NGD - Orpheum Orchestra Prototype

[BradHK]

We know about the blue rosette also on other prototypes, and the satin b/s on this first prototype. Are there other differences?’

No idea but I am now curious. I will need to compare some photos and make some measurements. Other than the satin b/s nothing else jumped out but I could have missed it. The end pin is bone and matches the bridge pins. Somewhere I thought I read about another orpheum having a plastic end pin but I could be mistaken. It could have also been swapped out by the previous owner.

 

[Opsimath]

Absolutely stunning! Congratulations!

 

[HeyMikey]

One thing I wish the production models had is the blue rosette. That thing is terrific looking!

 

[chazmo]

We know about the blue rosette also on other prototypes, and the satin b/s on this first prototype. Are there other differences?’

None that I know of, but Brad's is the first of the Orpheum prototypes. The satin finish probably indicates differences in pore filler and finish type/application, but we need a full photo spread of inside and out to know if there are other variances in spec.

 

[chazmo]

One thing I wish the production models had is the blue rosette. That thing is terrific looking!

Well, that was obviously an object of some contention among Ren and the other builders. I like the blue too, but I prefer what they eventually came out with.

The blue might've worked with turquoise inlays or some sort of blue in the headstock -- something to highlight it. But just by itself it seems slightly out of place to me.

 

[HeyMikey]

I would love to know more about the process of how they came up with the Orpheum concept and working through the early design iterations they went through to get it to the final production models. That must have been an exciting time in NH.

 

[chazmo]

Well, what we know, Mike, is that the "custom shop" in New Hartford -- composing several of their top shop guys -- build a number of these models under Ren Ferguson's aegis at New Hartford during the last year and a half of NH's Guild stewardship.

The stated intention that we all heard parroted several times by Guild was to build models that Guild might have built in the 30's-ish if Guild had been a brand then. What that means technically is hard to say, but the appointments of the Orpheum series definitely look right for the time period.

 

[BradHK]

Well, that was obviously an object of some contention among Ren and the other builders. I like the blue too, but I prefer what they eventually came out with.

The blue might've worked with turquoise inlays or some sort of blue in the headstock -- something to highlight it. But just by itself it seems slightly out of place to me.

I like the blue better with the natural top but I like the production colors better with a sunburst top.

 

[davidbeinct]

Gorgeous. Play it in good health.

 

[merlin6666]

Well, what we know, Mike, is that the "custom shop" in New Hartford -- composing several of their top shop guys -- build a number of these models under Ren Ferguson's aegis at New Hartford during the last year and a half of NH's Guild stewardship.

The stated intention that we all heard parroted several times by Guild was to build models that Guild might have built in the 30's-ish if Guild had been a brand then. What that means technically is hard to say, but the appointments of the Orpheum series definitely look right for the time period.

Indeed, and I think that Ren Ferguson was known as an expert not only of modern guitar production but also of design details of the old guitars. I have seen pictures of some of the Gibsons that he personally built and they also had kind of an Orpheumish look.

Though I am surprised that he did not include some ladder bracing like Collings did with the Waterloo brand, particularly with the slothead models. But I am not complaining, I think that my 12 string definitely has some Leadbelly vibe.

 

[chazmo]

Ladder bracing would've been a BIG change for them. I was not familiar with Collings' Waterloo brand... Do you have any pictures of these, Merlin?

The head tool maker and all-around great guy in New Hartford, Darren, was a huge Collings fan. I don't remember what his association with Collings was, but I'm sure if there was a time or a way to do something radical like that, it would've gotten done in time.

 

[GGJaguar]

they also had kind of an Orpheumish look.

Agreed. Ren was involved with the Roy Smeck reissue as well as the Jackson Browne model. Below are (l to r) the Smeck, Browne and Orph.

 

[merlin6666]

Ladder bracing would've been a BIG change for them. I was not familiar with Collings' Waterloo brand... Do you have any pictures of these, Merlin?

The head tool maker and all-around great guy in New Hartford, Darren, was a huge Collings fan. I don't remember what his association with Collings was, but I'm sure if there was a time or a way to do something radical like that, it would've gotten done in time.

https://www.waterlooguitars.com/

My local guitar store had a few of them in stock some years ago and I was able to compare the ladder and X braced versions. They both were a lot of fun to play and noodle around. Just right for sitting on the front porch on a warm summer evening.

 

[jeffcoop]

Congratulations, Brad! And welcome to the Orpheum prototype club (there are a few members around here).

Ah, now we know the reason why your one was not shown at NAMM 2013! So you have a true Prototype! The mahogany burst one they were showing had all gloss and also had a serial number already, it was just finished a few days before NAMM started (Jan 16th):



Ralf

This shows a trivial difference between the prototypes (at least the one that got serial numbers) and the regular-release Orpheums: the prototypes had ordinary Guild labels, not the special custom shop labels that the regular Orpheums received.

I'm intrigued that a prototype Orpheum with satin sides and back was made. Guild shifted the Standard series bodies from gloss to satin sides and back in 2013, at roughly the same time that the Orpheums w4ere introduced, and also produced the custom shop limited release for Reno's (the ones with the star inlays on the headstock and neck), which had satin finish on the neck, sides, and back. So satin finishes were clearly on their minds at about this time. I'm glad the production models were all-glosss, though.

 

[chazmo]

I think my Orph has that regular NH label, Jeff. I'll have to check later.

Whoops. Nope! See below.

 

[jeffcoop]

Well, that was obviously an object of some contention among Ren and the other builders. I like the blue too, but I prefer what they eventually came out with.

The blue might've worked with turquoise inlays or some sort of blue in the headstock -- something to highlight it. But just by itself it seems slightly out of place to me.

As I recall, the blue marquetry received decidedly mixed reviews around here during the initial discussion of the Orpheums here during the January 2013 NAMM.

I like the blue on my prototype mostly because it identifies the guitar as a prototype. It looks good, but I prefer the production marquetry.

 

[jeffcoop]

I think my Orph has that regular NH label, Jeff. I'll have to check later.

Interesting, and cedertainly possible. I just know that mine has a custom shop label, and I think that the OM I used to own did as well. Sandy can check that one.

 

[chazmo]

Interesting, and cedertainly possible. I just know that mine has a custom shop label, and I think that the OM I used to own did as well. Sandy can check that one.

Nope, I'm dead wrong, Jeff!!!! Silly me. OK, here's mine:

 

[Aristera]

Guild may not have used blue rosette on their production models of their Orpheums but Fender did on the Master Designed 12 String from their custom shop in New Hartford. Is there a signature under the hood? My Fender has Jason's.

 

[chazmo]

Guild may not have used blue rosette on their production models of their Orpheums but Fender did on the Master Designed 12 String from their custom shop in New Hartford. Is there a signature under the hood? My Fender has Jason's.

Look at that! Totally neat, James. I don't think I ever saw those guitars. Did we ever discuss them here? Do you have more pictures?

I see one of those on reverb (not a 12-string):

Fender Custom Shop Traditional Pro Dreadnought 2013 Natural | Reverb

Mint condition! One of very few in existence. Has a K&K pickup installed through the bottom strap button. Tuners have been swapped but the original Grover’s will be included as well as the original hardshell case. This is truly a collector’s piece. You’ll never see another!From Retailer: Body...

reverb.com