How To Warm Up The Tone Of My GAD25

[DennisMiller]

Question for everyone, specially owners of GAD25 models...

My GAD seems to be built a bit on the heavy side and sounds very bright and isn't very loud... To be honest, I had anticipated a much warmer tone to it. Do you think this is just a matter of the guitar being immature or could I do anything to improve it? It's supposed to have a bone saddle already, something others recommended to warm it up and I currently have Elixir Polyweb strings on it, 12-53's.

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Dennis

 

[12stringer]

Hi Dennis
I tried several different sets of strings on my Gad25nat and found that d'addario pb lights sounded the best on it by quite a margin. If your elixers are too bright sounding, you may have to wait until the strings die down a bit. I experimented with heavier strings (mediium guages) and they always sounded a bit louder but somehow there was no depth of tone.
These Gads come from the factory with D'addario light pb's on them and I think the guitar was made with those strings in mind. The only other thing I did for mine was I changed out the Hi E and B strings for a heavier guage string to beef up the top end a bit. That's just my personal preference and playing style...and who knows...there may be variance from guitar to guitar of the same model.
Hope my little ramble has helped.

 

[DennisMiller]

The strings I have on it right now are Ernie Ball Coated Slinkys, not Elixir... My mistake, but I guess they are essentially the same thing... 13-54 gauge, so the B and E are just slightly heavier, but I suspect not enough to let the bass come through better.

So, here's what I just did, and to a small extent, I'm curious about this. I found a cow bone saddle I had previously cut for another guitar and it fits the Guild perfectly. I loosened the strings, fitted in the different saddle, put in some Tusq pins to deaden things a bit... and I think I hear some improvement in the direction I'm looking for.

It could still be the string issue, but I wonder if the bone saddle I was supposed to get with the guitar is really bone or something else. I can always heat a screw driver and touch it to the saddle to see what happens.

I think it's GHS that makes a set of strings with heavier low and high E strings. Maybe that would be the ticket, but I'll try to get something with a higher bronze content to see what happens too.

The other thing I may try is an armrest. Some time ago, I was given one by a friend who admired a guitar I had, but thought it would be so much better if I got my big arm off the top of the guitar. I always thought armrests were a comfort thing, but freeing up the top like it did made such a huge inprovement in the tone that I've put armrests on practically anything that holds still long enough. (My wife feels threatened!)

 

[taabru45]

I always thought armrests were a comfort thing, but freeing up the top like it did made such a huge inprovement in the tone that I've put armrests on practically anything that holds still long enough. (My wife feels threatened!)[/quote]

Be discreet....put one on yourself first... :wink: Steffan

 

[AlohaJoe]

Resting your arm on the top of a flat-top or archtop guitar damps it, killing volume and tone. Armrests are great if you can't learn to play without touching the top. Years ago a more experienced player asked me why I rested my right hand on the bridge when I played (another equally bad tone killing habit). I replied that I didn't really know why I did it and he said "Do you stuff a rag in your mouth when you sing?" :lol: I thought it was kinda rude at the time, but I got the message.

 

[DennisMiller]

In much the same way you rest your hand on the bridge, I rest my pinkie finger on the pickguard when I play fingerstyle. I've tried to consciously play with my hand up, but it's like patting my head and rubbing my belly, then trying to change.

And Steffan - I haven't needed to put an armrest on my wife because she has shoulders at the perfect height. I'm a foot taller than she is... :shock:

 

[Ian]

Question for everyone, specially owners of GAD25 models...

My GAD seems to be built a bit on the heavy side and sounds very bright and isn't very loud... To be honest, I had anticipated a much warmer tone to it. Do you think this is just a matter of the guitar being immature or could I do anything to improve it? It's supposed to have a bone saddle already, something others recommended to warm it up and I currently have Elixir Polyweb strings on it, 12-53's.

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Dennis

Trade it on a Westerly F30 ? :lol: I've got one and its amazingly loud and has sustain into the middle of next week. Lovely guitar, I'd suggest you have a look for one.

Happy hunting....

Cheers, Ian

 

[taabru45]

And Steffan - I haven't needed to put an armrest on my wife because she has shoulders at the perfect height. I'm a foot taller than she is... :shock:[/quote]


Perfect Dennis, I mean, no offense, it just that...I meant.....uhmmm....you're 6'7'...really, well nice....I mean..really nice to make your acquaintance ...... :lol: Steffan

 

[DennisMiller]

Hi Ian - Would love to own a Westerly, but that will be a goal once I'm working again. The volume of the GAD25 is not really an issue because I only play at home. A few times a year I jam with friends from the Acoustic Guitar Forum, but I don't gig anywhere.

I would like to put some boom in the guitar though. When I bought an all solid mahogany acoustic, I was hoping for a tone a bit more like a Martin D15. The Guild has certain niceties the Martin down't have and vice versa, but if I could move the tone in that direction, it would be the best of both worlds.

