JS 2 bass bridge saddle, scale length, strings?

[Jstwo61]

Sort of a veer here, but this is probably the best recording I have of my Mustang bass (with Bisonic and Dimarzio Model One combo). It's an instrumental track that my buddy Devon and I wrote and recorded for a college project. You can really hear that nice throaty chuggy sound. Flatwound strings of course.

Loving that, sounds great !!!...

 

[Guildedagain]

Sitar?

 

[mellowgerman]

Sitar?

Yup, I played sitar for 4 years or so. This was early when I was still getting my bearings, but it was adequate for a little intro on a recording. A year or two later I could sit in on acoustic folky jams which was really fun and I miss it. Sold my last one in 2013 in Nashville, when I joined up with a touring group as bassist. They're big and fragile and I knew I'd be moving around quite a bit and wouldn't have much time to play anyway. I fully intend to pick up another one when I see a good deal locally.

 

[Guildedagain]

Always wanted one. Had an ultra rare Ron Sargent Dano type guitar that was made to sound like a sitar. Sold it 15 years ago probably, and I still regret it.

Really cool tune, a little whiff of Jefferson Airplane here and there ;]

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Never owned a Dano/Coral Sitar, but my first electric guitar (about 1967-8) was Coral Firefly like this one:



Maybe that's part of why, for me, holding a Starfire Bass body feels like "going home".

 

[Guildedagain]

Coral guitars are too cool.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

 

[lungimsam]

Columbia music studios (Bruce Casteel) in columbia, MD, used to have custom made sitar bridges for their bass and 8-string guitar conversions. Fantastic sound.

 

[Guildedagain]

Dano makes a Sitar pedal. I wouldn't mind modding one of my too many guitars to sound like a sitar. It's all in the bridge.

 

[Jstwo61]

Festive greetings guys...I now have my Jetstar up and running and just wanted to pass on a couple of observations that may be of use to someone in the future possibly.
Firstly, and this may not be on all JS bridges, but I found the saddle on the low E to be smaller in length and height than the saddles on the A and D. I don't have an original G saddle so don't know if that is smaller too. I presume that could be a design feature to follow the fretboard profile?.
E Saddle 17.68mm long, 9.32mm high.
A & D Saddles 18.10mm long, 11.4mm high

The saddle screws that hold the arm in place (machine screws) have a thread width of 0.100 inches. I have been unable as yet to find a perfect replacement for the two I am missing but an M3 holds the position and stops the arm moving. I want to try an M2.5 when I can find one. I think the originals are either of American of Swedish origin.

Lastly, I wanted to get a really low playing action and when I got the neck where I was happy, it was still around 5-6mm at the 12th fret. So I decided to have smaller 3D printed versions made of the saddles. The saddle arm comes up 5mm but working in plastic meant I could reduce the height at that centre point with out fear of the saddle splitting had it been made in wood. I reduced the height to 8mm and the length to 17.5mm. I kept the width the same. I then filed the string grooves in the plastic saddles to get a snug fit. The action at the 12th is now 3mm.
I am aware they are not rosewood and that can be looked at going forward but experimenting in this way has got the bass playing really fluid and tight. The slightly reduced width of the combined four saddles, spaces the strings nicely and they lineup with the pickup poles too.

 

[lungimsam]

I don;t have a JS, but my wood saddles on my NS Starfire I bass had the e and g saddles shorter than the a and d, too. Most likely to keep with board radius.
I got brass saddles that were all the same height on it now and, when I play, I can feel that the g bridge needs to be shortened. Haven't done it yet. But I guess a few strokes of a .040 file in the saddle string slot will get it there.

Gorgeous bass! Thanks for the update.
Please upload some sound clips if you can sometime. Preferably isolated.

PS- my low e bows out like that too before it meets the bridge.
PPS- if you like the tone of the plastic just use it. IIRC some of the earliest Guild basses used plastic saddles, so not unworthy of the instrument if Guild saw fit to use it. Historians can chime in on the plastic bridges, but I remember reading of early basses with plastic. But others can confirm.

 

[fronobulax]

BA-297

Black plastic saddles. If you have looked at enough pictures you can tell the difference between black plastic and wooden. If you agree with me then here is an example. If you feel like discussing then fine, but my only point is to confirm @mellowgerman 's recollection that the earliest saddles were plastic.

 

[Jstwo61]

I don;t have a JS, but my wood saddles on my NS Starfire I bass had the e and g saddles shorter than the a and d, too. Most likely to keep with board radius.
I got brass saddles that were all the same height on it now and, when I play, I can feel that the g bridge needs to be shortened. Haven't done it yet. But I guess a few strokes of a .040 file in the saddle string slot will get it there.

Gorgeous bass! Thanks for the update.
Please upload some sound clips if you can sometime. Preferably isolated.

PS- my low e bows out like that too before it meets the bridge.
PPS- if you like the tone of the plastic just use it. IIRC some of the earliest Guild basses used plastic saddles, so not unworthy of the instrument if Guild saw fit to use it. Historians can chime in on the plastic bridges, but I remember reading of early basses with plastic. But others can confirm.

