Couple of thousand people here need your prayers.fire threat

[taabru45]

This pretty little town (Lillooet, B.C.) in what is regularly one of the hottest spots in Canada, Lovely area, but very dry, the town is being evacuated because of a forest fire threat. Don't know what more to say, but if you have any sway, or think you might, these people would love to have you pulling for them. Prayers, good wishes, focus... etc. Thanks....I sure wouldn't want that for myself or any one else for that matter....Steffan
http://www.lillooetbc.com/

 

[john_kidder]

That fire's just over the hill from us here in Ashcroft - weird yellow light throught the smoke in the heat (about 102F all day, still near 98 at 10 o'clock). Feels like more lightning to come -there are fires all around - just here we've got smoke from the Okanagan, Cherry Creek, Back Valley, Lilloett fires, farther north there are more.

Lightning started over 100 fires last weekend. The bush is tinder dry, and because of the mountain pine beetle, which has killed almost all the lodgepole and ponderosa pine, it's just full of standing dead dry fuel. This could be the summer that all of the Interior of BC goes up. We've been waiting for it for a few years now, since we no longer have cold winters to kill the beetles, and there's about 15 million acres of standing dead forest waiting for a spark. When it lights up, no force on earth is going to put it out.

People who live here, like those in the Arctic, are close enough to the effects of global warming that it's hard to have any patience any more with those who say it's not happening, and it's impossible to find common ground with those who say that even if it is happening, it's "not our fault", and therefore we shouldn't be pulling out all the stops to mitigate the damage. Humbug.

 

[taabru45]

My heart just aches for you and those who are being touched by this crazy making situation, John. B.C. is a huge land mass, and right now there are thousands of acres blazing, and millions more waiting to go up....I drove across B.C. about 3 years ago and was shocked to see the tell tale red masses of trees that had been killed, often covering large areas of a mountain or valley. At it best, this province is like a paradise, with every type of beauty you could imagine. Reading Johns' letter is not only heartbreaking but a reminder of how lucky we are to have what we do have, as it can be lost so easily, and without any ability to stop it. If ever there was a time to wake up to the dangers of ignorance, its now. Even a glass bottle left behind on a hike, or campout, can act like a magnifying glass to start a fire. So, somehow, lets take heed to the messages that are coming to us....like, don't park your car in tall grass, or maybe even drive in the back country, as the catalytic converter actually gets hot enough to start a grass fire in these conditions. I remember hearing a story of a house burning down, cause was a goldfish bowl in the window acting like a magnifying glass on the curtains......so folks without trying to sound like a lecture, please be careful, where ever you are, Carry some water in a jug in your trunk, and a spray bottle, it can cool you down if you get stuck, Might be good to have some kind of fire extinguisher around too, and they only work if you spray the base of the fire. not the flames...this is a great forum...other places might reprimand me for being 'off topic'....when it comes to life.......no one is off topic......Steffan

This highway sign says a lot...the red shows many thousands of acres of red trees, lots of these are easily 70 to100 feet tall......dead dry firewood....the little picture on the bottom left shows B.C....the red areas are dead forests, and this was in 2005...Imagine this in an area larger than Texas...

 

[killdeer43]

We traveled to Bella Coola and Anahim Lake a couple of times in the past two years and were so saddened to see the endless horizons of dead trees cutting right through the heart of beautiful B.C. I thought then of the potential for further devastation from fire, and here we are in the middle of a hot, dry summer. Scary!
We've also spent some time in the area around Lillooet, Merritt, and Ashcroft and our hearts are heavy as their very existence is threatened.

These are sad times indeed in the province and our hearts go out to our northern neighbors.

Take care all,
Joe

 

[Pike]

These are sad times indeed in the province and our hearts go out to our northern neighbors.

Well said Joe. I'm sure we all share in that sentiment.

it's hard to have any patience any more with those who say it's not happening, and it's impossible to find common ground with those who say that even if it is happening, it's "not our fault", and therefore we shouldn't be pulling out all the stops to mitigate the damage. Humbug.

