Need a Little Help Here (Long)

[twocorgis]

Coming out of lurk mode for a long rambling post...

I am the original owner of a '73 Guild D-50 (Serial 80652) that will need a need a neck reset soon. I have known about this for some time now, as my previous luthier had advised me about this some time back when Guild was still in Westerly. At the time I spoke to someone there about getting it done, and they seemed amenable to covering this repair under warranty. I really didn't want to ship it at the time, and planned on driving it up to Westerly myself when I had the time. Of course, I never found the time, and the guitar ended up spending a fair amount of time being (but never unloved) while I went through my archtop stage with the X-175.

Fast forward a few years to the present when I have rediscovered my love of fine acoustics. I brought the D-50 to my present luthier for a setup, and he has the saddle shaved down as low as it can go. He also recommended a neck reset sometime soon, as the action is still good, but there's no more wiggle room for future adjustments.

The upcoming gathering at New Hartford gave me the idea that it might be a good time to get the reset done, though it turns out that New Hartford doesn't do that kind of thing anyway, but I digress. I gave a call to Fender out in CA last night inquiring about getting a neck reset done, and they (at least the fellow I talked to) said that they won't cover a neck reset on a "vintage" instrument any more, even though I'm the original owner and still have the original receipt. :x

I'd be interested in hearing others experience here, and perhaps if there is some avenue I can pursue towards getting this covered under warranty if at all possible. Maybe some of you might know something I don't know. My present luthier, who's not only very good but very reasonable, quoted me around $400 for the job. I'd be willing to pay that, but wanted to exhaust all the other possibilities first.

Anyone?... Anyone?... Bueller?

Thanks in advance for any and all advice!

 

[alpep]

I am not sure of the warranty provisions.

but most warranties I am aware of are "limited lifetime warranty" which means the company can choose what they want to cover or not.

I hope you are able to work it out.

 

[adorshki]

HI there are several factors I can see coming into play. The main one is that "lifetime" means either yours or theirs and I suppose a case could be made that the Guild that built your guitar's lifetime ended when they were acquired by Fender. It's possible that somewhere deep in the paperwork of the acquisition is a commitment by Fender to continue to honor these warranties but I suspect it would be a situation where it'd cost more to prove it than to pay for the work. In fact if memory serves Guild was owned by Avnet when you bought it and than another entity before Fender acquired 'em in '95. The point being that ownership of Guild has changed several times since you bought and I suspect the person you talked to is legally correct. I hope at least they were polite.
In fact I even hope someone else may say I'm wrong! But I certainly understand wanting to check out the possibility. I've got a similar situation with slight bridge lift on my F65 which is DEFINITELY under warranty, but I'm torn between shipping it off (not desirable) and waiting possibly a LONG time (also not desirable), or just letting my local guy I trust do it even though I gotta pay. He USED to be a Fender warranty shop but doing warranty work is actually not very profitable, it can be very time consuming for fixed rates. I understand, I used to be in a similar business which handled warranty work.

 

[devellis]

Frankly, I'd have the local guy do it. You'll probably be without it for a shorter time and the communication with someone you deal with face-to-face will be better. If it needs an additional adjustment after the reset settles in, the local guy will probably do that gratis (as part of the cost for the reset). Plus, it sounds like Guild won't do it under warranty.

$400 sounds about right. Make sure that'll cover everything you want done. You'll probably want it to have a thorough going-over while it's in there. My guy always goes from stem to stern and tells me what he recommends. If the saddle has been shaved, you'll need a new one. Might as well get it compensated. Tuners okay? You may well want the frets leveled and re-crowned. Check the condition of the bridge plate and braces. None of that is likely to be that expensive (unless you need a new bridge, bridge plate, some new braces, etc., which is unlikely). Just be clear about what the whole job will run.

Your guitar may well feel as good or better than new when you get it back. Bite the bullet and get it done, is my suggestion.

