Bearclaw as a Finish Defect???

[cjd-player]

This guy clearly does not know what he is talking about. The guitar has bearclaw figure in the spruce top and he claims it's a finish defect.
http://cgi.ebay.com/GUILD-F47R-GRAN...QQcmdZViewItemQQptZGuitar?hash=item45f0e1e583

I played one of these recently (albeit a Tacoma) and it was wonderful. The red spruce on rosewood sounded fantastic.

Looks like a good price for a new CT Guild, if you happen to be looking for one of these.

 

[jazzmang]

Hah. The good part would be if this is actually discounted more so than the usual ones.

Additionally, its not marked as a factory 2nd or anything and has a warranty through Guild.

While it certainly doesn't look like a finish flaw to me either, if he wants to discount it, so be it! :lol:

 

[cjd-player]

While it certainly doesn't look like a finish flaw to me either,

If you look in the 6th and last photos, you can see that the bearclaw figure is symmetric on both sides of the bookmatched top.

 

[jazzmang]

While it certainly doesn't look like a finish flaw to me either,

If you look in the 6th and last photos, you can see that the bearclaw figure is symmetric on both sides of the bookmatched top.

yup

 

[dapmdave]

Interesting! I've seen some consider "bear claw" to be a problem, while others consider it to be a "plus".

My little Taylor has lots of it, and I think it adds some nice character to the top.

 

[guitarslinger]

For those of us of a certain age and in the distant past bear clawing of a spruce top was certainly considered a flaw. But, tastes change and old dogs do learn new tricks. I think this "flawed" and discouted guitar looks great.

 

[FNG]

Rocky's a good guy. I got a killer deal from him on a Tacoma D-50. I'll give him a pass on this one...

 

[fronobulax]

bearclaw

I'm a bass, electric, and pastry guy and a bearclaw is glazed fried dough to me. What is it on a guitar? Those parallel diagonal lines angled toward the bridge? If it is a "flaw" in the wood, then how is it created? I guess if i were the quality control person I'd be inclined not to let that guitar leave as a "first" even if the flaw is cosmetic and inherent in the wood.

 

[cjd-player]

bearclaw

What is it on a guitar? Those parallel diagonal lines angled toward the bridge?

Yes.

It's a genetic condition in the tree, somewhat akin to tiger stripe in maple, where the grain direction ripples. It makes the surface of the board look as though a bear had clawed the tree - hense the name. Many luthiers feel that the presence of bearclaw is indicative of stiffer spruce. So depending upon the guitar and how you play, that can be good.
I recently played a small-body guitar that had a sitka top with a lot of bearclaw and EI rosewood back and sides. I think it was the loudest guitar I have ever played, and had way too much sustain for my taste.

 

[cmatthes]

Definitely not a "Finish Defect", but like any wood figuring, it is a flaw in the wood based on some natural stress or event. Nobody considers quilt or flame maple to be a finish defect, but it's the same thing. There was definitely the traditional look of pure, straight-grained spruce preferred over spruce with figure of any sort to it, but it's probably more an aesthetic thing than anything else.

I've heard top-notch luthiers weigh in on both sides of the argument as to whether that has any impact on tone or top movement. I suspect that has more to do with the way they learned their craft or what they are selling more than anything else.

 

[dapmdave]

Sounds like a split decision, here (still).

 

[fronobulax]

It's a genetic condition in the tree, ...

Thanks.

 

[Taylor Martin Guild]

Speaking as a man of age,
bear claw was once considered a flaw.
As quality Spruce started to becoming hard to get, bear claw became cleverly promoted as desirable.
Some guitar makers would use tops with bear claw on their sunburst guitars, to hide it.

Now days there are some that love it and others that still consider it a flaw.
This old dog can learn new tricks and I like bear claw.

 

[iJamF47M]

Possibly the location of the "flaw" might have something to do with the concern. Being so close to the stressful area around the bridge might have made the seller think flaw instead of freckle?

