hey 12 string gurus, is it bad if i....?

[Westerly Wood]

concert D seems to be a good compromise between driving the top enough to get a good old guild 12 tone and being easy to play. the C#, though fun, was a bit soupy....
:mrgreen:

Think I'll try that C# thing for grins. Thanks for the tip... Ain't it fun?

[/quote]

try it cj, but i had to tune up to D standard cause the C# was just too loose.....got to get me a good capo for 12 string.....any suggestions?

thanks!

 

[Scratch]

concert D seems to be a good compromise
try it cj, but i had to tune up to D standard cause the C# was just too loose.....got to get me a good capo for 12 string.....any suggestions?

thanks!

Shubb Delux S is a nice one, Woody (about 20.00). http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=361502

I also use a G7th which is more expensive (about 40.00). http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=361502

My favorite for the money, though is this one:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ ... sku=361650

Tip: Stay away from Musician's Friend. I'm preparing a thread on my most recent customer service experiences and why I recommend staying away...

 

[Scratch]

Hi Scratch; cool avatar! regards, j

Thanks CJ.

How ya feeling? Any particular brand we should toast to your health in Arlington? Sure wish you could make it...

 

[capnjuan]

Pretty good Scratch; thank you; make it a Lone Star or whatever the boys are having.... :wink:

 

[sitka_spruce]

Not 'bad', but doesn't do the instrument justice.

I'm curious why this hyseria is about 12-string guitars in the first place, when we're at these relatively light guages... Didn't somebody say .010 on a 12'er equals the tension of .012s of a 6'er and we wouldn't freak out by that, would we?

Then of course Guild 12-string necks are the full 25 1/2" or 25 5/8" which obviously will impose more tension at a certain pitch and at a certain gauge than shorter scale instruments would (as for instance the 24 3/4 Martin neck), but Guilds should be built to handle the torque subjected to the neck - or do you see that differently?

Also the dual truss-rod system aids with keeping the neck straight

 

[Westerly Wood]

Re: Not 'bad', but doesn't do the instrument justice.

I'm curious why this hyseria is about 12-string guitars in the first place, when we're at these relatively light guages... Didn't somebody say .010 on a 12'er equals the tension of .012s of a 6'er and we wouldn't freak out by that, would we?

Then of course Guild 12-string necks are the full 25 1/2" or 25 5/8" which obviously will impose more tension at a certain pitch and at a certain gauge than shorter scale instruments would (as for instance the 24 3/4 Martin neck), but Guilds should be built to handle the torque subjected to the neck - or do you see that differently?

Also the dual truss-rod system aids with keeping the neck straight

good point, and i am glad to hear that .10-.47 on a 12er = .12-.53 on a 6er. i wouldnt say we are being hysterical though, just seeking knowledge brother....thanks for the input....fun times! :lol:

 

[GuildFS4612CE]

I've read it as information gathering, as in "you can never have too much info"....especially if you are new to Guild 12's.

And the older the guitar, the closer to a neck reset, the more cautious you need to be

Re: Capos....the basic Kyser 12 will also work well, though the spring will eventually deteriorate.

 

[guildzilla]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this.

The total tension on the neck of a guitar is the sum of the tensions of each string. So even though each string on a 12-string is lighter compared to a 6-string, the total tension is far higher on a 12-string. For instance a pair of high E .10's has a sum tension that is a lot higher than one .13 high E.

In a lot of cases, too, it isn't really fear of tuning a Guild 12 string to concert pitch that drives this. It starts as a caution thing, downtuning a step to D. Then you notice that the instrument is easier and less fatiguing to play at the lighter tension. And you notice that certain songs work better for you vocally in a lower range and that it's kind of cool to have one guitar tuned that way all the time. And you start thinking, what the heck, it sounds good and intuition tells me it's easier on the guitar.

So a habit forms, which we discuss.

I'm also a fan of the Kyser capo.

 

[sitka_spruce]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this.

The total tension on the neck of a guitar is the sum of the tensions of each string. So even though each string on a 12-string is lighter compared to a 6-string, the total tension is far higher on a 12-string. For instance a pair of high E .10's has a sum tension that is a lot higher than one .13 high E.

In a lot of cases, too, it isn't really fear of tuning a Guild 12 string to concert pitch that drives this. It starts as a caution thing, downtuning a step to D. Then you notice that the instrument is easier and less fatiguing to play at the lighter tension. And you notice that certain songs work better for you vocally in a lower range and that it's kind of cool to have one guitar tuned that way all the time. And you start thinking, what the heck, it sounds good and intuition tells me it's easier on the guitar.

So a habit forms, which we discuss.

I'm also a fan of the Kyser capo.

My statement is based from what I've heard. I've always taken that for a fact, however I did check up on that and a Martin set of .010 for the standard pitch and .008 for the octaves has a combined tension of 245.7, a plain .012 set is 160.5. As you can tell that's an increase of slightly more than 50%.

Sometimes we also forget to mention the fatigue of the top wood that should come sooner to guitars subjected to high tension (that's why a pre-war Martin usually cost so much and sound muddy)