 

[twocorgis]

Frankly, I'd have the local guy do it. You'll probably be without it for a shorter time and the communication with someone you deal with face-to-face will be better. If it needs an additional adjustment after the reset settles in, the local guy will probably do that gratis (as part of the cost for the reset). Plus, it sounds like Guild won't do it under warranty.

$400 sounds about right. Make sure that'll cover everything you want done. You'll probably want it to have a thorough going-over while it's in there. My guy always goes from stem to stern and tells me what he recommends. If the saddle has been shaved, you'll need a new one. Might as well get it compensated. Tuners okay? You may well want the frets leveled and re-crowned. Check the condition of the bridge plate and braces. None of that is likely to be that expensive (unless you need a new bridge, bridge plate, some new braces, etc., which is unlikely). Just be clear about what the whole job will run.

If my local guy does it, I have no doubt that it will come out fine. The guy's a total perfectionist!

Your guitar may well feel as good or better than new when you get it back. Bite the bullet and get it done, is my suggestion.

You're probably right, and it's probably what I'll end up doing anyway. I just think it's the right thing for Guild to do

 

[AlohaJoe]

I think Bob is exactly right... I'd go for the local guy too (assuming he's familiar with older Guild neck resets). I had my '65 D50 done late last year ($500) and it's like a new guitar. Go for a complete set up, fret dress etc if you need it and can afford it. On a '73 D50... whatever it needs and oh baby, the difference will be stunning.

 

[Taylor Martin Guild]

I TOTALLY DISAGREE!!!

Fender is now the owner of the Guild name and they owe it to us Guild owners to honor the warranty.
This is very disturbing to me.
I'm glad that I sold my JF-30-12.
It sounds like the warranty that I had for it was worth toilet paper.
Fender SUCKS!!!!

We need to do something about this!!!!

 

[Dr. Spivey]

Someone here had a reset done on an older Guild, under warranty. IIRC, there is a limit on how far back they honor the warranty. 20 years, prior to Fender's buying Guild, is what I remember. That would make the cutoff 1975.

From a legal standpoint, I don't believe they have to honor warranties more than 5 years or so before the buyout, but I could be wrong.

 

[twocorgis]

I TOTALLY DISAGREE!!!

Fender is now the owner of the Guild name and they owe it to us Guild owners to honor the warranty.
This is very disturbing to me.
I'm glad that I sold my JF-30-12.
It sounds like the warranty that I had for it was worth toilet paper.
Fender SUCKS!!!!

We need to do something about this!!!!

Can't argue with you there! Like I said before, I think it's the right thing for Guild to do, witnessed by the fact that they basically agreed to do it when I talked to them when they were still in Westerly. I's probably my fault for not having it done then, knowing that it would be necessary eventually.

Still doesn't make it right though.

 

[dapmdave]

Someone here had a reset done on an older Guild, under warranty. IIRC, there is a limit on how far back they honor the warranty. 20 years, prior to Fender's buying Guild, is what I remember. That would make the cutoff 1975.

From a legal standpoint, I don't believe they have to honor warranties more than 5 years or so before the buyout, but I could be wrong.

Lifetime Warranty: Good for the lifetime of the warranty, I guess!

Dave

 

[GardMan]

I think jazzmang has a couple of guitars at the Nashville repair shop (used to be the custom shop). I wonder if he would have a direct contact for someone there, and whether a little talking might get it done under warranty. Wouldn't hurt to try... (wonder if I can find the paperwork for my D-35 at my folks house when I visit this summer...). D

 

[AlohaJoe]

I fully understand the outrage... they should do what they said they'd do. If they were still Guild I might be tempted, but they're not Guild, they're Fender.

I might have been able to get Fender to do it when I needed the neck reset on my '65 last year, but even if I had the time and inclination to to fight with them about doing it, I honestly didn't want Fender to do it. I also didn't want to go to the expense, time or trouble of packing and shipping a great vintage guitar halfway across the country so it could be worked on by somebody I don't know. They could hand it off to the least experienced person in the building for all I know, and then when I get it back and it's not right, do I send it back again?