Absolutely John...

 

[dogberry]

These are sad times indeed in the province and our hearts go out to our northern neighbors.

Well said Joe. I'm sure we all share in that sentiment.

[quote:1c0r1rmu]it's hard to have any patience any more with those who say it's not happening, and it's impossible to find common ground with those who say that even if it is happening, it's "not our fault", and therefore we shouldn't be pulling out all the stops to mitigate the damage. Humbug.

Absolutely John...[/quote:1c0r1rmu]

+1. If we don't get smart soon about climate change, all other questions become irrelevant. It's hard to feel optimistic on that, given human history. :x
Dogberry

 

[capnjuan]

... it's hard to have any patience any more with those who say it's not happening, and it's impossible to find common ground with those who say that even if it is happening, it's "not our fault", and therefore we shouldn't be pulling out all the stops to mitigate the damage. Humbug.

+1. If we don't get smart soon about climate change, all other questions become irrelevant. It's hard to feel optimistic on that, given human history. :x Dogberry

+1 It also doesn't help that US political leadership is spending all of its capital pulling the economy of the the ditch, chasing down Al Queda, and overhauling the health care system. It would be nice to see a coalition of the Concerned; Russia, China, India, Europa, Nos Freres Canadian... a group that the US could join and support without having to lead from the front. J

 

[FNG]

That fire's just over the hill from us here in Ashcroft - weird yellow light throught the smoke in the heat (about 102F all day, still near 98 at 10 o'clock). Feels like more lightning to come -there are fires all around - just here we've got smoke from the Okanagan, Cherry Creek, Back Valley, Lilloett fires, farther north there are more.

Lightning started over 100 fires last weekend. The bush is tinder dry, and because of the mountain pine beetle, which has killed almost all the lodgepole and ponderosa pine, it's just full of standing dead dry fuel. This could be the summer that all of the Interior of BC goes up. We've been waiting for it for a few years now, since we no longer have cold winters to kill the beetles, and there's about 15 million acres of standing dead forest waiting for a spark. When it lights up, no force on earth is going to put it out.

People who live here, like those in the Arctic, are close enough to the effects of global warming that it's hard to have any patience any more with those who say it's not happening, and it's impossible to find common ground with those who say that even if it is happening, it's "not our fault", and therefore we shouldn't be pulling out all the stops to mitigate the damage. Humbug.

How would you propose we mitigate the damage?

 

[capnjuan]

Hi Effin'; bringing back nuclear power would help. Not that it will make much of a dent by itself but the Cash for Clunkers program is the kind of policy that can do something positive. Not sure what we do about methane from bovine flatulence .... :wink: ... but there are a lot of good ideas out there. Florida Power and Light turned in a good year ... mostly because of strong showing by its 'Green' investments and operations.

 

[FNG]

Hey capt...I would hardly call Cash for Clunkers a boon for the environment.


The definition of insanity is trying to get rid of the internal combustion engine while trying to save General Motors.

 

[Pike]

The definition of insanity is trying to get rid of the internal combustion engine while trying to save General Motors.

:lol: I couldn't believe what I was hearing on the commentary last night when a talking head was asked what would become of the clunkers. He actually said, "Well, some will be parted out to vehicles that may need a water pump or other parts". So what he was saying is that we'll use some of them to help keep others of them on the road. :x

 

[capnjuan]

Hey capt...I would hardly call Cash for Clunkers a boon for the environment. If it helps get older vehicles with older catalytic converters that pollute more and consume excessive amounts of fuel off the road, why wouldn't that be a good idea? The definition of insanity is trying to get rid of the internal combustion engine while trying to save General Motors. Agree; GM hasn't done much to advance engine technology but I can't be objective about GM. My wife works at a GM dealer ... our health benefits are based on her continuing employment.

J

 

[john_kidder]

How would you propose we mitigate the damage?

There's the question, all right. I'm just getting a technical proposal buttoned together now - I'll try to get a reasoned response out later tonight.

Two general issues, though: 1) reduce the use of fossil fuels, 2) prepare to spend vast resources helping populations around the world deal with the effects that are already certain.

This is the first crisis that humanity will face as a species. We're hopelessly ill-equipped with our little competitive nation-states, and most of our little nation-states are hopelessly addicted to energy. The prospects are not positive, and it's not at all clear that a favourable outcome might occur under any circumstances.

More to come. I promise that I'll stay on the non-political side of this immensely important debate. Well, at least I'll try.

 

[Scratch]

My thoughts and prayers are with those in harms way up there...

 

[john_kidder]

Lilloett last night - fire is much closer now - 2 km wide and moving down the mountain

 

[Graham]

Two general issues, though: 1) reduce the use of fossil fuels, 2) prepare to spend vast resources helping populations around the world deal with the effects that are already certain.

The 2nd one John is a darn near impossibility because the folks chosen to oversee something that large will waste more than what gets put to good use.

If it's Government run, it'll cost 3X what it should and not make a dent (Canadian Gun Registry as one example), if it's Corporate run it'll cost at least 2X what it should and 75% off all of that money will disappear or be funneled to "Friendly Corporations" (Haliburton).

Debt relief won't solve anything, sending food won't solve anything, infrastructure needs to be built and maintained by the populations that live in those regions and farming needs to happen so they can be self sustaining, and commerce needs to grow. All of those things, in the short term, 50 - 100 years will consume fossil fuels as ships , planes, heavy equipment need to travel with supplies and work the areas for growth.

Then there is the oppressive weather conditions that make much of the areas unlivable, those are the undeveloped areas.

The developed areas, Europe, Asia are mass producing products to sell here in NA and are not concerned about the future, aside from what their Politicos say.

I don't totally discount what some of the Ecophobes are trying to say, but there is just too much mistrust in me from those saying it. And Science, being just that, is never in agreement, I think it goes against the grain. There are always more questions that come from some of the answers. For every article on the pro side you can find a con so you can choose which side to believe, on anything.

Just my $0.02 CAD where's my change?

 

[john_kidder]

Here's a map the BC Forest Service calls "Wildfires of Note". There are many others, but less noteworthy.

 

[john_kidder]

Two general issues, though: 1) reduce the use of fossil fuels, 2) prepare to spend vast resources helping populations around the world deal with the effects that are already certain.

The 2nd one John is a darn near impossibility

Just my $0.02 CAD where's my change?

You bet. But within 80 years or so, with a minimum .8 to 1 meter rise in mean sea level (that's pretty complete scientific concensus, from warming effects in place now), the populations of places lilke the Nile and Mekong Deltas, much of Bangladesh, most of the land around Bangkok, etc., will be underwater. Doesn't take much. And those millions, tens of millions, hundreds of millions, of folks will be on the move. They'll be moving to places where other hundreds of millions of people already live. And they'll be moving from the areas that produce most of the food that both batches of hundreds of millions eat.

So we are going to see human conflict on a scale we have never seen or imagined. Never. And there are going to be massive deployments of resources to try to assist - even the rich world will recognize that the "gated community" bit is over.

Part of the difficulty for all of us, I think, is how hard it is to come to a resolution when there remains any uncertainty at all - we all like to pin hopes on the potential good outcome. But the data's really pretty overwhelming now - every empirical measure of warming and its effects is at or beyond the outer edge of the predictions. Time to accept that this is going on. THere are very big changes afoot.

 

[West R Lee]

:wink:

 

[killdeer43]

So yes, Steffan and John, getting back to the situation at hand, do send our best to all the good folks in B.C. who might be adversely affected by these wildfires. Dramatic photo of Lillooet, John. Thanks for keeping us posted.

Take care in the coming weeks,
Joe