Thank you for confirming the E and G saddles on your Starfire follow suit, it certainly feels right working to the radius. I'm really happy with the tone thanks> Need to play the bass at stage volume now with a drummer to fine tune what works/cuts etc but I'm really impressed with the range and especially the bridge pickup and middle position. I'll try and send some tone samples when I can.

Did you have the brass saddles on your Starfire custom made? and was that for tone and sustain?
All the best

 

[Jstwo61]

BA-297

Black plastic saddles. If you have looked at enough pictures you can tell the difference between black plastic and wooden. If you agree with me then here is an example. If you feel like discussing then fine, but my only point is to confirm @mellowgerman 's recollection that the earliest saddles were plastic.

Hi Frono, thanks for sharing the bridge shot, they look like the bakelite saddles. What bass is this in the photo please?

 

[fronobulax]

Hi Frono, thanks for sharing the bridge shot, they look like the bakelite saddles. What bass is this in the photo please?

BA-279 which dates to 1966. Bakelite was the first synthetic plastic and I just say "plastic" rather than try and refine the term based upon my ignorance That is one of the non-Bisonic PUs Guild used briefly. Someone else can name it since I am unlikely to do so correctly by memory.

When I was young and foolish and believed that Guild serial numbers were chronological and that features were introduced at specific times, I collected photos that I thought might tell me when the bridge changed from straight to harp, when the tone switch was introduced and whether they were always seen together. While the answer is usually together and since mid-1967 there are exceptions to any general statement I would make

 

[Jstwo61]

BA-279 which dates to 1966. Bakelite was the first synthetic plastic and I just say "plastic" rather than try and refine the term based upon my ignorance That is one of the non-Bisonic PUs Guild used briefly. Someone else can name it since I am unlikely to do so correctly by memory.

When I was young and foolish and believed that Guild serial numbers were chronological and that features were introduced at specific times, I collected photos that I thought might tell me when the bridge changed from straight to harp, when the tone switch was introduced and whether they were always seen together. While the answer is usually together and since mid-1967 there are exceptions to any general statement I would make

That pickup looks great, you can almost hear the tone, woody, acoustic, warm. Congratulations on being the basses guardian.

 

[mellowgerman]

BA-297

Black plastic saddles. If you have looked at enough pictures you can tell the difference between black plastic and wooden. If you agree with me then here is an example. If you feel like discussing then fine, but my only point is to confirm @mellowgerman 's recollection that the earliest saddles were plastic.

My early '66 Starfire had original hard black plastic saddles. That bass sounded fantastic by the way and I would see no reason to "upgrade" them, regardless of whatever negative connotation the idea of a plastic bridge saddle might invoke in people. I also think the rosewood saddles sound fantastic and see no reason to upgrade those. Of course, different strokes for different folks.

 

[lungimsam]

[QUOTE
Did you have the brass saddles on your Starfire custom made? and was that for tone and sustain?
All the best
[/QUOTE]

My original wooden set's low E developed a crack. There used to be a guy online who made brass bridges for guild basses. He was/is on this forum. Ordered them from his website. But I think he stopped making them now.
So I got the bridges hoping they would sound better and not break like the wood. I like them better than the wood. Seemed to make the "voice" of the bass "older" sounding. Don't know how to describe it but more like a grandpa and less like a 20-something person's voice. More age/character to the sound. Subtle but an improvement.
If he starts making them again I highly recommend them.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

I bought some of those brass saddles as well. Can't recall the guy's screen name, but he lived in Alaska.

After a search, edited to add: his screen name was/is "peteybass". He made his last run of brass saddles in 2016. Don't think he's posted here in quite some time.

 

[fronobulax]

I bought some of those brass saddles as well. Can't recall the guy's screen name, but he lived in Alaska.

After a search, edited to add: his screen name was/is "peteybass". He made his last run of brass saddles in 2016. Don't think he's posted here in quite some time.

It makes me sad when it is clear that people don't read or remember what I post. Then I feel less sad because I do remember that not everybody reads everything on LTG so it isn't just me.

But here is what I said at https://letstalkguild.com/ltg/index.php?threads/starfire-bass-pre-1970.205448/#post-1920564

An LTG member, peteybass, was once in the business of making saddles. He offered a variety of materials and notched and unnotched versions. His website www.guildbassparts.com is no longer active.

A sample page https://web.archive.org/web/2016101...assparts.com/www.guildbassparts.com/Home.html

My recollection is that he made a big deal that the saddles were not exactly the same across all iterations of the bridge and associated basses. I remember that since it isn't my experience.

He hasn't been around recently but if you were motivated enough you could probably track him down and he probably has some saddles. Maybe he will even share why he closed the business. His prices were higher than I wanted to pay for backups or an experiment on my part.

The only saddle I have that split seems to have done so because of downward pressure from the string. I think there was room at the top of the slider and the string pressure could push the sides of the saddle at the base of the slider apart. My first guess to prevent that would be to have the notch for the slider as short as possible.

I will add that I can no longer find PeteyBass's account in a Member search so it seems to be in some kind of limbo. None of the member searches bring up his name, yet I can view his profile. @GAD ?

PeteyBass

letstalkguild.com

He last posted and visited in 2018.

Maybe someone who is not me will see if they can track him down and ask if he has saddles lying around. I didn't buy any before but I might try the brass if he has new old stock.