I hand-delivered it to an experienced luthier here in town who I know and trust. We talked about how I wanted the action, string brands, gauge etc. He had it a week and when it was done I got to inspect it before I accepted the work. He also suggested I bring it back a month later for fine tuning on the set-up after it settled in, which I did, at which time he tweaked the truss rod.

It came out perfect.

Saving a few bucks isn't worth it to me considering the risk of 2 cross-country shipments, an unknown repairman and an inability to check the work BEFORE UPS breaks it in transit. The money saved minus the dual shipping isn't enough to offset the risk to a well-loved instrument for me.

 

[Dr. Spivey]

Here's the thread I was thinking about in my earlier post: http://www.letstalkguild.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11618&p=123706&hilit=fender+warranty#p123706 It states that when Fender purchased Guild, they agreed to warranty back to 1980. However in this case they did work on a guitar older than that.

This is the current Guild warranty: http://www.guildguitars.com/resources/warranty_information.php Note in particular items #3 and #7 under Limitations and Exclusions.

A warranty on anything isn't a matter of right or wrong, it's a matter of the manufacturer's legal obligation. On anything you purchase with a warranty, you need to read and understand the document, and determine what value the warranty has to you. To me the warranties on guitars aren't worth a lot. Something, but not much.

twocorgis, in this case, if I were you, I would have the work done locally at my own expense.

My opinion of Fender regarding this is that by covering guitars back to 1980, they are exceeding their legal obligation. Their current warranty is typical of the other guitar manufacturers.

 

[marcellis]

"...Your guitar may well feel as good or better than new when you get it back. Bite the bullet and get it done, is my suggestion."

Exactly the right answer. The guitar has gone 37 years without a neck reset. Pay to get it done and it will probably be good for 37 more.

 

[Rich]

Marcellis' advice for the win!!!

 

[devellis]

The guitar has gone 37 years without a neck reset. Pay to get it done and it will probably be good for 37 more.

Actually, from what I've read, it'll probably be set for longer than that. Once the body geometry has settled enough to require one reset, it tends to remain pretty stable and it may be a verrry long time, if ever, before a second reset is necessary. Of course, there will be exceptions, but remember, it's changes in the body more than the neck that cause a reset. If the body is subjected to the same stresses after the reset as before, things tend to remain in equilibrium. At least, that's what several luthiers have said.

 

[chazmo]

Ah, Sandy, just found the thread... Again, I'll contact our Fender rep and see if there's anything to be done in CT.

 

[6L6]

$400 is very reasonable for a neck reset ($500 is the minimum here in Silicon Valley).

The bottomline is you have a fabulous instrument in your possession and it deserves the best. Have your local luthier do the job. You'll be smilin' for a long time!

6

'77 D-50

 

[guildzilla]

I find FMIC's arbitrary warranty cutoff at 1980 to be entirely unacceptable.

When FMIC acquired Guild in 1995, they made no changes in the warranty info on the label or in the warranty booklet. The hype or promise continued to be a lifetime warranty for the original purchaser of the guitar, without adding any BS footnotes about guitars made before 1980. In every way they sought to capitalize on that Guild tradition and move forward from there.

I would try to climb the chain of command at FMIC to get the reset approved under the warranty. As with the thread linked above, a good step would be contacting the authorized Guild repair person for your area.

Best luck, Sandy. If you have to give up eventually and do the pragmatic thing, I understand. But I think principle is on your side concerning the warranty that came with your guitar.

 

[twocorgis]

I find FMIC's arbitrary warranty cutoff at 1980 to be entirely unacceptable.

<snip>

I would try to climb the chain of command at FMIC to get the reset approved under the warranty. As with the thread linked above, a good step would be contacting the authorized Guild repair person for your area.

Best luck, Sandy. If you have to give up eventually and do the pragmatic thing, I understand. But I think principle is on your side concerning the warranty that came with your guitar.

Thanks 'zilla! I've got a little help here. If worst comes to worst and I have to pay for it, it won't be a total loss as I love the guitar. Certainly no harm in trying.