Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
Looking for an entry level instrument.
WTB Starfire Bass pre 1970
- Thread starter Guildedagain
- Start date
Wanted to Buy
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
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Elaborate, please. Is entry level a perhaps unrealistic expectation of a low price? Does it mean cosmetics and originality don't matter much? Since you say pre-1970 perhaps you want and original Bisonic or would you accept one of the early ones with different pickups or non-factory PUs? Do you want the Bisonic suck circuit (which is really a transformer and not really comparable to the JS deep/hard switch) intact or was it never there (which means '67 or earlier). Starfire I with the sweet spot bridge PU ('65 or '66) or the neck pickup ('66-'77 although SF I's are scarcer after ;68 or so) or a Starfire II?
Looking at and filtering at Reverb shows one instrument for about$1,800 but it has Gibson PUs, a $2,000 Starfire I that was converted to a lefty and restored and everything else is $2,500-$3,000. Admittedly asking prices but the lower your budget is from $3000 the more patience I would advise you to have.
Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
For tonal reasons I am drawn to the sweet spot Starfire I.
No pickup mods, I prefer originality but I can overlook cosmetic issues.
Patience for sure. The only way I can justify is if the bass is outstanding.
No pickup mods, I prefer originality but I can overlook cosmetic issues.
Patience for sure. The only way I can justify is if the bass is outstanding.
mavuser
Enlightened Member
if u are looking for a bridge position SF-1 you are looking for 1965 or 1966 only.
if u are interested in a 1967 SF-1 neck position, message me, and I will let you know of 2-3 available. good luck!
if u are interested in a 1967 SF-1 neck position, message me, and I will let you know of 2-3 available. good luck!
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
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That means Starfire I 1966 or earlier. Presumably Bisonic since basses like BA-297 (below) exist and are believed to be factory. Tone switch is not an issue because they are mid-'67. You may have a choice between maple and mahogany which is often a choice between sunburst and cherry.
Only Bisonic sweet spot on Reverb now is $2850 OBO
Guild Starfire Bass Sunburst 1965 | Reverb
In production from 1965 to 1975, the Guild Starfire Bass was introduced as bass counterpart to Guild's semi-hollowbody Starfire guitar. Upon its debut, the Starfire Bass sported a single-coil pickup produced by Hagstrom, though later a dual pickup version would be introduced as the Starfire Bass ...
reverb.com
Looks like it has black plastic saddles. In the wrong mood I could quibble with the description. In the right mood I'd be on the phone since my limited experience with a '66 sweet spot sunburst suggests it would, in some sense, be an upgrade from my '67.
Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
Yes, cherry for me.
One will pop up. I'd prefer a full sized Bisonic.
Plastic saddles? They do look like black plastic.
Are there any saddles available, beyond used?
One will pop up. I'd prefer a full sized Bisonic.
Plastic saddles? They do look like black plastic.
Are there any saddles available, beyond used?
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
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I know of no object that I would describe as a non-full sized Bisonic. Would you be referring to one of the other Hagstroms that appeared in Guilds before 1967 or so? I guess I've heard those called pre-sonics but the name clearly has not caught on.
My recollection is that by BA-350 the plastic saddles had been replaced with with wooden.
I'll repeat a recent answer that I thought you had seen since you almost immediately posted about looking for a saddle.
You can get saddles from Guild packaged with a bridge for about $50. If you don't want the bridge I'll be a Guild Authorized Repair shop would be able to get parts. What may be missing is that AFAIK the saddles for my Newark Street (which Guild is selling), '67 Starfire and '71 JS are interchangeable. I will confirm that next time I change strings or adjust intonation but don't hold your breath.
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
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My records are in disarray but I just discovered BA-113 was also on Reverb in July 2020, same price and seller.
Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
Interesting BA113, my F112 is OA113.
I forgot about the factory bridge. Yes, I almost bought it direct from Guild but found the original saddle instead.
I'd be interested to see the difference between old and new Hagstrom bridge, and rosewood saddles.
Yes, on the pickup I misspoke, I meant to say a Bisonic, not the smaller pickup. There is a fantastic Starfire with smaller pickup that popped up somewhere, I'll see if I can find it.
I forgot about the factory bridge. Yes, I almost bought it direct from Guild but found the original saddle instead.
I'd be interested to see the difference between old and new Hagstrom bridge, and rosewood saddles.
Yes, on the pickup I misspoke, I meant to say a Bisonic, not the smaller pickup. There is a fantastic Starfire with smaller pickup that popped up somewhere, I'll see if I can find it.
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
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Do you play the lottery?
I seem to recall that the NS bridge is not a drop in replacement for a vintage ('60's-'70's) bridges. Mounting screw holes are off. Search Bass if you need something more reliable than my memory.
