my top 5 rock drummers laughable?

[capnjuan]

Rolling Stone's Top 100 Drummers list.

There's just one ... Ginger Baker :wink:

 

[fronobulax]

1) whoever I am playing with just as long as s/he makes me sound better than I am.
2) Spencer Dryden
3), 4) and 5) Anyone who played with Zappa through the '70's and 80's

Honorable mention for percussionist Ruth Underwood.

 

[CA-35]

Frono; Any truth to the party goers statement that you bass players know a good drummer when you hear one?

 

[fronobulax]

Frono; Any truth to the party goers statement that you bass players know a good drummer when you hear one?

Yes, subject to the caveat that calling me a bass player is like calling A 1985 Yugo a car. The bass and drums are the rhythm section and when the two play together - feeling the same groove, as it were, there is a firm foundation for everyone else. After a while you know who you "groove" well with and who you don't. When people compare notes, often the same names come up...

 

[idealassets]

Frono,
I was going to mention (the late) Spencer Dryden. He and Ginger Baker were not my favorite drummers, but very innovative. I believe that Spencer, Jack Casidy, and Paukl Kantner were an inseparable rhythm section. Then just add Jorma & the vocals, what a sound!

CA35- are you a drummer?

CG

 

[CA-35]

Re;

CA35- are you a drummer?

No. Just a terrible guitar player with outstanding guitars.

 

[idealassets]

No. Just a terrible guitar player with outstanding guitars.

I find it intersting that you play acoustic guitar, but get into drumming styles. It is sometimes more difficult to play a James Taylor or Cat Stevens backup on drums than it is to just let it rip on some Jeff Beck or ZZ Top stuff.

Craig

 

[CA-35]

Re;

you play acoustic guitar

Use that term "play" sparingly. I have an acute ear and enjoy almost all styles of music, but my musical skills are limited and lacking. You might be surprised to learn that the sound I love the most is from an oboe. I'll take a Mozart Oboe concerto over anything.

My knowledge of guitars, and music, grows everyday. Sadly, my playing ability does not.

 

[jte]

I'm a bass player so my take is that good drummers are about the song, not the instrument. My top five are:

Al Jackson (Booker T. & The M.G.'s) Only do a fill when the SONG calls for it, not just because it's been four measures since you played a fill.

Ginger Baker (Cream, but so much more!!) Yeah, he's sorta the opposite of Al Jackson to some people, but he's simply the most MUSICAL drummer ever. His trio album with Charlie Hadden and Bill Frissell is a treasure. He's busy sure, but that's not the point. The point is that he's always LISTENING to the rest of the band and having a musical discussion with them, not just playing a steady background- he's actively involved with the music.

Steve Gadd Sure he's responsible for all those clowns who tried to nail "50 Ways To Leave Your Lover", but he's so perfect for so many different music. He again is a drummer who's listening to all the music and working to make it all sound good, not just the drum part. Check out Clapton's "One More Car, One More Rider" live DVD for some wonderful drumming from Gadd.

Hal Blaine He's the one who made all those session tracks come alive. Huge impact on how pop music sounds

Russ Kunkle Just because a huge part of my music education included listening to Jackson Browne, Carol King, James Taylor, Crosby & Nash, etc. for whom The Section (Kunkle, Leland Sklar on bass, Danny Kortchmar on guitar, and Craig Doerge on keys) were the session and road band backing them. It's in my DNA now.

I also gotta respect Ringo Starr. I had a buddy who when auditioning drummers would always ask them "Is Ringo a genius or an idiot?". Invariably the drummers who really understood playing drums in a gigging band never answered "idiot" (actually the best answer was they guy who said "Well, he was a genius for really understanding what those songs needed and having the restraint to never assert himself in it, but he was an idiot for never really trying to be a better physical drummer."

John

 

[jte]

And a more (to me anyway) interesting spin off of this is top five rhythm sections. A great bassist and a great drummer can get together and not be a great section, even if it is very very good. So my favorite rhythm sections are:

Duck Dunn and Al Jackson Booker T & The MGs. Same as my comments on Al Jackson in the previous post.

Charlie Watts and Bill Wyman Neither are my particular favorites by themselves, but together they defined the sloppy yet tight Stones' Rock 'n' Roll sound. They could tell telepathically when Keith was going to drop a beat and they were right there all the time. Bottom line is that it just feels right when they played together.

