J55-12 thoughts and picture of the neck angle

[richt54]

You're welcome! I guess I missed that you got the guitar, must be in another thread (I'll see it if it is). Congrats!

And yes there isn't a whole lot out there on the JF55-12, even the catalogs favor its maple JF65-12 counterpart for pics.

But it does show up on a spec chart from a '98 Guild catalog:

Note one critical difference is the bracing, 12-ers got special "12-string" bracing to help deal with the extra top tension. Also those dual truss rods are to deal with the difference in torque from the treble to bass side of the fretboard and aren't necessarily meant to be equally adjusted, which is best left to somebody who really understands 'em, or at least grasps the concept.

'Hog is an exceedingly stable wood and I think that's why they introduced it on the 12-er necks right about that time.

The rosewood's better than 99% probability of being EIR but Guild always had excellent wood thanks to a guy named Willie:

Forum host GAD has extensive catalogs and price lists here: https://www.gad.net/Blog/guild-guitar-price-lists/

Hope it works out real nice for ya! And btw I think I've only ever plugged in my F65ce like 3 or 4 times in 20 years, myself....

PS just realized I said "saddle" a couple of times above when I meant "bridge", but I think you got it anyway.

Once again, very much appreciated. I didn’t realize that there were maple necks used. I had a D-55 made in Tacoma which I traded to get my Kerry Char J-45 clone. It had a solid mahogany neck as opposed to my New Hartford D-55 which is a 3 piece neck. My point is that according to the seller the 98’ JF55-12 has a stouter neck which was his main reason for selling it. I’m pretty sure I’ll be ok with a thicker neck. I understood you to mean the bridge. The repair shop that he used seemed very reputable. I plan to do a video to show all aspects of the guitar. I will tune it down one or two whole steps. That was a post purchase question I had for him as to whether he had tried it on the guitar. He did not because he didn’t play it much after he got it back. It’s supposed to arrive this Friday so I’ll let it sit and try it on Saturday. I’m hoping for a very loud jangle coming out of that big Jumbo box.

 

[West R Lee]

Yes it was owned by Fender from Nov. '95 to '14 (April IIRC?).

By '98 Fender had implemented QC checklists on the manufacturing line and was investing in revamping the brand, like bringing back electrics and starting the Nashville Custom shop. Morale was good and it showed in products like my '96 D25. You look inside it and there's nary a glue squeeze from the bracing or kerfing, all the seams are flush and perfectly tight, the fret ends line up perfectly beveled as you looked down the neck, little details like that.

I remember thinking to myself "Man they even made it spotless inside where hardly anybody ever looks, read between those lines....true pride in craftsmanship" (That was my first of 3 Guilds, all bought new)

One of our members who'd worked in Westerly at the time, Hideglue, made a statement that "QC reached its zenith under Fender". It caused a bit of argument when it was interpreted as meaning that those years produced "the best" guitars (although some of us did and still do do believe that, think @West R Lee still does).

Paul (Hideglue) had to take pains to explain that it was the checklist system that created high consistency and fewer "rejects" (which is what QC is all about), not that the guitars were necessarily "built better". They just formalized Guild's existing standards to ensure they got consistently applied.

Seeing the work that was done to that 12, I suspect something outside of normal wear and use may have caused that fretboard to come loose, but obviously somebody realized the instrument was worth fixing. Dealing with a fellow member also usually has pretty good results around here.

I used to think I'd prefer a "pristine" guitar but I've become more flexible. I get your desire to simply be sure you're getting good value for your hard earned money, and in the end only you can make that decision. I see this one as a "ready to play", no surprises since it's been gone over pretty thoroughly already. And yeah, lots of folks like their saddles a bit low, that's one reason the neck alignment check uses the top of the bridge. A low saddle and/or low action in and of themselves don't mean neck angle is bad. Only the alignment check will show if your geometry is good (and assuming bridge hasn't been shaved, although there are situations in which I'd even accept that as the most reasonable solution these days.)

FWIW I didn't think that saddle (oops, meant "bridge") has been shaved, looks pretty "fat" to me. And I judged the alignment of the straightedge in the pic by the fact you couldn't see any of it peeking out from under that obscuring string. It also looks nearly perfectly aligned with one of 'em on the top edge, so even allowing for slight angle-of-view distortion, that would indicate to me the ruler's hitting right at the top of the bridge or a few thousandths low maybe. I still think it's fine.

