expectations. That's really all I've been asking them for on every call - not "I want it back now," but "give me an idea of what to expect, so I can stop pestering you." And yes, that's verbatim, but that answer hasn't come through. All I'm told is that they have no update on status. If ten weeks is unreasonable, then why don't they tell me what would be reasonable?

Not directly comparable, because you have only one vendor for factory warranty work, but home repair is like that around here. You can find a list with 10 companies that could do the job. 3 of them can't be contacted by phone or don't respond to a voice message within 3 days. The remaining 7 will set up a time for an estimate but four of them won't show, didn't contact you before to let you know and don't really care whether it is rescheduled or not. The remaining three will have estimates but get kind of squirrely if you ask when they will start and when they would be done. If you do accept the soonest start date, which is still several weeks out, there will be no communication until the phone call that says "we'll be there tomorrow". So your dealings like Guild are pretty much what I have now been trained to expect from local home repair. Maybe I'm too cynical.

I have the same experience locally, and it's frustrating, but I would expect a multi-million-dollar corporation with worldwide brand recognition to have their act together better than the average squirrelly local contractor. That's why we have a site called Let's Talk Guild but no site called Let's Talk A-ABC Plumbing.

I'm rather surprised to see the stated position of a moderator on a Guild fan site is "Guild sucks just like everything else." That's how your answer comes across, anyway. If I'm mischaracterizing it, please say so.

 

[fronobulax]

In your specific case Guild customer service is not exceeding expectations and not meeting yours. Guild is not alone in that. If that means Guild sucks like everything else then I have to agree that is what I said. Guild's product may be outstanding but that doesn't mean their customer service is outstanding. Nor does it mean they have a better solution than everyone else to supply chain and labor problems.

You seem to believe that calling Guild will have some effect. I disagree. While I just said Guild sucks I also believe if they actually had an update about your repair they really would contact you. So your calling is of no benefit except to address your concerns. 10 weeks was selected because after ten weeks of silence there is more going on than just you being impatient.

I have also had experiences in other places where the immature individual in their first job who answers the phone also has the ability to raise or lower your job in the work queue. So they get annoyed with the requests for progress and postpone work on your job as a result. That doesn't seem to be the case with Guild but the squeaky wheel doesn't always get the grease.

I would expect a multi-million-dollar corporation with worldwide brand recognition to have their act together better than the average squirrelly local contractor.

I can mention numerous companies that are bigger than Guild that would not meet your expectation. I don't share your expectation which is the core point of my possibly snarky answer to a possible rhetorical question. Maybe I should have just said "be more patient"?

 

[Rayk]

In your specific case Guild customer service is not exceeding expectations and not meeting yours. Guild is not alone in that. If that means Guild sucks like everything else then I have to agree that is what I said. Guild's product may be outstanding but that doesn't mean their customer service is outstanding. Nor does it mean they have a better solution than everyone else to supply chain and labor problems.

You seem to believe that calling Guild will have some effect. I disagree. While I just said Guild sucks I also believe if they actually had an update about your repair they really would contact you. So your calling is of no benefit except to address your concerns. 10 weeks was selected because after ten weeks of silence there is more going on than just you being impatient.

I have also had experiences in other places where the immature individual in their first job who answers the phone also has the ability to raise or lower your job in the work queue. So they get annoyed with the requests for progress and postpone work on your job as a result. That doesn't seem to be the case with Guild but the squeaky wheel doesn't always get the grease.



I can mention numerous companies that are bigger than Guild that would not meet your expectation. I don't share your expectation which is the core point of my possibly snarky answer to a possible rhetorical question. Maybe I should have just said "be more patient"?

Ooo I’m going for popcorn any body need some ?

 

[davismanLV]

As soon as I heard that Guild said, "Send us your guitar." I thought, hoooo boy, here we go. That they're taking this long and not responding as you'd hoped is not a huge surprise to me. So, I guess be patient is the best advice. If they offered to replace vs. repair, that MIGHT have expedited things, but maybe not. Things are still skewed with supply chain and labor shortages. Good luck.

 

[Rayk]

As soon as I heard that Guild said, "Send us your guitar." I thought, hoooo boy, here we go. That they're taking this long and not responding as you'd hoped is not a huge surprise to me. So, I guess be patient is the best advice. If they offered to replace vs. repair, that MIGHT have expedited things, but maybe not. Things are still skewed with supply chain and labor shortages. Good luck.

