High prices of the new Guilds; maybe should shop around.

[fronobulax]

Well I'm sure this will raise some eyebrows and probably really tick some of the New Hartford fans off, but that is not my intention, but merely to state the facts.
[snip]
.......I got the sense that was the case with Guild, combined with the new pricing and relative obscurity, especially in this economy......they just ain't sellin'.

West

No problem. Just because I act like you are the burr under my saddle doesn't mean you really are one.

I think we (LTG) are in violent agreement that NH Guilds are hard to find in stores.

There is more opinion than agreement on the reasons why and the things Guild should do to remedy that. The great divide seems to occur between people who are comfortable with NH Guilds being a premium, boutique, luxury, sometimes hard to find and "something to aspire to" kind of brand and those who think "Made to Be Played" means available to be played by anyone, including the great folks who go to Guitar Center to upgrade from their starter acoustic. This is complicated by people who remember when Guilds were the "best value" option and are troubled because that does not seem to be true (yet) of NH Guilds, especially when compared to American made Guilds in the used and vintage market.

Having established that I can be reasonable and see many sides of the discussion, I do want to ask why you conclude that NH Guilds are not selling? In most cases when a product does not sell, it is widely available in many stores and dealers are discounting it sharply in order to move it and get it out of inventory. If it is not selling because dealers refuse to stock the product then there is evidence of scaling back production and Factory Direct kinds of sales.

I would suggest that NH Guilds are selling quite well because the current production has not ramped up to the point where it has eliminated backlog, let alone met demand. I base that on statements made at LMG 2010 by the production manager and others that talk about increasing production of Guilds in NH. I base that on the number of dealers who are willing to order NH Guilds but don't necessarily have any in stock. I believe my own SWAGs that suggest until production ramps up, the dealer network gets trimmed or both, a typical dealer will see on average 3 or 4 NH Guilds per year.

Now whether this is a good thing, a bad thing, something to be accepted or something to be changed probably depends upon which side of the Great Divide you rest on. But if we are talking facts there are probably some nuances to be considered. It is certainly true that Guild is not selling 10,000 NH guitars a year at present but the reason for that is that they are not making 10,000 NH guitars a year at present.

So just what is not selling?

:wink:

Edit: Typo'd "new" when I meant "used"

 

[onewilyfool]

B-street Music has some very nice NOS Guilds at their store in San Mateo, CA. Carona and Tacoma Guilds, brand new, with warranties.....go figure

 

[guildzilla]

And that raises another aspect of the issue. Until most of the Tacoma NOS Guild guitars are sold, it will be difficult for FMIC, its Guild dealers, and folks like us to assess the progress/demand/sales of New Hartford guitars.

I think it will be two more years before we really can "go figure."

 

[West R Lee]

Hey Frono, I'm merely repeating what I was told yesterday by a very reputable dealer who described himself as a Guild dealer.

Let me also add that the reason I was seeking the man, and his opinion was because I was interested. I wasn't interested so that I might shoot the brand in the foot, I was interested so that I might inspect and play a few with the thought of buying one in the back of my mind.

I personally found the results of the discussion with the man to be a bit depressing. Take it for what it's worth.

West

 

[twocorgis]

Let me also add that the reason I was seeking the man, and his opinion was because I was interested. I wasn't interested so that I might shoot the brand in the foot, I was interested so that I might inspect and play a few with the thought of buying one in the back of my mind.
West

You can buy my NH D40 West! Heck, you can even send it back if you don't like it, and we won't even make you change your nick. :wink:

 

[West R Lee]

Let me also add that the reason I was seeking the man, and his opinion was because I was interested. I wasn't interested so that I might shoot the brand in the foot, I was interested so that I might inspect and play a few with the thought of buying one in the back of my mind.
West

You can buy my NH D40 West! Heck, you can even send it back if you don't like it, and we won't even make you change your nick. :wink:

:lol: Sorry Two, but I'm a rosewood guy.

West

 

[taabru45]

You'd like mine..........now.... :wink: :lol: Steffan

 

[twocorgis]

:lol: Sorry Two, but I'm a rosewood guy.

West

I used to feel that way too Jim, but then I stumbled into some amazing hogs. They each have their merits.

 

[bluesypicky]

I used to feel that way too Jim, but then I stumbled into some amazing hogs. They each have their merits.

Absolutely.
I used to be an "all hog" kinda guy, that's until I met my DV 52.... :wink:
And then again, I have a maple queen that doesn't sound too shaby either! :lol:
As our (now famous) generous friend would put it: "It's all good." 8)

 

[West R Lee]

Welp, if you look at my signature, I've got a mahogany guitar, and a few maples, and some rosewoods. The rosewoods are my favorites. But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa. The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:

West

 

[bluesypicky]

But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa.
West

I had ruled koa out after being very disapointed by the sound of the ones I tried, of various brands, and then upon a visit to our own Dave (dapmdave), I had a shock when I briefly picked his Taylor (or ex-Taylor I should say ), it was powerful and with a beautiful crystally voice.....
Moral of the story: Don't rule anything out.