Good luck!

A bit a of a qualifier as to my opinion stated here. First, I've only played a handful of New Hartford guitars and that has always been in a music store, so I am not now, nor have I ever been qualified to comment on New Hartford built Guild guitars. If/when I was comparing late 90s-early 2000's Fender/Guild guitars to say Tacoma or Corona built Guilds, yes I do think the late Westerly built were superior. I wouldn't have a clue as to the quality, workmanship or tone of a Cordoba built Guild, I've never played one.

I did however play several new GAD guitars in Tyler at the Guitar Center and was somewhat pleasantly surprised. For $500-$700 guitars, I thought they sounded pretty good.

To be honest, with all that usually going on around me in a music store, and the short amount of time generally available in a music store, it's always been pretty hard for me to really make an accurate assessment in that environment. Sometimes it takes me months to really bond with a guitar, though there have been exceptions.

West

 

[adorshki]

Once again, very much appreciated. I didn’t realize that there were maple necks used. I had a D-55 made in Tacoma which I traded to get my Kerry Char J-45 clone. It had a solid mahogany neck as opposed to my New Hartford D-55 which is a 3 piece neck. My point is that according to the seller the 98’ JF55-12 has a stouter neck which was his main reason for selling it. I’m pretty sure I’ll be ok with a thicker neck. I understood you to mean the bridge. The repair shop that he used seemed very reputable. I plan to do a video to show all aspects of the guitar. I will tune it down one or two whole steps. That was a post purchase question I had for him as to whether he had tried it on the guitar. He did not because he didn’t play it much after he got it back. It’s supposed to arrive this Friday so I’ll let it sit and try it on Saturday. I’m hoping for a very loud jangle coming out of that big Jumbo box.

Actually the 512's originally had 3 (and 5?) pc rosewood necks (center strip(s) down the back is a stiffening lamination), the 412/JF6512 had 3-p maple and went 'hog also. "Thick necks" because they were kinda deep due to the dual trusses, but I've got relatively small hands and I could work with my buddy's JF30-12 ok. They went to a single truss ca '07 in Tacoma, it was simply implemented during production, but I think that's the reason some folks make a point of describing the necks as "thick" or "thin", and some folks definitely prefer the single-truss neck profile.

Did some experimentation with strings a few years back and counter-intuitively, tuning down a whole step and going to silk'n'steels (lighter tension materials) on my F65ce increased sustain and "rumble" markedly, at very little volume expense, but that model was built for lights (.010's) in the first pace, in fact the factory strings were basically the bass side of a 12-string set. (D'Addario EJ15 .010-.047 PB).

I think it'll sound lovely a whole step down, but suspect 2 steps'll sound pretty floppy unless gauge is upped. That gets tricky, as calculating total tension of a heavier gauge set tuned down is tricky but one wants to be sure one isn't exceeding the original designed top tension.

I found GHS's site particularly helpful but D'A had made set/string tensions hard to find last time I looked. Don't recall how Martin was.

So Silk'n'Steel works great with maple to my ears but not sure how they'd work with rosewood. I liked 'em so much on the F65ce I tr ied 'em on the D25. It was like getting 2 new axes to play with!

Many guys here routinely tune their 12's down a half or whole step for the tone, although they can handle standard tuning as long as they're strung properly.

If you want jangle stick with PB though.

 

[adorshki]

A bit a of a qualifier as to my opinion stated here. First, I've only played a handful of New Hartford guitars and that has always been in a music store, so I am not now, nor have I ever been qualified to comment on New Hartford built Guild guitars. If/when I was comparing late 90s-early 2000's Fender/Guild guitars to say Tacoma or Corona built Guilds, yes I do think the late Westerly built were superior. I wouldn't have a clue as to the quality, workmanship or tone of a Cordoba built Guild, I've never played one.

Why I wanted to give you a chance to correct me if needed.

I did however play several new GAD guitars in Tyler at the Guitar Center and was somewhat pleasantly surprised. For $500-$700 guitars, I thought they sounded pretty good.

To be honest, with all that usually going on around me in a music store, and the short amount of time generally available in a music store, it's always been pretty hard for me to really make an accurate assessment in that environment. Sometimes it takes me months to really bond with a guitar, though there have been exceptions.

West

Yeah I get it about music stores. I didn't even bother trying out my D40 when I bought it and it wound up taking about 8 years to really start bonding with it.