I know from last year or so my local luthier said he was backed up for months . I guess they only can only move so fast depending how many people they have on hand to do repairs , What exactly the type of repair needed is and how long the job would take .
Now Ben had my guitar for repairs which took about two months to do .

I certainly would have no issue about calling up Guild and have a pleasant conversation about a update on repair if they never gave me a time frame . If they did I’d be content giving the time stated .

Oooo it’s extra movie butter butter popcorn !

 

[dwasifar]

You seem to believe that calling Guild will have some effect. I disagree. While I just said Guild sucks I also believe if they actually had an update about your repair they really would contact you. So your calling is of no benefit except to address your concerns. 10 weeks was selected because after ten weeks of silence there is more going on than just you being impatient.

I have also had experiences in other places where the immature individual in their first job who answers the phone also has the ability to raise or lower your job in the work queue. So they get annoyed with the requests for progress and postpone work on your job as a result. That doesn't seem to be the case with Guild but the squeaky wheel doesn't always get the grease.

Well, again, you seem to think I'm calling them to say "hurry up." And as I've stated, repeatedly, I have never told them to hurry up. In fact, on each call I've encouraged them to take the time they need to do it right; I only want to be kept in the loop about what's going on. And if you read back a few posts, you can see I specifically acknowledged that pestering the tech to finish could be counterproductive, and I'm taking pains not to approach it that way.

So I think you're making assumptions about the nature of my conversations with Guild that are not accurate and not supported by my statements in this thread. Yes, I wish it was faster, and yes, I think it is taking too long, but that's me talking here. I have never said those things to Guild.

 

[cupric]

There may be several reasons for the amount of time without updates. But without a explanation it's a mute point. It is bad customer service. The guitar in question is a flagship model, which means you paid a higher price. The warranty does lead to expectations of being treated fairly, and should lead to feeling like a valued customer. If you inquire about the instrument after several weeks without a satisfactory answer than you are not considered a valued customer IMHO.
Say you had a internet podcast and was loaned a guitar, any model, for review purposes. After several weeks of podcasts without a review corporate contacts you. You explain that the guitar is in your possession but you have been busy. I wonder if you would be free to hold on to it until you have time? I don't think this would be tolerated very long. Especially if it is a rather costly higher end model.
If this happened to me I think I would have handled it similar to the way you have. And I would not be happy about it. But you are at their mercy. That fact would certainly color my whole conception of my joy of dealing with Guild. From purchase to present. And I would most likely never do business with them again.

 

[fronobulax]

Well, again, you seem to think I'm calling them to say "hurry up." And as I've stated, repeatedly, I have never told them to hurry up. In fact, on each call I've encouraged them to take the time they need to do it right; I only want to be kept in the loop about what's going on. And if you read back a few posts, you can see I specifically acknowledged that pestering the tech to finish could be counterproductive, and I'm taking pains not to approach it that way.

So I think you're making assumptions about the nature of my conversations with Guild that are not accurate and not supported by my statements in this thread. Yes, I wish it was faster, and yes, I think it is taking too long, but that's me talking here. I have never said those things to Guild.

No. I understand you are not trying to hurry them up. I am reminded more of the corporate Progress Report that says "The primary impediment to progress during the reporting period was the requirement to report progress". I also have a personal intolerance for people who ask questions and then do nothing with the answers. In this case I would ask what do you expect to change because of your call? What will you do differently if they did return a call but not commit to a timeframe?

The serenity prayer comes to mind.

Grant me the serenity to

• accept the things I cannot change,
• the courage to change the things I can,
• and the wisdom to know the difference.

This seems to me to be in the realm of things you cannot change and your frustration with the lack of communications seems to be specifically your concern. Your calls aren't changing anything and aren't intended to do so.

If you were, for example, planning a major performance and wanted to have this guitar in hand for it, and had to book the venue now I can imagine a legitimate concern about the lack of a timeframe.

If you got a voice mail from Guild tomorrow that said "We don't know when your repair will be scheduled except that it will be scheduled no sooner than ten weeks from now. No need to call back because there is no further information." What would you do?

I am certainly guilty of jumping to some conclusions and I could be wrong.

I also compartmentalize your concern about a lack of communications and the separate issue that Guild's customer service is not meeting reasonable expectations. If you are not separating them that might also be a factor in how I view your responses.

 

[dwasifar]

If you got a voice mail from Guild tomorrow that said "We don't know when your repair will be scheduled except that it will be scheduled no sooner than ten weeks from now. No need to call back because there is no further information." What would you do?

