Westerly 12 stringers

[Westerly Wood]

Hello all! a fellow Acoustic Guitar forum member told me about this great Guild forum, for everything Guild, and i recently registered so i could join you all. If i can start off with a question: :lol:

I grew up in Newport RI, but never knew anything about any guitars being built in Westerly, which is literally about 35 minute drive, but I never knew, for I was playing a Martin at the time and didnt pay much attention to other makes. funny how that happens....well, since i have grown up, I still got a Martin, and soon to be getting a Larrivee, but I am interersted down the line in getting my first 12 string guitar, and i have learned enough to know that when shopping 12 strings, one need to look no further than Guilds. so, that being said, and keeping with my Rhode Island roots, even though they have since closed down the westerly Guild facotry, where can i find a 412 or 512 made in westerly? what years should i be considering to make sure it was made in RI? what online sites should i peruse, etc? I now live in tucson and the old Guilds are hit or miss here at the local shops. i might go a year and never see a Westerly RI Guild, let alone play one....

thanks for the help! :lol:

 

[West R Lee]

Hello Woody,

Ebay, Gbase and Craiglist are good places to start. If you want a Westerly, it will have to be a mid 2001 or earlier. If you want a pre-Fender, it will have to be a '95 or older.

Good luck,
West

 

[Graham]

eBay whatever link

 

[Mikeoso]

Just out of curiousity, why are you specifying 412 or 512? My Westerly F212XL is quite adequate for any 12 string job I can come up with. BTW..as a UA grad ('74) I can assure you that playing a 12 string anywhere in Pima County can get you looked at funny. Playing one south of the tracks in Tucson might get you arrested.

 

[West R Lee]

I'll have to ditto Mike on that. There really are a bunch of great Guild 12s out there. I love my JF30 12. There are also the JF55 12, 112, 212, 312, D25 12, and if I'm not mistaken a D55 12. I'm sure I'm not mentioning a few. 412 and 512 are definately great guitars, but there are others out there.

Wed

 

[Guildmark]

Welcome, Woodruff!

I applaud you for your focus on Guild 12's. There are one or two dealers in California that might have what you're looking for, or may know where to get it. Send a LetsTalkGuild PM to california91207 (David) for a couple of store names. He follows the resale market out here as well as anyone I know. (He'll also tell you his JF65-12 is the best of the bunch , when everyone knows it is actually my Westerly G-312. 8) ) If you head over this way to play a few, let him or me know and maybe we can team up to beat the dealer up on price! (That goes for any of you fellow geezers!)

I think if you can make a decision about tonewood and body style that suit the type o' tunes you play most, you're halfway there. Then you can contact Darryl Hattenhauer on this forum for where they might allow you to play there in AZ. Anywhere they'll allow him, you're prob'ly safe. :lol:

Again, welcome!
Post well. Post often.

 

[West R Lee]

Mark, You and Cal both know that my JF30 12 is the greatest sounding 12 in the universe! :wink:

West

 

[Dr Izza Plumber]

Graham, You can easily shorten that link to 1 word so the page is normal width.

This is how it's done. Just open the first url bracket

Make it look like this. Preview it, then test the limk, then submit.
[url=ebaywhateverlink]GUITAR LINK
LINK

 

[capnjuan]

Hi Woody and welcome.

It can get a little crazy here...Like going to a department store, asking about shoes, and the clerks start suggesting pants and shirts...You'll note that no one said an F412 was a bad axe; just that there are many fine Guild 12-string models ... and it's a fair guess that given the chance, each member here would speak highly of their model.

Market Rates: Guildmark is spot on - California is the man to see. I watch them on eBay too and I'd guess that the bottom of the price range is $800-$900 including visible dings/scars, moderate pick or buckle rash, and suspicious-looking bridges. Brand new, discounted models are in the $1,800 - $2,000 range.