Jerry Jemmott and Herbie Lovell They were the section on a good bit of NY soul sessions (some Aretha, etc.) but their shining moment is B. B. King's "Completely Well". They support, encourage, and drive King to deliver some of his finest moments. Never lockstep, but a magical connection between the two that makes the music come alive.

Francis "Rocco" Prestia and David Garibaldi Tower of Power. Just listen to "What Is Hip".

Emory Gordy Jr. and John WareThey were in Elvis' TCB band, which became Gram Parson's band for "Grievous Angel" which became Emmylou Harris' Hot Band. When I started playing bass the first good band I was in did a LOT of Emmylou's songs so again these guys got into my musical DNA. They always had great SOUND on the recordings, they played interesting stuff without drawing attention away from the lyrics and Harris' deliver, and always, always made the SONG king.

John

 

[idealassets]

Drummers added by "most intersting" categoty:

1. Buddy Miles (Electric flag, with his hand painted stars and stripes on Ludwig drums c.1968)
2. Corky Laing (Mountain, very flashy, "gimme more cowbell", innovative dbl bass, and wierd dual timbale mounted "toms")
3. Danny Seraphine (Chicago, nice mahogany Ludwig drums, very classy solos and mini-solos)
4. John Guerin (Joni Mitchell & LA Express, smooth with unbelievable technique)
5. Ginger Baker (Cream, wierd 2-story cymbols geared up on the basic 60's Ludwig cymbol stands c.1967)
6. Paul Whaley (Blue Cheer, very unusual, every cymbol moving at all times from being thrashed)
7. John Bonham (Zeppelin, heavy licks, gotta love him even if you didn't really like him, he certainly "fit" for the Zeppelin sound)
8. Ron Tutt (Gram Parsons/ Jerry Garcia Band, played accents the likes of which I never heard before)

Most of the current drummers may be "good" or hard driving, but with nowhere near the talent and innovataion as the earlier era rock drummers.

Craig

 

[idealassets]

And a more (to me anyway) interesting spin off of this is top five rhythm sections.

I did like Emory Gordy Jr & John Ware. They did what was just right to backup Emmylou Harris.

For an alternative rhythm section, the combination of Noel Redding holding the timing on bass, while Mitch Mitchell accented Hendrix's guitar was very counter-intuitive, but effective.

Other examples are Billy Cobham and Elvin Jones who were the featured instrument of thier band. I didn't really like Cobham or Jones, especially when Billy Cobham was the drummer for "Bobby and the Midnights", Bob Weirs band. He didn't fit in at all, and was quite a strange sideshow.

CG

 

[fronobulax]

Most of the current drummers may be "good" or hard driving, but with nowhere near the talent and innovataion as the earlier era rock drummers.

Craig

First person to do it is the innovator. Everybody else is a copycat or "influenced by". No surprise that most of the innovation occurred in the 70's and early '70's. That said, there is lots of innovation on all instruments in today's music. It's just that folks like me, who are comfortable with the music of our youth, have to seek out the innovative material and too often we don't bother.

 

[CA-35]

Hey jte;

Russ Kunkle Just because a huge part of my music education included listening to Jackson Browne, Carol King, James Taylor, Crosby & Nash, etc. for whom The Section (Kunkle, Leland Sklar on bass, Danny Kortchmar on guitar, and Craig Doerge on keys) were the session and road band backing them. It's in my DNA now.

Ten-hut...there's an officer on deck! When does the book come out? You are spot on with the examples.

I completely forgot about Russ. Nobody mentioned Levon Helm either.

 

[Ross]

I must put in a good word for the drummers in the "Funk Brothers" - the house band for Motown Records. Like Ringo, they played the right licks at the right time. The film "Standing in the shadows of Motown" has a good section on the drummers.

Veer - one of my favourite films is "Hard Core Logo". It's a mockumentary in the "Spinal Tap" vein, about a Vancouver punk band on a last, disastrous, road trip. Bernie Coulson, the actor who played the band's drummer, is a standout, not only for his percussion prowess, but because he steals every scene that he's in. :lol:

 

[jte]

I must put in a good word for the drummers in the "Funk Brothers" - the house band for Motown Records. Like Ringo, they played the right licks at the right time. The film "Standing in the shadows of Motown" has a good section on the drummers.

