Floating DeArmond Pickups on the new Guild Archtops?

[jzzgtr]

What's the verdict on the Korean copies of the DeArmond 1000 Rhythm Chief and the 1100 Adjustable Superchief pickups?

Do they sound as good as the original DeArmond pickups?

Is Guild (or Fender) selling them separately yet?

Does anyone know where I could get an 1100 copy or find out about them?

My 1935 D'Angelico is getting lonely since the original DeArmond pickup I had broke down beyond repair!

 

[Brad Little]

Joe at Archtop.com often has actual vintage model 1000 and 1100 in stock, they also show up on eBay from time to time. They're not cheap.
Brad

 

[gilded]

..... the original DeArmond pickup I had broke down beyond repair!

Please define beyond repair.

 

[SFIV1967]

What's the verdict on the Korean copies of the DeArmond 1000 Rhythm Chief and the 1100 Adjustable Superchief pickups?

Kim Keller from Guild in New Hartford told me regarding the pickups at NAMM 2013: "FMIC owns the DeArmond designs, and they did a dead-nuts repro of the Rhythm Chief and Super Chief pickups. They sound just like the old DeArmonds, and that's a very good thing."
But I don't think they are available yet as replacements, you might want to check with a store who is an authorized Guild retailer.
Ralf

 

[jzzgtr]

...Thanks for the quick replies guys.

My father bought an RC 1000 for his 1935 D'Angelico back in the early 1960s, and it gradually fell apart after much use, and someone threw it out after 4 or 5 moves, although I still have the volume control/tone switch.
The RC 1000 had a basic flaw; it didn't pick up the high E string as well as it picked up the other five strings, and it used to drive me nuts, along with the hum it always got.
Someone who tried the Savoy at 2013 NAMM said that the Korean reproduction had copied the RC 1000 so well, that it still had that flaw!

 

[SFIV1967]

Someone who tried the Savoy at 2013 NAMM said that the Korean reproduction had copied the RC 1000 so well, that it still had that flaw!

Ha, ha, I love that! (I mean not the flaw but the fact that it was copied). As Kim Keller said : "they did a dead-nuts repro" !
Ralf

 

[jimmyl51]

I own a 1960 Guild A-500 with an original Guild DeArmond from 1960 on it. I did a comparison with a new Guild A-150 with the Korean DeArmond floater. Bottom line is that the Asian manufacturer has that pickup down period. Unless of course you are willing to put out crazy $$ for an original DeArmond floater! jim in Maine

 

[jzzgtr]

I own a 1960 Guild A-500 with an original Guild DeArmond from 1960 on it. I did a comparison with a new Guild A-150 with the Korean DeArmond floater. Bottom line is that the Asian manufacturer has that pickup down period. Unless of course you are willing to put out crazy $$ for an original DeArmond floater! jim in Maine

Oh man, the GAS is building...
The sound I'm going for is Kenny Burrell's sound on his Verve LPs from 1968 to the mid 70s.
He had an 1100 on his D'Angelico New Yorker, and other than Johnny Smith on his later Roost LPs (which also was done with a DeArmond 1100 and New Yorker), I've never heard a fatter tone since.
I know Smith plugged directly into the board for his later Roost LPs, but does anyone know if Burrell did the same when he recorded?

 

[jimmyl51]

I saw Kenny play that very guitar live i.e. the D.A. with the 1100 on it many years ago. To be honest I wouldn't GAS over the thing as very few of us will ever have the chance to play let alone own a D' Angelico with a DeArmond 1100 on it ;>).........I still feel in todays world the player with the most incredible sound is George Benson and he plays an Ibanez! jim in Maine

 

[a.modernist]

Don't give up. You have a '35 D'Angelico...it deserves the best! 1100s are out there to be had under the overly-inflated market value, but it may take some more digging and patience. KB's D'A sound during that era is certainly an admirable one and may be his sonic high-water mark in many ways. I don't *think* he was going straight into the board, but I could very well be wrong. I am pretty sure he was using Fender Twins by the mid-1960s or so, which may answer some questions.

There is also this pickup for consideration:

http://www.swingmasterpickups.com/index.php?id=102

I have yet to play one personally but I am very much intrigued. The maker says it is true reproduction of the 1000 with some slight modifications to address string balance. It certainly sounds promising and I am keen on getting my hands on one.

As an aside, I am not entirely convinced that the 1000 and the 1100 share the same guts as is the common assumption. I've played all of the DeArmond archtop pickup models and each have their own characteristics (and the FHC underwent slight modifications for years!). Of course it does vary from example to example, but my 1000 was notably different from my 1100. Two cents, at least.

I would LOVE to see some photos of your D'A! Good luck with your search.

 

[jzzgtr]

Don't give up. You have a '35 D'Angelico...it deserves the best! 1100s are out there to be had under the overly-inflated market value, but it may take some more digging and patience. KB's D'A sound during that era is certainly an admirable one and may be his sonic high-water mark in many ways. I don't *think* he was going straight into the board, but I could very well be wrong. I am pretty sure he was using Fender Twins by the mid-1960s or so, which may answer some questions.

There is also this pickup for consideration:

http://www.swingmasterpickups.com/index.php?id=102

I have yet to play one personally but I am very much intrigued. The maker says it is true reproduction of the 1000 with some slight modifications to address string balance. It certainly sounds promising and I am keen on getting my hands on one.

As an aside, I am not entirely convinced that the 1000 and the 1100 share the same guts as is the common assumption. I've played all of the DeArmond archtop pickup models and each have their own characteristics (and the FHC underwent slight modifications for years!). Of course it does vary from example to example, but my 1000 was notably different from my 1100. Two cents, at least.

I would LOVE to see some photos of your D'A! Good luck with your search.

KB used the Twin live, but I don't know if he used it when he recorded.
I used the 1000 with my D'A through a Peavy Vintage with two 12" SRO EV speakers, and the sound was incredible, but it was frustrating because it couldn't pickup the high E string loud enough. I was almost glad when it finally died on me. I then bought a Borys B-120, and that's my main gigging guitar.
I paid $500 to the guy who was known as KB's repairman to completely restore the D'A (fret job, new binding, minor crack repair, finishing touch-up). He had it for six months and he did a good cosmetic job, but I wasn't happy with the fret job, and gave it to Roger Borys for some more fret work.
Roger, who has a shop in Hoboken in the same building that Guild was located, did a good job, and also made a new bridge for it, because my father put a stock Gibson bridge on it. I picked it up from Roger at a club where Bucky Pizzarelli and Jack Wilkins were playing, and when I got there, Roger told me they both played it.
Bucky has almost the exact same guitar (made in 1934) and loved it, and Jack called it the best guitar in the world. Roger said when Bucky played the D'A, it was so loud, you could hear it all over the club- and this was acoustically! I'll post some pictures once my brother shows me how to transfer them to the computer.
Anyway, I went to Sam Ash yesterday, and the Guild Rep said you can't buy the pickup unless you've bought an Artist Award, so I guess I'll keep looking for an original.

 

[cc_mac]

Meanwhile, down the RC1000 rabbit hole
http://music-electronics-forum.com/t31801/

 

[gilded]

Meanwhile, down the 1000 rabbit hole
http://music-electronics-forum.com/t31801/

thanks, Chris, nice article.

 

[a.modernist]

Meanwhile, down the RC1000 rabbit hole
http://music-electronics-forum.com/t31801/

FANTASTIC link! Thanks for sharing. I had read some of Schwab's posts before, but somehow missed this one. What any interesting pickup. Of course now I want to see an 1100 get the same treatment for a comparison/contrast.

 

[jimmyl51]

Here you go and only $1350!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DeArmond-Rh...713?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item258a8669f9

 

[powerwagonjohn]

I have a de Armond 1000 on my 1952 Gibson L-4 and added a felt pad under the lower side to bring it closer to the high strings to get a more even sound out of the strings. I have been told that the de Armonds changed over the various years of production and that they were wound hotter and hotter as the years went by.
Thanks John

 

[a.modernist]

Good points John. Also, from my experience it's very difficult to get a DeArmond dialed-in if you are using the "monkey on a stick"/pressure rod. The neck bracket really is the way to go - although it takes a commitment!

 

[powerwagonjohn]

The pressure rod is kind of a funky set up but not as much of a pain as I thought it would be after first getting the guitar. I was worried it would scrw up the finish and rattle a lot but it's not too bad. Although I don't use it much as the L-4 is so nice acoustically.
Thanks John

 

[jzzgtr]

I'm happy to say that I just picked up my D'Angelico with the reissue 1100 DeArmond pickup on it, and the sound is fantastic!
Many years ago I had a DeArmond RC 1000 on it, and though it was very good, it didn't pick up the top E string well enough, and someone reported that the Korean shop that is making the re-issue for Guild has reproduced it so well, that it had the same problem.
The 1000 also used the monkey bar to secure the pickup, and it was a real PITA because the screws would come loose and the pickup would move. The tone and volume controls were also a PITA, because you had to use a smaller sized jack that would always fall out and had an electronic hum that was very annoying.

Since I bought the re-issue 1100 for only $60, I decided to follow Roger Borys' advice and have it attached to the pick guard instead of having him drill a hole in the neck and attaching it with the thin bar provided.

Roger was able to find a much better volume and tone control than the POS one I still had from the old RC 1000, and it has 1/4 inch jack rather than the smaller one the RC 1000 used.
According to Roger, it wasn't an easy job in an email he said- " Pickup works well. Was a pain in the *** getting it to fit. Had to cut the pole pieces. The guitar sounds really good acoustically and electrically."

It sounds much better than the RC 1000 sounded,with the high E string perfectly picked up, and has that beautiful bell-like sound that Johnny Smith and Kenny Burrell's D'Angelicos had.
It also has that incredible sustain that Smith's guitar had, and Roger had to literally kick me out of his shop because he wanted to go home, and i couldn't stop playing it through his Polytone Mini-Brute.
Roger emailed me a picture of it, and I'll try to post it if I can figure out how to attach it.
BTW, the guy who screwed up my fingerboard and fret job, also did the same thing to a friend of mine's D'Angelico, and the poor guy was in tears over it, and couldn't sleep for a month. I had to pay Roger $250 to further repair the mess he made out of my guitar, and yes, he used to work for Guild...

 

[Synchro]

Where can one obtain an 1100 reissue!