In the lower range, you are exposed to needing new tuning machines and either / or bridge refit or neck reset; in extreme cases, both. In this respect, used guitars are similar to used cars; some stuff is probably going to have to be fixed. Depending on many variables, the fix-'em-up can run several hundred dollars. To think otherwise is to plan on getting lucky (like us Geezers did on Saturday night in high school) which, frankly, is not normally considered a strong plan...

Some unsolicited eBay advice; if an eBay ad doesn't say the neck is straight and tight, then ask the seller if it's straight and tight. If the ad doesn't say the bridge is flat, then ask the seller if the bridge is flat. It's an unfortunate fact that unethical sellers will withold or conceal information harmful to their interests.

Ask the questions before you bid. The questions and answers stay in eBay's email system; in case you get butt-jobbed, you can go to eBay, claim misrepresentation, and point to the emails as support for your position.

The only correct responses to these questions are pleasant and straightforward ... one way or the other.

Faux 'wounded pride' coming across as arrogance or

"...I'm no expert..."

"...I don't know, I'm selling for a friend..."

"...'seems like' / 'appears' to be ok..."

I think these are red flags.

Assuming you intend to buy and are not looking for entertainment in the form of 'e-gambling', these are signs to either reduce what you think your final offer might be or just walk away from the auction. Yes, it reduces the excitement factor but also reduces the risk.

If you spend (too much) time reading the auctions, you'll find that any seller who effectively guarantees your satisfaction - offers to take the instrument back if you're not satisfied - will never use the 'seems like' or 'appears' language.

These words are designed to allow the seller to disavow responsibility; you can accept the risk and bid anyway but IMO I think they have to be considered caution signs.

Good luck,

Capnjuan

 

[Westerly Wood]

thanks for the hearty welcome and advise all of you!
i guess i should have specified any Westerly 12 stringer, not just the 412 or 512. i just didnt know how many Guild 12 strings there were... :lol:

i will jot down all the models you guys have specified. and thanks for the date cutoff of pre 2001. i cant help but kick myself for not visiting the Guild Westerly plant when i was living in Newport.

thanks again!

 

[Westerly Wood]

Welcome, Woodruff!

I applaud you for your focus on Guild 12's. There are one or two dealers in California that might have what you're looking for, or may know where to get it. Send a LetsTalkGuild PM to california91207 (David) for a couple of store names. He follows the resale market out here as well as anyone I know. (He'll also tell you his JF65-12 is the best of the bunch , when everyone knows it is actually my Westerly G-312. 8) ) If you head over this way to play a few, let him or me know and maybe we can team up to beat the dealer up on price! (That goes for any of you fellow geezers!)

I think if you can make a decision about tonewood and body style that suit the type o' tunes you play most, you're halfway there. Then you can contact Darryl Hattenhauer on this forum for where they might allow you to play there in AZ. Anywhere they'll allow him, you're prob'ly safe. :lol:

Again, welcome!
Post well. Post often.

thanks mark! got any pics of your 312? so basically i am to seek a Guild Westerly 12 string from the 70s would be best? wasnt the 412 the very first guild 12er?

 

[Westerly Wood]

Hi Woody and welcome.

Good luck,

Capnjuan

thanks john, i dont do ebay, so now worry there. i will keep my eye out here in tucson, for there is one guitar shop, Rainbow Guitars, that occasionally gets in old Guild 12 strings. I got the chance to play a newer 412 last night but didnt like it, too big and prefered this '62 gibson 12 stringer hanging rivght next to the guild. but i am in no hurry. thanks for the advise! :lol:

 

[Guildmark]

thanks mark! got any pics of your 312? so basically i am to seek a Guild Westerly 12 string from the 70s would be best? wasnt the 412 the very first guild 12er?