I'd make a bet that this red-headed step-child sounds completely awesome for the guardian that she ends up with.

iJam

 

[geoguy]

I suspect that Rocky was trying to prevent someone from buying the guitar & subsequently being unhappy with it (or even returning the guitar) for what the buyer perceived as a less-than-perfect soundboard . . . I've only bought one instrument from him, but he was first-rate to do business with, imo.

- Mark

 

[Bobby McGee]

Wow, that is a good deal. I can't imagine that such little amount of bearclawing could significantly alter the tone.
I was lucky to get a 2007 Tacoma F47R with the Red Spruce top (yes, the one that cjd-player played) at a bargain price. It was the picture below that got my GAS trigger finger twitchin'. I wonder if Rocky would consider the closed grained middle portion an 'Inperfection'.
I am extremly satisfied with the tone and playabilty of this finely crafted instrument; can't wait to get her into the studio.
I did find it interesting that this Tacoma build has the same headstock, opened back tuners and pickguard as the newer CT builds.

Bobby.

 

[dapmdave]

I suspect that Rocky was trying to prevent someone from buying the guitar & subsequently being unhappy with it (or even returning the guitar) for what the buyer perceived as a less-than-perfect soundboard . . . I've only bought one instrument from him, but he was first-rate to do business with, imo.

- Mark

That sounds like a reasonable conclusion. kudos to sellers who go out of their way to be honest!

Dave

 

[dreadnut]

Here's some info from a local luthier, Bryan Galloup, he builds guitars and runs a school of luthierie:

Our tonewoods are among the finest in the world.

For decades Bryan has been collecting outstanding examples of woods such as European spruce tops, amazing Brazilian rosewood, and the most oustanding figured koa and maple available. Our selection is broad in all grades and at any given time we could have some rare specialty tonewoods available. We will be happy to e-mail photos and pricing of these woods to any serious buyer.
Our wood grading system

Select Grade
Select Grade is the high-quality tonewood that has always been a standard feature of Galloup Guitars. Select Grade woods are hand-picked by Bryan and matched for each instrument. List prices are based on using Select Grade woods, including:

East Indian Rosewood (Dalbergia Latifolai)
Flamed Maple (Acer Pseudoplatanus)
Genuine Mahogany (Swietenia Macrophylla)
Sitka Spruce (Picea Sitchensis)
Western red cedar
Red Spruce (Picea Rubens)

Master Grade
Among the finest tonewoods, there are particular sets that truly stand out. These are our Master Grade woods, and they're made available as an option on any Galloup Guitar. Call for selection and prices. Master Grade tonewoods would be:

Flamed Maple (Acer Pseudoplatanus)
Quilted Maple (Acer Macrophyllum)
Figured Mahogany (Swietenia Macrophylla)
Figured Koa (Acacia Koa) Brazilian Rosewood (Dalbergai Nigra)
Sitka Spruce (Picea Sitchensis)
Bear claw Sitka Spruce (Picea Sitchensis)
Red Spruce (Picea Rubens)
Italian Spruce (Picea Abies)
European spruce

Reserve Stock
A very small number of rare tonewoods qualify for Galloup Reserve Stock. These woods are superior in every aspect. Beauty, rarity, and tonal clarity are some of the factors that distinguish Reserve Stock selections. Call for selection and prices.

 

[Tony Burns]

In the seventies ( when i started playing the guitar ) bearclaw was considered a lesser wood to be used on low end guitars or turned into paper . im from that Era so I still consider it flawed - but then the wood i think is top end- you never see any more because its very scarce -( very very tight grain with many many rings to the inch- cut perfectly on the quarter with beautiful rays - solid color with no streaking )
The stuff they call triple AAA now a days wouldnt pass as decent stuff back then -Master grade wouldn't pass as AAA - So trying to keep an open mind - my best response would be to say - If Bearclaw floats your boat , Im happy for you - but its not the stuff youll find on one of my guitars.

 

[killdeer43]

Don't know how well/if this will show up here but this is a classic example of bearclaw on Englemann spruce.

Southern British Columbia mountains in the fall with signs posted: "Grizzlies in the area. Be alert."

Didn't have to tell us twice! :wink:
Joe