New GSR T-500

[chazmo]

How about a blade-runner acoustic?




(I jest)


(actually, I think it was Grot's idea)

 

[Just_Guild]

Perhaps something completely new and unlike any other Guild previously produced? How's that for an idea? Afterall, while having a remake of a classic is always nice, the classics are still around and, in most cases, are still affordable. Consider that Guild is starting to release electrics again to re-enter the market, with the ultimate goal being to make a quality product that also makes money. Historically, how many companies do well by recycling the past? Probably not many. As Guild fanatics we all want something that either brings us back to our younger days, or reinforces our belief that the classic Guilds should have been more popular with the masses, and can be in the future. That may happen with the release of something like an Aristocrat, which I would love, but would that suddenly compete with the Les Paul or PRS in sales volume? Not likely, although most of us feel it is a superior guitar. I, for one, would love to see some creativity and new inovation that perhaps will attract new fans and please us older fans instead of just pleasing us LTG'ers.

Okay, you may all now proceed in calling me all sorts of vile names :lol:

You make a very valid point (not the vile names) but about something completely new and different. I would like to think that Guild would take advantage of having the incredible talents of Ren Ferguson in bringing something truly unique and new to the market, a real grabber to put Guild on the map, big time.

(Anecdotally, I have seen many positive comments about the New Hartford Guilds on Gibson and other forums. Guild is being noticed.)

 

[The Guilds of Grot]

How about a blade-runner acoustic?




(I jest)


(actually, I think it was Grot's idea)

Sorry, wasn't me. Somebody else will have to get credit for that one!

 

[Walter Broes]

Historically, how many companies do well by recycling the past? Probably not many.

Well, if you mean guitar companies....Fender, Gibson, Gretsch, Rickenbacker, Höfner,... all have a lot of reissue guitars in their catalogs, and they seem to be very popular too.

 

[Default]

Historically, how many companies do well by recycling the past? Probably not many.

Almost all of them? Gibson and Fender all sell variations of guitars that are designs older than me. Hamer and Kramer started out making upgraded versions of Gibson and Fender designs. Most companies than made guitars that were radically different are out of business.

 

[chazmo]

That's really true, guys. And, just for argument's sake, if you're going to look at this from an acoustic point of view, arguably Taylor broke the mold; but other than applying a bolt-on neck to an acoustic, the company was essentially traditional to start with.

So, what are we saying? I guess we want both... reissues and novel designs.

I will say this, I think it was smart for Guild to do a few reissues (as GSRs) to bring electrics back into our consciousness. Can you really charge a lot of money when you're going with something new in this space (while trying to revive the brand, that is)? To me, this is a marketing question... Do you risk "diluting" the brand's heritage? Fender has MANY other ways to introduce high-end electrics into the marketplace, so what does Guild really stand for?

(just thinking out loud, kids)

 

[guildman63]

Historically, how many companies do well by recycling the past? Probably not many.

Well, if you mean guitar companies....Fender, Gibson, Gretsch, Rickenbacker, Höfner,... all have a lot of reissue guitars in their catalogs, and they seem to be very popular too.

I am not that familiar with the offerings and history of Rickenbacke and Hofner, but Gibson and Gretsch have such a following for their electrics that they don't have the same concerns as a company like Guild. I am not suggesting that getting radical with a new design is the answer (although many new ideas are initially considered radical), but a product needs to come out that makes a significant number of non-LTG members want to buy it. Preaching to thw choir of LTG'ers will come out with guitars I want, as evidenced by my two GSR purchases, but it won't necessarily bring in people that have never played Guild. I'm just trying to stimulate thought and debate, and rile people up a bit :shock:

 

[Default]

You need a decent supply of electrics and some electric endorsers with stature.
A T-bird would be cool.
Being able to add those little touches, the stamped pup covers, the three screw adjustable pup rings, would set the product apart visually.
A range of franz/p-90 guitars would work, at least until Gibson wakes up.
FMIC seems to be doing ok putting guitars into the indi-artists hands.

 

[Default]

You need a decent supply of electrics and some electric endorsers with stature.
A T-bird would be cool.
Being able to add those little touches, the stamped pup covers, the three screw adjustable pup rings, would set the product apart visually.
A range of franz/p-90 guitars would work, at least until Gibson wakes up.
FMIC seems to be doing ok putting guitars into the indi-artists hands.

 

[alpep]

Steve, who's Darren? And what's an X180?

Frono is correct, re: Darren and here's the X180 with alpep playing it.

Thanks Randy!

that's a great guitar and I really got lost in sitting there and playing it. All I could think is it would be great for jazzy stuff but I could not help in wondering what an overdrive would do to it.


Darren also took specs from my x 400g for body specs and for the franz pickups. Can't wait to see what is up in the future

 

[Zelja]

I think it would be fine for Guild to do a slightly modern take on some of their classic guitars, especially for models which wouldn't have much high end competition e.g. a fully hollow small bodied guitar like the Aristocrat or late 60s/early 70s M75. Stay true to the basic aesthetic & maybe do some upgrades like a fully adjustable TOM type bridge instead of the wooden one (or have both as options).

I'm glad that they seemed to have tried to capture the essence of the Franz pickups in the T-500. I'm not a fan of a lot of the generic SD choices & I think a big part of the character of the Guild electrics we love is that the pickups were so different from the Gibson et al choices - e.g. the Franz, 60's mini-hum & the 70s HB-1.

The marketing difficulty as well for totally new models might be that they could clash & eat into any Hamer sales, which I assume are still made in the same factory (& are great guitars).

 

[Default]

Quick, have to rsh out the door, Aristocrat has a block underneath the bridge and Hamer is a low volume manu at this time. Believe me, I would love to see the factory needing to run at full steam!

 

[jcwu]

I think it would be fine for Guild to do a slightly modern take on some of their classic guitars

I seem to remember the Starfire got "slammed" for having an updated/different body shape..?

 

[krysh]

I think it would be fine for Guild to do a slightly modern take on some of their classic guitars

I seem to remember the Starfire got "slammed" for having an updated/different body shape..?

I still do and wouldn't buy either a starfire bass or a starfire guitar with the non original shape.

 

[guildman63]

I think it would be fine for Guild to do a slightly modern take on some of their classic guitars

I seem to remember the Starfire got "slammed" for having an updated/different body shape..?

That came from a select few LTG'ers that will only accept a new Guild if it looks exactly like an old Guild, and that is their right to do that. I, for one, think the new Starfire, while different, looks great. More importantly, it plays and sounds great, like a Guild should. Despite what we as LTG'ers think, Guild needs to focus on what they think may interest the masses, not on pleasing each LTG member, which isn't possible anyway. Why should Guild reproduce an exact copy of something that is still widely available used, and that never caught on with the masses the way many other guitars did?

 

[Default]

OTOH, why should Guild put out something that looks identical in body shape to a Gibson 335? It was admitted to me at the tour that the body shape was, and I quote, "a mistake". It's a great guitar, but if Guild does not distinguish itself in the marketplace by having a unique line of guitars, people will never even pick them up and find out their qualities.
If you want a knockoff of a Gibson, Epiphones are everywhere.

 

[krysh]

OTOH, why should Guild put out something that looks identical in body shape to a Gibson 335? It was admitted to me at the tour that the body shape was, and I quote, "a mistake". It's a great guitar, but if Guild does not distinguish itself in the marketplace by having a unique line of guitars, people will never even pick them up and find out their qualities.
If you want a knockoff of a Gibson, Epiphones are everywhere.

exactly steve. and I believe the old HB-1's, the smaller HB's AND the shape had a big part in the magic of the old starfire guitars.
if it doesn't have the correct shape, it will always look like a copy. and there are enough of them even at much lower prices.
the starfire shape is an important unique selling propostion.

 

[Zelja]

I think it would be fine for Guild to do a slightly modern take on some of their classic guitars

I seem to remember the Starfire got "slammed" for having an updated/different body shape..?

