Model Three as speaker cab?

[Boss]

Hello friends,

I play three 1960s Guild jazz guitars which I have upgraded with custom electronics. They perform beautifully on tour and I’m considering adding a vintage Guild amp.

I’m reading pretty bad reviews of the Model series. My take away is that they work at home at low volume as practice amplifiers.

I read GAD‘s review of the Model Four. Does anyone know if the Model Three has such inadequate electronics? Was it actually made by Guild or was it a cheap amp slapped with a Guild logo?

Here’s what I am considering the Model Three for.
I want to mod it so it can also be used as an 8 ohm speaker cabinet as an extension for my ZT Amplifiers Jazz Club. I still need to use the Model Three as a combo amp as well at at home.

I would have a Jensen C15N (or similar) speaker installed.

I need it for stage performance which can get loud with our guitar, organ, two horns, congas, and drums format. I am playing my 1966 T100 and my tone is straight ahead jazz, clean and loud (think Grant Green).

I like the idea of the Model Three for this purpose because it is vintage Guild and the 15” speaker format would match nicely with my Jazz Club’s 12”.

Do you think I’m wasting my time with a Model Three or can this mod I am envisioning work?

Thanks for the help and happy holidays to all!

 

[Default]

Hi Boss.

IMHO, you would be better off with a Microcube. You can get them for 50 bucks used, and they are better, more versatile amps. They also have a lineout, so you can run it into a pa.
The solid-state Guild amps are not worth it.

 

[Boss]

Hi D, that’s kind of where I am leaning now. Maybe I can I can just cut the amp out of the circuit and use it as a speaker cabinet. I could always get the amp worked on later.

I’ll be stewing over this the next few days, no doubt!

 

[Boss]

The Model Three would be a beast to haul around simply for its speaker but relying on venues and outdoor stage sound reinforcement is a bummer. I’m just really looking for something to make the ZT Jazz Club sound bigger.

 

[The Guilds of Grot]

Well I might me stating the obvious, but the Model Three was designed as a bass guitar amp. Unless you are looking for crappy sound and tone at bedroom volumes and/or getting it for free, I would look elsewhere!

 

[Nuuska]

Hello from Finland

As FOH engineer and hobby-guitar-player I dare to stick my spoon into this soup.

If you need more volume - that means more speaker cone area - luckily we talk about guitar - low end being @80Hz
An extension cab with similar speaker than in the amp will give you maybe 3db more output - depending of amp construction, maybe 4dB but that's about it - nothing much - on paper it sounds twice the power level ( which it is ) - but human hearing needs about 10dB more for us to think it's twice as loud.

My solution could be - there are more - to find two super-sensitive ( over 100dB/W 16 ohm 50W or more ) speakers - wire them parallel to get 8ohm. Plus-side of this stack would be the combo amp getting raised closer to ear-level.

Next solution requires info of that amp - unfortunately their netsite had no user-manual - but I can see, that the internal speaker can be turned OFF - and that makes me think, that in that case you could have 4ohm external load ( originally internal 8 + external 8 = 4ohms total )

If that's possible - then two identical 2x15 cabs @8ohm each would yield most SPL from you rig.

And while we are talking about guitar cabs and not bass cabs - the construction could be very lightweight - using right materials - like 8mm baltic birch with internal bracing - like in those balsawood airplanes we built 50 years ago. Before you run to say it is too light material - I once built 2x18 bass bins using 10mm baltic birch with plenty of bracings - and they turned out good - but there was a lot of extra work comparing to traditional cabinet making.


Finally - that amp of yours seems to have nifty speaker-voiced XLR output to plug into pa . . . if you have someone decent at FOH . . .


EDIT

You could also get a powerful active pa-speaker and feed that from the XLR-output.

 

[Boss]

Hello Nuuska,

Great advice, thank you for the detailed reply.

I think the key thing I’m looking for here is the Guild branding.