The very first Guild 12? Someone with Hans Moust's book had better answer that one. I'm still hoping for a copy for Father's Day

Unfortunately, woodruff, the only photos of my G-312 have me in them, too. But you're welcome to view the following "slideshow". :shock:
I bought this guitar new in 1978. Ordered it from a local music shop when I was living in Stamford, CT. One of the identifying features is the plain fingerboard - no position markers (like a classical). I've always liked the clean look.
This is the first gig I played with it, at a retirement home in Stamford:
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... 3troub.jpg
These were taken last summer:
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... G_7135.jpg
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... G_1125.jpg
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... ass073.jpg
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... ass076.jpg
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... G_7036.jpg
This one shows the position markers along the top edge of the fingerboard:
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... CT0017.jpg
Some friends tell me this is the image that comes to mind most often when they think of my playing: http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... 1209-1.jpg

 

[gilligan]

Hello All,

When I decided to by a 12-string, a "google" search lead me to LTG, which I immediately joined, and followed with purchasing Hans' book. I believe the combination of those two resources are unrivaled in learning about Guild guitars.

I got my D25 on ebay and completely follow the procedure that capnjuan outlined previously when checking out any guiars on-line. I have a 'standard letter' that I cut and paste to send along as questions, deleting anything that was already clearly answered in the listing.
-------------------------------------
"May I please have the serial number from the label inside the guitar body and where does this label say the guitar was made? What is imprinted on the back of the headstock? It looks beautiful in the photo, could you please give more detailed info on the overall condition of the guitar i.e. what condition is the bridge in? what is the guitar top like (sunken anywhere?bowed anywhere?completely flat?); any cracks (repaired or not) anywhere on the instrument?; tuning machines okay?; twisting/bending neck?; cracks around the neck joint?; what is the height of the strings at the twelfth fret?; checking in the finish?; what is the action like (3/32” etc); how much saddle left?

My concerns, for any guitar, are always:
--any cracks anywhere on the instrument
--how flat is the top (all areas of the top)
--is the neck bowed excessively or twisted at all
--is the truss rod working
--what is the neck joint like
--anything funny about the bridge
--how much saddle is left
--what condition are the frets in

Could you please tell me where you are located and the cost for shipping to Philadelphia?

Thanks very much for the info. Hope to be contacting you soon."
-----------------------------------
Critique and suggestions for editing are always welcome, by the way.

The F212 and F312 were the beginning of the Guild 12-strings in 1964.

Hope this helps,

gilligan

 

[capnjuan]

It's a sad fact but if you don't ask about omitted or murky details before the fact, you're likely to find out about them after the fact.

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

To the tune of "Mama Don't Allow No Guitar Playin' Here." With apologies to the Rooftop Singers, who inspired me get my first 12 string.

Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.
Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.
I don't care what Phoenix don't allow.
I'm going to play my Guildtar anyhow.
Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.

Guitars are cheap here in the arid zone. But not many Guilds.

My guess is that a 212XL would be preferred by more players than would any other model. And they are a great bargain.

 

[Guildmark]

To the tune of "Mama Don't Allow No Guitar Playin' Here."

Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.
Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.
I don't care what Phoenix don't allow.
I'm going to play my Guildtar anyhow.
Phoenix don't allow no Darryl playin' here.

Verse 2
Phoenix don't allow no guitar playin 'round there.
(If it's Darryl.)
Phoenix don't allow no guitar playin 'round there.
(Yeah, when it's Darryl.)
We don't care what Phoenix don't allow,
We're headin' for Arlington anyhow.
Phoenix don't allow no guitar playin 'round there.

Who's got Verse 3?

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

Coastie don't allow no steel GIT tar here.
I said Coastie don't allow no steel GIT tar here.
I don't care what Coastie don't allow.
I'm gonna caterwaul and then milk a cow.
Coastie don't allow no steel GIT tar here.

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

I don't allow no biker skanks around here.
Y'know, I don't allow no toothless hags around here.
But West don't care what I won't allow.
He's moving to Arkansas anyhow.
West is gonna be drinking lots more beer.

 

[Graham]

Some friends tell me this is the image that comes to mind most often when they think of my playing: http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l189/ ... 1209-1.jpg

I was just re-reading this thread, that's funny Mark :lol: