Any Home Audiophiles Out There

[West R Lee]

Here's the deal. Let's say I'd like to drive 4 speakers in one room, 2 in another and 2 in another, with the capacity to switch on/off each room independently? I'm a big fan of both Yamaha receivers and of Harmon/Kardon. Since I haven't bought a home stereo in 15 or so years, and would like to cut down on my research time, do any of you have any knowledge or suggestions concerning a future receiver for my home? I understand there are also a few with which you can listen to different sound sources in different rooms?

Way back when, I do know that the primary concern/criteria that many of us used in selecting our home units was what they then, and still may call THD, or total harmonic distortion......which was one of the several reasons I chose my present Yamaha receiver. It has .003 THD as I recall....still outstanding by any standards, also has what they called discrete circuitry and from what I always gathered, that was like hand picking the components. I drive a couple of Infiniti towers and a Yamaha sub with that. Sounds outrageously fabulous, but again, it is 15 years old and won't drive the other rooms. I also have a couple (to give you an idea of how seriously I've always taken it) of 70's Norman Lab's that I no longer use, but still sound great. It's been a very long time since I've researched home stereos.

I was also thinking of either ceiling mount or small wall mount speakers such as Bose or Klipsch....any thoughts there? I'm having (and already have) 300 feet of Monster cable to be run through the walls and attic. Longest run will be approx. 50 ft. each, to drive 2 of the speakers. Any resistance concerns there?

Thanks in advance for any help. Where's Mr. P when you need him?

Let me recap with specific questions.

1) Is there a Yamaha or Harmon/Kardon receiver out there capable of driving to different rooms of the house simultaneously and/or independently? Is there one capable of supplying two audio sources?

2) Is 14 gauge Monster Cable adequate to carry the signal? I think so, but would like affirmation.

3) What are some of the best, very small or cube speakers for wall mounting? What are some of the best for a ceiling flush mount? Am I on to it with Klipsch, Bose or Infinity?

West

 

[cjd-player]

I think you should just put a guitar in every room, and PLAY instead of listening. :mrgreen:





I'm no audiophile, but from things I've read there is apparently a lot of hype about speaker cables (just like with electric guitar cables). Seems that in some well-publicized blind listening tests, common zip cord (lamp cord) was indistinguishable in the sound quality coming from very high-end speakers compared to expensive cables such as Monster and the like. But again, I'm no audiophile; I just noodle on guitar a little.




Also, as you get older (not that you're old or anything the like that :wink: ), our ability to hear that THD becomes decreased anyway.

 

[West R Lee]

:lol: Good point. Already have the Monster Cable.....got it for far less than half price.....couldn't pass on that. I'm getting ready to run it in the new house, and was wanting advice on the speaker and receiver.

Thanks Carl...how ya been?,

West

 

[Jeff]

What's the word on Wireless, we installed a wireless transmit/receive on our computer's audio. Sends a wireless signal to a receiver currently attached to a Bose Radio in the living room.

 

[krysh]

very difficult topic jim.
first of all it depends on the style of music you like to hear and more low bass or more accurate bass (how much power you will need in which roomsize) and more analytic or more musical. then don't forget your home cinema - surround sound?.
for sure you can't go wrong with the middle to high price h+k or yamaha but there are a lot manufacturers out there which produce high quality audiostuff. I am also 15 years out of this topic but If I had the choice right know I definately would consider a tube preamp with tube poweramp and a horn system connected throuch a good audiocard with my computer plus a good cd-player. but regarding the speaker and the amp it depends on your ears what you prefer. I also would take some time to listen to various combinations. this is what I did when I bought my stuff. at least you got the cables - ot took me one afternoon to choose mine 15 years ago

my 2cts.

 

[Graham]

By the looks of the pictures you sent me West, I think all of that monster cable coiled up under the candenser might be just the ticket. Crank that baby up and you'll have no trouble getting sound to every part of the estate.

As for the BBQ, I prefer gas and we know that you do as well so give it a go. Who knows, you might get a visit from Al Gore himself.

The puppies are beautiful. Local breed you say, I would have thought they were part British.

 

[tjmangum]

The guys over at this site, I'm sure can help

West,
In my continual search for things that I find neat and distracting, (not to mention catching up with things 25 years ago that I found neat but couldn't afford that now are pennies on the dollar) I have in the last month at a couple of estate sales stumbled across a Sansui receiver from the early 70's with a matching pair of huge Sansui speakers (2000 and 4000 series respectively) and a German made Dual 1019 turntable. So far the best source of information I have found has been this forum: http://www.audiokarma.org/

Appears to be a good, informative group and I find it interesting that in some cases people are adding to threads that were started years ago.

Good luck,

tj

PS Also have started picking up old Zenith short wave radios and .....

 

[West R Lee]

Thanks guys. TJ, I appreciate the link, I'll check that out.