Actually I would accept that, because it's definite. I wouldn't like it, but I'd stop pestering them, because it clearly states there is no more information to be had at this point. It at least tells me something about the process. The difference between that and what's going on now is that they have not really told me anything, and the responses to the calls - "We'll check and then get back to you" - imply there is information to be had that I'm not getting. And of course broken promises to get back to me are just frustrating in themselves.

 

[dwasifar]

The conversation with Fronobulax is useful because it makes me analyze my motivations. What do I want, actually? And on reflection it turns out that what I want is a clear plan. Secondarily I want prompt service, but mainly I just want an understanding of when things will happen, so I can plan.

There are reasons I could attach to that, like for instance I don't want them to randomly ship it to arrive on a date when I'm out of town. And if I know roughly how long it's expected to take, then I can plan for that. But when it comes down to it, I want a plan because it makes me feel like things are under control. If I know when it's due, I know when it's late; and if I know it's late, then I can legitimately pester.

I'll draw a comparison again to bringing a car in for warranty service. No car owner would tolerate months of waiting with no particular plan or deadline for completion, and nobody would accept claims that staffing issues now require it to be done that way. People might accept reasonable delays, but not a complete lack of structure to the process; they'd accept extended deadlines, but not "someday, when we get to it." And it doesn't matter if the customer really needs the car for something or not. Customers should not need special pleadings to obtain a commitment to complete the job.

Basically I have the same sort of expectations that most of us are required to adhere to at our own work. How many of us have employers who would be fine with hearing "okay, boss, when I feel like it?" In our daily lives, we have deadlines and due dates, so it doesn't feel unreasonable to expect that generally. Not being able to get it makes me feel like Guild is not taking the job seriously, which increases my tension level about the whole thing and spurs me to call them again.

Thanks to Fronobulax for making me think this through.

 

[GGJaguar]

Two different warranty scenarios - when I brought my Martin to the factory for a neck re-set under warranty, they gave me a time frame right then and there. The work was completed near the end of that window, but at least I knew the expectation and never had to call (they emailed me when it was done). Had it not been completed, I certainly would have called them for an update.

When I brought my Subaru in to have the recalled Takata airbag replaced, they had no idea when it would be done because of supply chain issues (didn't know when they'd get a replacement airbag in). At least I knew the reason why they couldn't give me an estimated completion date. Since this was a safety issue, they gave me a rental car in the meantime (I doubt Guild would give you a "loaner" guitar, though).

In both cases, I knew what to expect. Guild hasn't given you any kind of expectation and, for me, that's the issue at hand.

 

[silverfox103]

On a related note, here's a story: I have one of those plastic / metal picnic tables on the deck that we bought at a big box store, I'm guessing about 20 years ago. At the end of the season, I collapse it and it stores against a basement wall. It's given us great service, no complaints.

I noticed yesterday, it was getting a little shaky. I flipped it over to tighten some sheet metal screws. I noticed probably a half dozen were stripped. Not wanting to have anyone get hurt, I took the top and bench seats off, getting it ready to be recycled. Then the Mrs. tells me it was perfect for her to do her watercolor painting. Now I know I either have to fix it or buy a new one.

I happen to notice on the underside of the top, it says "Made in the USA" and the company's name is "Lifetime". Being a Made in the USA guy, I thought to myself I'll give them a call, they will take care of me. Just got off of the phone with them. They were great. They'll replace the top and the benches, no charge...........great. Here's the kicker, it will be about 6 to 12 months as they come from China........Huh? Things have changed since the table was made 20 years ago. I guess I will put it back together / repair and wait for the boat from China.

Tom

 

[GAD]

Everyone is tired of hearing about the supply chain, but in the computer networking industry where I live the lead times for just about any finished product is about a year. A YEAR! And some are even longer. Here's a Cisco example, but similar lead times are reported for all major vendors.

Let's not forget that CMG recently laid off an unknown number of people. The impacts of the pandemic are far from over, and in some cases I think we're just starting to see the impacts from some businesses that are struggling with the repercussions. I don't know anything about CMG's finances, but I have to imagine that import guitars are their main source of profit. Since international shipments (the supply chain) are a known problem, I'd have to further imagine that they're feeling the impact of being unable to source import guitars and/or materials. It's an easy leap for me to think that they've laid off people who are not directly tied to income and profit, and that has thus impacted warranty work turnaround times.

 

[dwasifar]

Everyone is tired of hearing about the supply chain, but in the computer networking industry where I live the lead times for just about any finished product is about a year. A YEAR! And some are even longer. Here's a Cisco example, but similar lead times are reported for all major vendors.

Yeah, but the point is they are giving lead times.