I also wrote "stay true to the basic aesthetic" which that Starfire didn't do, especially as it had the shape of a close competitor. Stellar guitar apparently from all that have played & owned them but not a classic Starfire shape & way too close to an ES-335, IMO. Regardless I was very happy to see it materialise & have quality Guild electrics available again, even in such limited numbers.

The "modern take" I was talking about was some improved/different appointments - some technologies have advanced surely with hardware etc, pickups wound for better adjustment between neck & bridge, better & more adjustable bridges than what some of the older models had etc. I don't think one needs to be a slave to the older models & reproduce every peccadillo in the name of authenticity. Classic styling with modern appointments but the signature Guild pickups/tones is what I would be looking for. The problem is would that sell to a wider market - a company can't live off a few diehards.

 

[fronobulax]

I'll go with the veer.

First keep production volume in mind. Based on a guesstimated production of under 5,000 guitars a year at the factory, it seems to me that it will be quite some time before we see even 500 electric guitars of all models produced in a year, and we will only see that if the overall market for guitars remains strong and grows. So production numbers suggest that Guild's electric strategy should be to find niches rather than go head to head with a popular product. One niche would be reproductions of vintage Guilds. Another niche would be re-imaginations of vintage Guilds. A third possibly niche would be something completely different. I'll note that LTG folks seem to be divided as to whether "reproduce" is better than "reimagine" or not.

I understand the opinions about the SF shape and I guess it really depends upon how you define things. The shape change caused me to define just what made an instrument a Starfire. Was it the exact body shape or was double cutaway, hollow body enough?

I am probably not going to buy the GSR SF I or II bass precisely because they are too close to the vintage Starfire (which I already own) yet not different enough to fill another niche in the bass stable. To tempt me I would want a thin profile neck and a 34" scale or active electronics that reproduced the Bisonic sound and more or perhaps a nice blue finish, the likes of which has never been on a Starfire before although is quite common on Fender solid bodies.

As for electrics in general, how much room for innovation is there in a hollow body electric? Isn't the obvious way forward to start with a classic body design and shape and tweak the PU and electronics choices? Same is true for solid bodies as well although which slab of wood you start with and what it is shaped into could be market differentiators.

Now if I were Guild and wanted to make a big splash at NAMM with an electric I'd be considering the creatiion of a Kim Thayil or Carrie Brownstein signature model S-100....

 

[Los Angeles]

Getting the shape of the guitar wrong is not an "update". Imagine a "new" S-100 that looked even more like an SG. Fans of the S-100 would revolt.

This is one area where Fender and Gibson got it right. The Silhouette of the Les Paul, the Stratocaster and many other classic models has seldom if ever wavered. Why should they?

The Starfire had a silhouette that was iconic to it's small band of fans. Same with the Aristocrat and the S-100.

The shape of the new Starfire was just, well, not correct. I'm willing to give the good folks in New Hartford a pass because they didn't make the bodies, they just finished themm and boy did they ever do a good job of finishing them. And that's the take-away: These folks built an incredible guitar worthy of the Guild brand. The folks who got the shape wrong did that a LONG time ago.

If New Hartford makes a run of electric guitars "from scratch", it would behoove them to get a classic version and measure, measure, measure the body's silhouette. "Updates" are certainly welcome. Improvements in materials, hardware, technology, comfort, etc. are the kind of updates that ware ALWAYS welcome. Even bringing back a classic touch like the stair step pickguard or the acorn carving (if we're talking S-100s).

Imagine a hollow M-75 with a solid top, G logo and abalone V inlays. WOW that would be amazing! Now imagine that the shape looked more like a Les Paul instead of an Aristocrat. Not so amazing.

Like any fans of classic brands, when we hear that new stuff is coming out, we get excited. But there's always the fear that we might get "New Coke" or The Phantom Menace.

Thankfully, New Hartford is making GREAT electric instruments. Now we just want them to remember history and give us the silhouettes that we have known and loved for so long.