Yeah, I felt bad about leaving out Jamerson/et. al., but part of it is that Jamerson (the Motown bassist on most of the stuff recorded in Detroit, and simply put, the man who totally changed the way electric bass was perceived by both the music industry AND the general listening public) was a force all on his own, and because there were several Motown drummers- Benny Benjamin, and later "Pistol" Pete Allen, and others. Sometimes several drummers, plus the percussion. So, the the whole Motown thing for rhythm sections is really a whole group of folks. Heck, Joe Messina functioned most of the time as a snare drum, even if the instrument was a Telecaster with a Jazzmaster neck!!

John

 

[walrus]

One of the best things about the Beatles catalog being remastered recently was the clarity of the bass and drums. McCartney is rightly considered a great bass player, but Ringo also really shines if you listen closely. As many of you said, perfect for the song they were recording. His fills on songs like "Rain", and "Strawberry Fields" fit the songs perfectly. If you don't want to give him credit for "inventing" fills, you have to admit he was a master of them.

Geoff Emerick should also get some credit for the revolutionary way he recorded Ringo's drums - it is one of the reasons they sound so good. His biography, "Here, There, and Everywhere" is a great read.

Much like LTGers have said in other threads that George's playing and solos were perfect for each song ("tasteful", etc.), Ringo's drumming is in the same league. The Beatles were first and foremost a *band*, playing whatever was best for the *song*. And what a catalog of songs they recorded!

walrus

 

[idealassets]

I completely forgot about Russ. Nobody mentioned Levon Helm either.

Absolutely, so many drummers, where to start, where to start? Russ Kunkle was the exact fit for Jackson Browne and The Section. Levon Helm, how about that early Dylan work?

Here's a few more to consider:
1. Levon Helm (Cool antique 1930's Ludwig drum kit. Also sang lead on many songs for the band).
2. Kenny Jones (Small Faces/ Rod Stewart drummer, how about the recording studio phaser on the drums for "Icheekoo Park"? c.1967.
3. Liberty DeVitto (Billy Joel drummer, -remember the lead to the song "Only the Good Die Young" started with a drum solo intro.
4. John Densmore (Doors drummer, using marching band snare drum style on many songs)
5. Pep Perrine (Bob Seger's first drummer 1965-1970: he had round ducts making his double basses about 3 feet longer, and then had 2 bass drums mounted on poles facing sideways at his shoulders with round duct that warapped around with a 90 degree bend, which directed the sound to the crowd. He played 4 bass drums at once for the beat of "Rambling Gamblin Man" in 1968, -this was defiately a case of "you had to be there".)

For today's drummers I like the drummer in The Wallflowers, REM, and drummer for Sheryl Crow. Maybe for now I'm all out of drum lore.

Craig

 

[adorshki]

Other examples are Billy Cobham and Elvin Jones who were the featured instrument of thier band. I didn't really like Cobham or Jones, especially when Billy Cobham was the drummer for "Bobby and the Midnights", Bob Weirs band. He didn't fit in at all, and was quite a strange sideshow.
CG

I like Elvin more than Cobham, but I was introduced to him as a member of the John Coltrane Quartet, "A Love Supreme". Definitely NOT the FOCUS in that group, and VERY VERY tight with Jimmy Garrison on bass.
Agree with the Ginger Baker votes, one of my all-time favorites.
Ringo was great. The solo from"The End" on second side of Abbey Road. Hard rock creds satisfied, 'nuff said.
Dryden with Airplane: "She Has Funny Cars". One of the all time great floor tom riffs, even if it was lifted from Krupa's in "Sing Sing Sing".
Speaking of which, no one's mentioned him (Krupa) or Joe Morello yet.
Non-medicinal brownie points for the first guy to figure out what Joe Morello did.

 

[CA-35]

Dude it's the google age....please. You mean this Joe Morello

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/14/a...mer-with-dave-brubeck-quartet-dies-at-82.html

You get an atta boy anyway. How about this

According to a biography on his Web site, Mr. Morello gave up the violin for drums at 15, after meeting his idol, the violinist Jascha Heifetz.

I guess you meet Jascha and figure your'e never gonna be better than this guy....so I better find something I can at least get honorable mention with.