 

[Opsimath]

Just a thought, but make sure they have it.

Many years ago I had a sewing machine in for warranty work at Sears, they had to send it off, was supposed to take two or three weeks and they would call me to pick it up. Didn't happen. After a couple months of phone calls leading nowhere I finally explained my frustrations to the customer service representative who answered the phone and asked her if she could please do something to help me.

She went to check on progress, and after a while came back and said she was having trouble locating my machine, please hold a bit longer. She finally returned and said she could not find it. It seemed my machine had been lost. Needless to say I was less than pleased.

That's probably not the case here, but surprisingly enough it can happen - at least at Sears.

 

[fronobulax]

The conversation with Fronobulax is useful because it makes me analyze my motivations. What do I want, actually? And on reflection it turns out that what I want is a clear plan. Secondarily I want prompt service, but mainly I just want an understanding of when things will happen, so I can plan.

There are reasons I could attach to that, like for instance I don't want them to randomly ship it to arrive on a date when I'm out of town. And if I know roughly how long it's expected to take, then I can plan for that. But when it comes down to it, I want a plan because it makes me feel like things are under control. If I know when it's due, I know when it's late; and if I know it's late, then I can legitimately pester.

I'll draw a comparison again to bringing a car in for warranty service. No car owner would tolerate months of waiting with no particular plan or deadline for completion, and nobody would accept claims that staffing issues now require it to be done that way. People might accept reasonable delays, but not a complete lack of structure to the process; they'd accept extended deadlines, but not "someday, when we get to it." And it doesn't matter if the customer really needs the car for something or not. Customers should not need special pleadings to obtain a commitment to complete the job.

Basically I have the same sort of expectations that most of us are required to adhere to at our own work. How many of us have employers who would be fine with hearing "okay, boss, when I feel like it?" In our daily lives, we have deadlines and due dates, so it doesn't feel unreasonable to expect that generally. Not being able to get it makes me feel like Guild is not taking the job seriously, which increases my tension level about the whole thing and spurs me to call them again.

Thanks to Fronobulax for making me think this through.

In my work experience I was given the things I needed to accomplish a task. If my boss gave me a deadline and we could not negotiate the things I needed to meet it, the deadline was withdrawn or the boss eventually was not my boss. Sometimes resources were needed and sometimes the boss needed to do their job and assign priorities. Sometimes I would say "sure, when I get around to it" but that would be followed by "or should I stop doing X to do Y?" So your work analogy doesn't work for me at all

All deadlines are not equal. Some are hard - if it's not done by X then we should not even bother starting - but some are soft - "this week is fine".

Guild's failure to have a plan they are willing to commit to is not just Guild's problem in 2022. They are one of many companies that cannot plan because of staffing and supply chains. So having No Plan is regrettable but acceptable. Failing to tell you that they have No Plan is bad customer service.

But I totally get uncertainty and control. For your mental health I would gladly back off on my wait weeks recommendation.

 

[Boneman]

If it were me, with anything going in for service, I'd have ascertained the expected wait time up front. If none could be provided, and I took a leap of faith it would be reasonable and sent it off, I'd have confirmed receipt of the item and then tried to get an update now that they have it in their possession to see what they are working with. If they still couldn't tell me at that point, I would have major concerns. Couple that with when I called to check on things after 10 weeks, let's say I wouldn't have been as genial with a "we don't know answer".

The poor customer service rep answering the phone would have got an earful, my patience is worn out and now you need to get the supervisor/manager on the phone to explain things. Then that supervisor would be confirming receipt of my guitar by serial number, acknowledgement of what the work to be done is, get me a status update, an expected completion time frame and no more F'in around. But thats just me. Patience only gets you so far, sometimes you need to be a more forceful squeaky wheel. Plus I don't think they are going to sabotage your repair because you tell them to do their job.

If I had to hazard a guess as to the poor customer service, I'd think it is simply that they just recently had layoffs, so they are short staffed, and the remaining employees feel like maybe they could be next and started looking for a new job and are slacking off. There is this whole phenomena of quiet quitting going on in America, maybe Guild has some of that in their ranks as well? To be sure the situation sucks, but you ought to be able to get a completion date from them, just be more of an a-hole when you call back. Take it from Alice:

 

[12 string]

Are published specs such as bridge material contractually obligated? Might there be some fine print reserving the right to make changes?

Specs for the F-512 (may have changed over the years) don't include an ebony bridge nor a maple neck but mine has both. No idea why, no special order, it's just the way it came. And I'm not sending it back!