NGD ...well, ALMOST..X160 Bridge Question...

[The Retro Rocker]

OK...so UPS says my new/old X160 should be here on Friday! I happen to have a gig on Friday night and would LOVE to take my new baby out to play, and I'm doing as much advance prep as possible...naptha, 0000 steel wool (for the frets), guitar polish, lemon oil, new strings (might even try my first-ever set of flat-wounds (D'Addario chromes? 12's ?? advice?)

...BUT...
Here's a couple of pics, if you can zoom in, look at the string spacing on the nut (looks OK)...then at the bridge saddle (not OK).

The bridge saddle needs to be slid towards the right (treble side), but it looks like the sting slots will need to be re-cut to even out the string spacing and go over the pickup pole pieces correctly.

So it looks like I will need a new bridge saddle. Which one and where? Anyone know?

Thanks...

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Thanks for any advice...and HAPPY HOLIDAYS!

 

[kakerlak]

If those aren't super deep it might be possible to sand it down flat and cut new ones -- maybe re-ramp the sides of each saddle just to narrow them back down a bit.

 

[Walter Broes]

impossible to say from that pic IMO. You can probably slide the bridge into the right spot so the strings are centered on the neck.

 

[Walter Broes]

btw...12 flats? Jazz gig?

 

[AcornHouse]

impossible to say from that pic IMO. You can probably slide the bridge into the right spot so the strings are centered on the neck.

+1
It looks like it just needs to be shifted a tick to the right.

 

[The Retro Rocker]

btw...12 flats? Jazz gig?

No. Vintage rock & roll, rockabilly, surf type big note stuff...kinda like some of what you do, only covers. (I'm more of a rhythm player)
Never used flats before. But I was reading something that suggested the DeArmond 2000's sound great with flats.

 

[The Retro Rocker]

+1
It looks like it just needs to be shifted a tick to the right.

It does, and I can do that. But look closely at the string spacing...the "D" string is off...not centered between the A and the G. Stuff like that bugs me! And when I do shift it...the low e will not be optimal. Looks like the front pickup might have been mounted too far to the left (bass side) too!

Am I the only one who sees this?

I might try sanding the grooves and re-grooving the saddle after putting it where its supposed to be. But I think I'd rather get a new saddle.

 

[AcornHouse]

I'm looking more at the pole pieces on the pup, rather than the saddle itself. The right shift will center them all.

 

[The Retro Rocker]

I'm looking more at the pole pieces on the pup, rather than the saddle itself. The right shift will center them all.

On the bridge pickup, yes. But I don't think so on the neck pickup.

 

[GAD]

"Optimal" positioning over pole-pieces is wasted effort IMO. The entire area over the pickup is awash in magnetic field, and while yes, the poles will have higher strength, the strings only "work" the field when their moving anyway.

Don't get me wrong - I *totally* get the obsession for things to line up, and I've been known to do it myself, but unless the strings don't feel right while your playing, I wouldn't sweat it, especially on a floating bridge guitar. I see guys obsessing over F-spaced pickups on shredder guitars and try to remind them that Eddie Van Halen screwed a PAF into his Frankenstrat without a whole lot of precision. That mucked up guitar is the source of some of the most coveted tone in Rock and Roll and doesn't line up with, well... anything!

Don't discount the possibility of camera angle skewing your view of the setup, too.

The pics of the frets, though... that's making me reach for the 0000 steal wool. Yikes!

BTW I am insanely jealous. That guitar is so cool!

 

[adorshki]

Am I the only one who sees this?

Just because nobody's specifically answered it yet, no you're not, I see it too, the D isn't centered correctly between the A and the G and yes it would drive me nuts, I'm sure I'd keep missing it slightly especially when playing close to the bridge.
When I got a bone nut and saddle on my D25 years ago they screwed up the nut spacing exactly the same way and I felt it right away. Kept picking thin air on some scales.
I agree, I think that's a much bigger problem than how well they line up over the pole pieces.
Hopefully it's a relatively painless fix.

 

[The Retro Rocker]

So who makes that bridge? And what would be the diff between a wood base and a metal base (aluminum?). I would imagine a slightly warmer tone with wood?

 

[Walter Broes]

It does, and I can do that. But look closely at the string spacing...the "D" string is off...not centered between the A and the G. Stuff like that bugs me! And when I do shift it...the low e will not be optimal. Looks like the front pickup might have been mounted too far to the left (bass side) too!

Am I the only one who sees this?

I might try sanding the grooves and re-grooving the saddle after putting it where its supposed to be. But I think I'd rather get a new saddle.

Looking at the saddle closely, you're right. But then it looks like the whole bridge was slotted a little off from that pic, the high E string is sitting a lot more on the outside of the saddle than the low E.

If the grooves aren't too deep, you could probably re-slot the bridge.

It's a Bigsby bridge saddle - possibly the one that came on the guitar. The base is after market. I think the Bigsby bridges sound a little tinny - great for bass string twang, but they can get a little thin and plinky on the treble strings.

Re : strings : yes, DeArmond pickups can sound pretty good with flats, but again, matter of taste. If you're not used to playing flats they can feel weird, and sound weird too. Also, they tend not to be as loud as rounds. I like pure nickel rounds with most vintage style pickups - more modern strings like nickel plated steel or similar can be hard to balance with DeArmonds especially : the bass strings tend to get too loud compared to the trebles.

 

[FNG]

I used to own one of these, and it had an all metal bridge.

I'd bet that isn't the original bridge.

 

[FNG]

http://www.guitarchives.nl/guitarsgalore/parts_detail.php?id=40

Here’s a pic from Hans' website of what the bridge looked like on mine

 

[The Retro Rocker]

Looking at the saddle closely, you're right. But then it looks like the whole bridge was slotted a little off from that pic, the high E string is sitting a lot more on the outside of the saddle than the low E.

If the grooves aren't too deep, you could probably re-slot the bridge.

It's a Bigsby bridge saddle - possibly the one that came on the guitar. The base is after market. I think the Bigsby bridges sound a little tinny - great for bass string twang, but they can get a little thin and plinky on the treble strings.

Re : strings : yes, DeArmond pickups can sound pretty good with flats, but again, matter of taste. If you're not used to playing flats they can feel weird, and sound weird too. Also, they tend not to be as loud as rounds. I like pure nickel rounds with most vintage style pickups - more modern strings like nickel plated steel or similar can be hard to balance with DeArmonds especially : the bass strings tend to get too loud compared to the trebles.

Thanks Walter.
Listening to "Movin' Up" ("Downtime" and "You and Me") as we speak (well, type actually!) Love it!
"Downtime" (is that a Fender 6 or Dan Electro I hear?) reminds me of when East Bay Ray (DK) and I were working on what he called "Spaghetti Punk" back in the 80's. (He and I had a band before DK.)

You're right...new guitar for me, new scale length and smaller size...maybe too soon to do the flats too. (Sensory overload!)
I have a set of DR Pure Blues 11-50 Vintage Pure Nickel rounds that I'm going to try on the X160 when it gets here. (It's what I use on my Carlo Robelli/Peerless RB1955, but I sub-in a wound 3rd string)...and maybe try the flats later.

 

[kakerlak]

Yeah, that A string is slotted too close to the D. As a consequence, I think the whole thing is a little narrow, E-to-E (low E lines up well along the fretboard, but look how far inboard the high E lies). Kicking the A and E out a little would fix it, but those are the widest, deepest slots, so it might not be possible. No room to skew the slots the other direction... Also looks to me like the D and G are father apart than any other pair, though only slightly.

 

[The Retro Rocker]

Just because nobody's specifically answered it yet, no you're not, I see it too, the D isn't centered correctly between the A and the G and yes it would drive me nuts, I'm sure I'd keep missing it slightly especially when playing close to the bridge.
When I got a bone nut and saddle on my D25 years ago they screwed up the nut spacing exactly the same way and I felt it right away. Kept picking thin air on some scales.
I agree, I think that's a much bigger problem than how well they line up over the pole pieces.
Hopefully it's a relatively painless fix.

Thanks Al...at least you see it too!

 

[The Retro Rocker]

http://www.guitarchives.nl/guitarsgalore/parts_detail.php?id=40

Here’s a pic from Hans' website of what the bridge looked like on mine

I've seen a BUNCH of different pics of the X160s...some have the wooden base, some metal. Hard to tell what's original and what was changed. Maybe Guild issued them at different times with different bases? Funny, but they ALL seem to keep the aluminum saddle regardless of what the base is made out of!

 

[dbirchett]

If I was looking to replace the bridge, I would contact Tim Harmon over at Gretschpages.com. He goes by the handle of Proteus. Sometimes hard to reach. He makes the Tru-Arc bridge and his newest creation is the sidwinder bridge which is a compensated bridge. He makes them out of several metals and they are all machined. They really add to the tone and he will customize it however you like.