West

 

[jp]

Hey there West,
I'm a member at audiokarma, but lately, I mostly lurk. I used to post more often before I just became satisfied with my gear. There's a wealth of knowledge and very friendly folks there. Most of the people are like me (and tj )--people who dig older gear that's built to last--kinda like Guild guitars. There are some audiophiles, but most are vintage gear fans. Another forum http://www.audioasylum.com is more accurately the forum for serious audiophiles. The main difference is that they spend $5000 on speakers lauded in the latest mags and websites, and I find mine (that cost $1000 new in 1982) at Goodwill with deteriorated foam surrounds for $20.00. I replace the surrounds, listen happily, and take my kids out for ice cream a little more often.

I must admit that I'm not up with the latest gear, which is very highly focused on surround sound and home theater usage. I'm not ashamed to admit that I know very little compared to most of the people there. However, I would suggest determining a few things before posting there, 'cuz they'll ask you the same questions:

1) Budget: Really, you can spend $400 on a receiver, or you can spend $20,000. . . really. :shock:
2) Do you want a two-channel system or are you going to use the same system for home theater and surround sound?
3) Do you want separates, i.e., preamp, power amp, etc, or do you want an integrated receiver?
4) What are your main sources? LP, CD, DVDs, cassette, 8-track :mrgreen:?
5) In order to simplify things, if you're at all considering some kind of home theater set up, I would think about it separately from a 2-channel system that you would use for music--much much easier to deal with. Most of the karma folk have at least two or more setups. I have two, one in the living room and one in the basement with my instruments. Also, don't discount your old gear. My late-70s Marantz integrated stereo amp is eons above anything found in Best Buy today. Like tj, I choose to buy older gear that was TOTL in its day. You'll often get more bang for your buck that way.
6) That said, do you prefer new gear? vintage gear? doesn't matter?

If you precede your questions with the answers to your questions on AK, you'll get tons of great suggestions. A very exciting thing to be doing.
Good luck!
JP

 

[West R Lee]

jp, thanks....truth is, if Mrs. West would let me put my infiniti towers in the living room, I'd use my old speakers (Infinity Towers) and receiver (Yamaha), and which sound unbelieveably fabulous. I think she's going to want somethink more compact. She loves the idea of pre-wiring the house and mounting the mush more compact, almost invisible small Klipsch or Bose models. I just don't think my 15 year old Yamaha will drive all of the speakers, to include 4 in the living area, 2 in the kitchen and we'll say 2 on the back porch.

Looking at H/K and Yamaha models, it looks as if they're not made like they used to be. All emphasis being on home theater, and less put into true sound quality. THD on the newer models is approx 10 times what I've got on my old receiver. :shock: I'm still looking, but may just have to be happy with my old receiver.

West

 

[jp]

Looking at H/K and Yamaha models, it looks as if they're not made like they used to be. All emphasis being on home theater, and less put into true sound quality. THD on the newer models is approx 10 times what I've got on my old receiver.

Yup, and build quality is usually poorer too.

I think she's going to want something more compact.

Gotcha. However, with my limited knowledge of newer gear, I would still assume that horsepower is horsepower. Anything capable of driving wattage will need some breathing space. The simplest solution may be just to purchase a power amp for more cojones and use the preamp section of your integrated amp--that is of course if it's possible with your amp (assuming it's an integrated amp w/a receiver).

1) Is there a Yamaha or Harmon/Kardon receiver out there capable of driving to different rooms of the house simultaneously and/or independently? Is there one capable of supplying two audio sources?

2) Is 14 gauge Monster Cable adequate to carry the signal? I think so, but would like affirmation.

3) What are some of the best, very small or cube speakers for wall mounting? What are some of the best for a ceiling flush mount? Am I on to it with Klipsch, Bose or Infinity?

1) Absolutely. And there are countless options depending on your budget. If there are any audiophile stores in your area, especially the ones that also carry used gear, I'd suggest getting some advice. They usually have a good perspective and won't rule out high quality gear from several years back that outperform the new off-the-shelf gear.

Some gear I really like:
-- NAD
-- older Carver gear
-- shiny silver stuff from the late 70s early 80s, i.e. Pioneer, Marantz, Yamaha.
-- Yamaha early 90s, maybe yours? Perhaps a CX-1000 preamp and a powerful amp is your ticket, or the 850 watt monster MX-1000 integrated amp?

I really could go on forever into more brands, and exact models, but I'm still not certain about your needs. You'll get barraged at AK with suggestions.

2) If you're running beyond, say 150-200 feet, I would go to 12. Otherwise 14 is probably fine.

3) Same thing--lots of choices. In general, because they do professional audio gear too, I still think all the Harman Companies put out quality: JBL, Infinity, Harmon-Kardon. Yet sometimes great things are found in uncommon places. The legendary tiny cube Realistic Minimus 7 speakers are thrift store treasures that outperform most of the prominent brand-name plastic junk. Metal casings, 40 watts each. Some folks do minor mods to them achieving stellar performance, on par with speakers that cost a lot more. Once again, it all depends on what your budget and needs.

 

[West R Lee]

Well jp, went to Best Buy and looked last night. Now I'm more confused than ever. @ zone stereo receivers....hm, some with Serius and some with XM, some with both. You're right, the new Yamaha receivers have substantiall more THD that my early 90's does. The salesman bragged about the sound of us combined with a set of small Klipsch speakers. I listened, but no for long....yuk! No hurry, I'll just keep looking and studying.