I know the wood constructing this amp is heavy duty. I’m thinking of dropping the amp out, leaving the silver face plate, and having an empty cabinet housing only the speaker (which would save a few pounds off the weight).

In that case I just need to buy an 8 ohm loudspeaker, correct?

It doesn’t matter what the current ohm rating is on the Model Three as a combo amp, correct?

I would essentially be converting the amp into a passive speaker cabinet.

it’s 15 inch speaker would be a nice bass accompaniment to the loud, bright, ZT combo amp sitting on top of it.

 

[Nuuska]

Hello

8ohms is correct - single speaker 100W or more if you intend to play on full volume

 

[Default]

It depends on the quality of the speaker. I would suggest that it isn't Eminance Big Ben territory?

 

[mavuser]

if u want to use a Guild Model 3 amp for a gig with a paying audience, u are crazy.

 

[mavuser]

u can snag this Guild Thunderstar bass cab from GC. https://www.guitarcenter.com/Used/G...UNDER-STAR-BASS-CAB-Bass-Cabinet-116404610.gc

 

[Rambozo96]

I guess you can use the amp as just a cab but there are other ways to go about doing this. In my opinion the vast majority of early solidstate amps with the exception of the old Standel and Vox amps can sound thin, fizzy and overall uninspiring. (which to my understanding the Model 3 is early SS so I’ll guess it’s likely nothing special.). If you can get a Model 3 cheap enough I don’t see why not as long as you pay attention to the speaker wattage of the new 15”.

 

[cupric]

Use a vintage Guild combo cabinet and put a Fender Deluxe Chassis inside running a 15" speaker. Mojo has a great kit. It might be a bit more expensive....

 

[Default]

Use a vintage Guild combo cabinet and put a Fender Deluxe Chassis inside running a 15" speaker. Mojo has a great kit. It might be a bit more expensive....

GAH! NOOOOO!!!!!

If that's the case, just get a Guild Superstar with the JBL. But I would just go with Mavuser's advice and pick up one of the Guild 15" extension cabs. I was looking at driving up there and getting one, but I haven't been getting any days off to do it.

 

[mavuser]

it appears there is only one Thunderstar Bass 1x15 at GC, not two, as it may appear on their website. I could be altogether wrong, or they had 2 and one sold (or they have zero)

 

[fronobulax]

I think the key thing I’m looking for here is the Guild branding.

In which case you might try finding an amp that has a logo that you can remove and install on the cabinet of your choice. I suspect very few people will notice that was done and you might have fun conversations with those who do.

Better yet, as suggested, just track down a Guild branded speaker enclosure and use that.

 

[mavuser]

here is a Guild/Hartke 4x10 located in Minnesota

Used Guild Hartke 410 Bass Cabinet | LaVonne Music

LaVonne Music has many new, used and vintage instruments and amplifiers in stock now! We are located in Savage, MN just 5 minutes off 35W.

www.lavonnemusic.com

 

[Nuuska]

... a logo that you can remove and install on the cabinet of your choice. . . .

Now that you say that . . .

I have couple GUILD-logos that originate from guitar cases - the thick ones - and also have an old Dynacord 2x12 cabinet with sumptin inside and tolex removed - metal grille instead of cloth. It looks funky as is - but why not install a GUILD-logo on it - thx for idea.

 

[matsickma]

Who bought the two Thunderstar Bass cabs at the Allentown GC store? I was trying to negotiate a better price and didn't close the deal. Since I already have 3 of them I wasn't a highly motivated buyer but they were local to me.
Just curious. They are a pretty nice and practial cabs. I modified 1 of 3 with a 4-10 baffel board.
M

 

[Boss]

Hello

8ohms is correct - single speaker 100W or more if you intend to play on full volume

Hi Nuuska,
You are right on target with your thoughts about the wattage. Check out my update on the completed project. In short, I am currently playing it with a 50 W rated Jensen driver and I bough the 250 version as a backup in case I chose to use it strictly as an extension cab.