The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:
West

and I'm on the same boat here.... I have a feeling those guitars sound as good as they look, but out of my financial league by a few strokes!!!

 

[jgwoods]

But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa.
West

I had ruled koa out after being very disapointed by the sound of the ones I tried, of various brands, and then upon a visit to our own Dave (dapmdave), I had a shock when I briefly picked his Taylor (or ex-Taylor I should say ), it was powerful and with a beautiful crystally voice.....
Moral of the story: Don't rule anything out.
[quote="West R Lee":rwcie6sh] The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:
West

and I'm on the same boat here.... I have a feeling those guitars sound as good as they look, but out of my financial league by a few strokes!!![/quote:rwcie6sh]

My GSR 40 model was priced the same as the GSR -50 but I got it for $2350, well below the MAP $3400.
If you see one you like make an offer.
My take on it is this- these are tough times in the instrument biz and everyone is dealing. Dealers have cut back on stock, prices are very negotiable, the economy sucks and there are few who can afford a nice guitar. It doesn't bode well for any of the American makers of fine steel string guitars. The business model they use is going to be very important going forward. Some will survive, some may not. I root for all of them, put my money on a Guild.

 

[fronobulax]

Hey Frono, I'm merely repeating what I was told yesterday by a very reputable dealer who described himself as a Guild dealer.

As I reread what you actually quoted perhaps I could rephrase the question as "why is a dealer who has not stocked Guilds since 1995 (be self admission) considered an informed or reliable source about whether NH Guilds are selling, or not?"

 

[West R Lee]

But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa.
West

I had ruled koa out after being very disapointed by the sound of the ones I tried, of various brands, and then upon a visit to our own Dave (dapmdave), I had a shock when I briefly picked his Taylor (or ex-Taylor I should say ), it was powerful and with a beautiful crystally voice.....
Moral of the story: Don't rule anything out.

http://www.williesguitars.com/index.cfm ... /6/image/2[/url]

West

 

[Ridgemont]

I don't remember him saying Fender era Westerlys are universally flawless, only that some of the best Guilds ever made were Fender-era Westerlys.

If it is only "some of the best" that were Fender-era Westerlys, then shouldn't we all agree? My point being that other great Guilds came out of the other 30 years at Westerly and other great Guilds came out of Hoboken, Corona, Tacoma, and New Hampshire. If we are not dealing with absolutes such as Westerly was the best or the worst, then I think it would be safe to say that every factory in every time period put out some junk as well as some great stuff.

It's a nit-pick, but a neck could get whacked by being stuck in the case with a loose truss and over-tensioned heavy gauge strings for 5 years and look good because it spent all that time in a case. It's just another possibility which you'll probably never be able to figure out. It's one of the reasons I like to buy new, I'll always know exactly what the guitar's history is. Your primary point is valid: a few turkeys made it out of Westerly, no doubt.

You have a point here Al. Unfortunately, I am not the first owner and I can only speculate as to what happened to the guitar for the first 12 years of its life. All I can really say is that I bought a guitar in great condition that has a shot neck. How that neck got there is anyones guess.

 

[FNG]

Hey West...call Willies and make them an offer of 26 or 2700 bucks. You big chicken. 8) 8) :lol:

 

[West R Lee]

Hey West...call Willies and make them an offer of 26 or 2700 bucks. You big chicken. 8) 8) :lol:

Then I might have to buy it....are you crazy! Actually, it had crossed my mind, unless one of these guys beats me to it. Fact is, I'd need to sell a few of my others first, and I'm in no hurry to do that.

West

 

[Ridgemont]

Welp, if you look at my signature, I've got a mahogany guitar, and a few maples, and some rosewoods. The rosewoods are my favorites. But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa. The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:

West

Is it just me or is the GSR F50 harder to find than the GSR F40 and F30? None on ebay and the only shop I could find was Willies.

 

[twocorgis]

Welp, if you look at my signature, I've got a mahogany guitar, and a few maples, and some rosewoods. The rosewoods are my favorites. But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa. The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:

West

Is it just me or is the GSR F50 harder to find than the GSR F40 and F30? None on ebay and the only shop I could find was Willies.

There's another one at Wolfe Guitars in Jupiter FL. Price says "Call". Call 'em up and offer them $2400; you've got nothing to lose (except $2400 :lol: ), and they've been sitting on that guitar for a long time.

 

[West R Lee]

Welp, if you look at my signature, I've got a mahogany guitar, and a few maples, and some rosewoods. The rosewoods are my favorites. But if you really want to know the truth, what I'd like to try is a koa. The GSR 50 really appeals to me, but not at $3400! :shock: :shock:

West

Is it just me or is the GSR F50 harder to find than the GSR F40 and F30? None on ebay and the only shop I could find was Willies.

Not sure Ridge. I think they built, or are building 20 of each GSR model. One of the more astute New Hartford followers may want to chime in, but that was my understanding.

West