Here's the deal, Mrs. West hates the size of my Infiniti towers.....but maybe the finest sounding speakers I've ever heard, Problem is they are about 4' tall and 1 1/2 feet wide, an awesome 3 way speaker with a tremendous tweeter......combined with a good sub, it just doesn't get much better. I drive them with a middle of the road, early 90's Yamaha receiver, It's actually made other guys mad to listen to that outfit, when they have a much more expensive unit at home that doesn't come close. With so little distortion even at the highest volume, it outperforms many units with higher peak output, and that's what really gets their goat.

I just need something I can drive say 4 smaller speakers in the living room, and we'll say 2 outside speakers. Sound quality is everything. Unimpressed with the Yamaha receiver I heard last night, and the small Klipsch speakers, I don't know where to start. Even the very best small cube Bose speakers can't hold a candle to my 15 year old Infiniti towers......can anything?

Just a receiver with little distorion, XM capable and an incredible set of small speakers is all I ask. Primarily for nusic Cd's, we do occasionally watch a DVD.

West

 

[jp]

Hey West,

I think it'll be hard (or very expensive) to find a do-it-all receiver with the performance of yours (love that era of Yamaha gear!) that also includes modern XM and multizone features, especially in small package. Some of your desires could be fixed by a simple add-on unit, such as a speaker selector or an additional power amp, but again, space. A cool feature of some new multizone A/V receivers is that you can get surround sound and specify 2-channels for a different separate stereo system. But I'm sure you already got that pitched to you.

Try your luck on AK, especially about the flush mount speakers. They'll share lots of good wisdom, since like you and me, they like old school gear but have had to make the choices for modern features too.

Also, here's a pretty good article about wading through the choices today.
http://www.crutchfield.com/learn/learningcenter/home/receivers.html

 

[West R Lee]

Do folks like Yamaha, H/K, or Sony not make fabulous sounding gear anymore jp, or is it that they do, but it costs a fortune. What about MacIntosh? Do they still make incredible stuff? And is the only great Carver stuff, the old stuff?

West

 

[hideglue]

What about MacIntosh? Do they still make incredible stuff?

West

Hi West,

I really like McIntosh gear!

I can't speak for their modern line, but before I was a full-blown audiophile**, my system had a McIntosh MC2205 amp --- coupled with an all NAD front end and Definitive Tech's BP10 speakers. That system was the most fun I had with audio, even after my foray into high end. Selling off the current rig and re-acquiring that "modest" system has been on my mind for years.

** entry level in the Stereophile/ Absolute Sound world

 

[West R Lee]

Ah bullshoot Hide, you've probably forgotten more about sound than I'll ever know. It just blows me away that like most other products that have innovated through the years, stereo equipment hasn't apparently. It seems everything is geared towards surround sound and appreciation for true stereo sound has been lost.

Finest sounding stereo I've ever heard was back in the 70's....a Mac amp, Sony turntable, some kind of noise filter though huge Norman towers. Haven't heard anything like it since.....and that includes a bunch of live performances.

West

 

[hideglue]

It just blows me away that like most other products that have innovated through the years, stereo equipment hasn't apparently. It seems everything is geared towards surround sound and appreciation for true stereo sound has been lost.
West

Agreed West. And most of the garbage these kids are downloading and blaring into their ears or plugging into their mp3 ready car systems is atrocious sounding. But I'm not sure they're even aware of that. I'm afraid the modern interpretation of audio innovation is based on convenience, not fidelity.

 

[West R Lee]

Good Crutchfield article jp, thank you sir.

West

 

[jp]

Do folks like Yamaha, H/K, or Sony not make fabulous sounding gear anymore jp, or is it that they do, but it costs a fortune. What about MacIntosh? Do they still make incredible stuff? And is the only great Carver stuff, the old stuff?

West

Exactly, exactly, and exactly. Sadly Carver is no more, so the old stuff is the only stuff. Yamaha, H/K and Sony still make high-end stuff, and you'll pay dearly for it--probably $1500-2500. It seems like only the biggies focus on offering the complete package of audiophile quality with modern digital features. Some midsize and boutique companies like NAD, Paradigm, Creek, Music Hall, Adcom, etc. have some modern offerings, but have been forced to focus on the high-end, like Macintosh. I'm still always impressed with NAD gear. I think that since there's such a focus on modern digital features nowadays and the art of listening has diminished. To today's younger generations, a vintage Macintosh means this . . .

My humble system is purely 70s and 80s fare. Marantz 2252B amp, 6350Q turntable, older Polk Audio monitors and sub. I'd add a pair of Pioneer HPM100 or JBL L100 for better mids, if I had the space. I'm content for now though.

Agreed West. And most of the garbage these kids are downloading and blaring into their ears or plugging into their mp3 ready car systems is atrocious sounding. But I'm not sure they're even aware of that. I'm afraid the modern interpretation of audio innovation is based on convenience, not fidelity.

+1
The convenience of internet music downloads have also ruined the art of the record or even CD. Now it's just one tune at a time.

 

[capnjuan]

To today's younger generations, a vintage Macintosh means this . . .

... instead of ....