 

[taabru45]

Dennis, I remember seeing a you tube vid. of a guy playing a really nice Gad. 50 I think, he did a couple of things to it to unleash some of its sound, one of the things was to enlarge the sound hole a little bit...maybe I can find it for you...sir.... :lol: .Steffan

 

[Nigel Wickwire]

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by 'warmer' tone. I would suggest exploring different brands and sizes of strings. That is the easiest,cheapest way to alter the tone of a guitar. And it can make a big difference.

I'm pretty sure your GAD25 came with a bone saddle from the factory.

Frankly, enlarging the soundhole sounds rather extreme and I doubt it would accomplish anything. Just 'cause they do it Canada don't make it right for the rest of the world. :lol: If you end up trading the guitar (for something that suits you better) these kinds of modifications will make the guitar less appealing to the next guy.

Maybe you need one of those G-41s?:

http://letstalkguild.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=22525&hilit=G41

~nw

 

[playsvintageguilds]

I am very curious about this thread.
The armrest thing.

I kinda prop my hand up with a couple unemployed pick fingers to keep them from dampening my sound.
However,my arm does rest comfortably on the upper bass bout.

I play my vintage '67 and '73 guild acoustics all week.
On weekends I play my Taylors 910,810.

Do you folks think these attachable armrests really do free up sound/tonal qualities for an acoustic
as they are advertised ?
And...if you have electronics on board,ie. (K & K or L.R. Baggs) is the difference that noticeable ?
Convince me,please.
Just askin'.

~ Raj ????????

 

[frettedstrings]

Dennis,

Try some Silk and Bronze or Silk and Steel Strings. I like the GHS Silk and Bronze strings for my 6 string (D35) and I am going to try these same strings on my 12 string (F212) to see if I can get that warmer sound that you talk about. I know exactly what you mean, by the way. I don't like 'Tingly", "high pitched", "Thin Sounding" notes.


-frettedstrings

 

[AlohaJoe]

I kinda prop my hand up with a couple unemployed pick fingers to keep them from dampening my sound. However, my arm does rest comfortably on the upper bass bout. Do you folks think these attachable armrests really do free up sound/tonal qualities for an acoustic as they are advertised? And...if you have electronics on board,ie. (K & K or L.R. Baggs) is the difference that noticeable ?

Raj,
I think they do give a distinct tonal advantage. The loss of overtones, volume and especially sustain from a muted top will be more apparent unplugged. The top is the soundboard, so it's like putting your thumb on a speaker. Not everyone will notice a huge difference, but if you listen you wll hear it.

When plugged in, not so much depending on the type of pickup you have. If it's sensing vibrations in the top, when you dampen it you will lose overtones/sustain and volume. With a piezo, not so much. With a magnetic sound-hole type pickup probably little or no difference in the amplified sound a listener hears, but remember, when you plug in a flat-top guitar, unless you're in an arena sized venue, the listener is hearing both the acoustic and the electric sound.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!
- Joe W

 

[playsvintageguilds]

Hmm.. well I don't like the idea of adding more baggage to my guitar,
however, I will do more research and give this 'armrest' some serious consideration.
Thanks !
~ Raj

 

[GardMan]

Hey Dennis,
I'd experiment with different strings to find those which work best for you. If you want to boost the bass a bit, you might try going to "bluegrass" gauge strings, which typically are light gauge for the 3 treble strings and medium gauge for the bass strings. Lots of string makers will have such sets...

For the past 3-4 years I have been playing John Pearse Phosphor bronze on most of my Guilds... lights on the rosewood dreads, bluegrass on the ash and maple. I use JP phosphor bronze and silks(JP 610LM) on my mahogany D-35... they are a little warmer than reg PBs, and prefer 80/20 bronze on my D-25 (the bass sounded "muddy" with the JP PBs).

Some folks also believe that the bridge pins can affect the tone to a degree... and I have heard that ebony, boxwood, or horn pins can warm the tone some (relative to Tusq or bone).
Dave

 

[DennisMiller]

Hey Dennis,
and I have heard that ebony, boxwood, or horn pins can warm the tone some (relative to Tusq or bone).

I have ebony, boxwood and bone pins here, but only the ebony pins fit the Guild. The others are too big in diameter and stick up about 1/2" with the strings on.

I've put boxwood pins on my Baby Taylor and that convinced me the pins could actually have an effect on the tone. It made a believer out of me when I heard that little box turn from tin into a real guitar.

I know the GAD is supposed to come with a bone saddle, but the density of the bone might be questionable. The change to the bone saddle I had here made a difference. I can only guess it's a harder piece of bone. Your guess is as good as mine.

And thanks for the string recommendation. I'll order some first thing tomorrow if I can't find any around here.

 

[workedinwesterly]

you wanna know how to warm up a GAD ?
Put a match to it ! :lol:

 

[AlohaJoe]

you wanna know how to warm up a GAD? Put a match to it ! :lol:

I think he was asking for advice, not insults.

 

[adorshki]

I know the GAD is supposed to come with a bone saddle, but the density of the bone might be questionable. The change to the bone saddle I had here made a difference. I can only guess it's a harder piece of bone.

Last luthier I talked to said good quality bone's getting very hard to find. Very common to find "voids" when shaping. So I'd guess you might be right if you equate "hardness" with "density".