I have not seen any difference in saddles when inspecting them in place. I might notice something if I took them off the bass.
Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
Seems like there's a lucrative Starfire bass saddle business waiting to happen. Rosewood, Maple, Ebony, bone, brass, graphite, aluminum and more.
I see a few basses out there with really goofed up saddles. Like the one that was a Lefty then back to normal with all the extra strap button holes, the saddles on it are pretty chewed up.
I felt so fortunate to get an original saddle from Ray Bowen60, it was a touch darker than mine so I removed and very lightly oiled mine to match, a fantastic match. I wouldn't expect a new saddle to be a great match to the old Rosewood. I'd have to say it's probably Brazilian, it's very nice.
The reason the saddle was gone I theorize is that it got broken from an impact that bent the slider past 90º towards the adjusting screw. It was somewhat visibly bent down and the only way I could get the new saddle to sit flat on the bridge like the others was to take a 10" crescent wrench with appropriately wide jaws and bend the slider back to straight, carefully. You have to go past straight a touch because the steel is springy. Great steel, did it with ease.
I'm very impressed with this bridge design. The ease of adjusting intonation is unmatched by anything else I know of. I like the old timey pan head screws. Undo screw, lift slightly loosened string, slide saddle, tighten screw, done. Also the ease of centering the strings, moving all strings from side to side at the same time is unmatched.
If only they made this bridge for guitar.
I see a few basses out there with really goofed up saddles. Like the one that was a Lefty then back to normal with all the extra strap button holes, the saddles on it are pretty chewed up.
I felt so fortunate to get an original saddle from Ray Bowen60, it was a touch darker than mine so I removed and very lightly oiled mine to match, a fantastic match. I wouldn't expect a new saddle to be a great match to the old Rosewood. I'd have to say it's probably Brazilian, it's very nice.
The reason the saddle was gone I theorize is that it got broken from an impact that bent the slider past 90º towards the adjusting screw. It was somewhat visibly bent down and the only way I could get the new saddle to sit flat on the bridge like the others was to take a 10" crescent wrench with appropriately wide jaws and bend the slider back to straight, carefully. You have to go past straight a touch because the steel is springy. Great steel, did it with ease.
I'm very impressed with this bridge design. The ease of adjusting intonation is unmatched by anything else I know of. I like the old timey pan head screws. Undo screw, lift slightly loosened string, slide saddle, tighten screw, done. Also the ease of centering the strings, moving all strings from side to side at the same time is unmatched.
If only they made this bridge for guitar.
Last edited:
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
- Joined
- May 3, 2007
- Messages
- 24,799
- Reaction score
- 8,931
- Location
- Central Virginia, USA
- Guild Total
- 5
An LTG member, peteybass, was once in the business of making saddles. He offered a variety of materials and notched and unnotched versions. His website www.guildbassparts.com is no longer active.
A sample page https://web.archive.org/web/2016101...assparts.com/www.guildbassparts.com/Home.html
My recollection is that he made a big deal that the saddles were not exactly the same across all iterations of the bridge and associated basses. I remember that since it isn't my experience.
He hasn't been around recently but if you were motivated enough you could probably track him down and he probably has some saddles. Maybe he will even share why he closed the business. His prices were higher than I wanted to pay for backups or an experiment on my part.
The only saddle I have that split seems to have done so because of downward pressure from the string. I think there was room at the top of the slider and the string pressure could push the sides of the saddle at the base of the slider apart. My first guess to prevent that would be to have the notch for the slider as short as possible.
A sample page https://web.archive.org/web/2016101...assparts.com/www.guildbassparts.com/Home.html
My recollection is that he made a big deal that the saddles were not exactly the same across all iterations of the bridge and associated basses. I remember that since it isn't my experience.
He hasn't been around recently but if you were motivated enough you could probably track him down and he probably has some saddles. Maybe he will even share why he closed the business. His prices were higher than I wanted to pay for backups or an experiment on my part.
The only saddle I have that split seems to have done so because of downward pressure from the string. I think there was room at the top of the slider and the string pressure could push the sides of the saddle at the base of the slider apart. My first guess to prevent that would be to have the notch for the slider as short as possible.
mavuser
Enlightened Member
Jacobs Custom Guitars has one right now. Red, mahogany, neck pickup, Bisonic, Hoboken, pre-suck switch. its nicer than anything on reverb right now, and i would best substantially less $$ (but I cannot speak for Jacobs). TwoCorgis used to own it. A+++ rated seller, and ultimate master Guild luthier. His shop is closed to the public right now. And he's so busy with repairs, he may not be bothering much with a big online sales push right now. i would give him a call and scoop that thing up! everything out of his shop is gold.
Guildedagain
Enlightened Member
Sounds like an awesome shop.