That's not a noife..... This is a noife...So no showdown?
That's not a noife..... This is a noife...So no showdown?
Hard to believe there may be folks here who've never seen Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, but just in case...That's not a noife..... This is a noife...
Just a feeling I seem to get from a few opinions, and maybe I´m wrong , but in your opinion is the F50r from New Hartford slightly superior to the Westerly made JF55? Any differences in tone?
Thanks
Thanks for the info guys... and any chance of getting more info... er....on topic?
Spoken like a true gentleman so will respond in the same spirit:
While I agree with Ray's basic premise that it's ultimately going to be up to your ear, off the top of my head I can think of at least 3 guys here who have experience with models from both Westerly and New Hartford and who do believe New Hartfords were "the Best".
2 of 'em are Chazmo and Twocorgiis who've already weighed in; and I could swear Chaz has even cited New Hartford F50's as the "best of the breed." Ahhh, post #7, here, and not the first time he's said it:
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/showthread.php?195448-JF-30-12-With-F-412-Comparison
One thing Ray mentioned deserves a bit of expansion:
The issue that every factory had its "duds".
Sure that's inevitable, but on sheer numbers:
A: Guild's production was so much smaller than Gibson and Martin that the actual number of duds out there is going to be pretty low, and
B: Because they were small enough they could pay a lot more attention to each individual piece than either of those "other 2 guys", especially in late Westerly.***
So their percentage of "duds" was exponentially smaller than the other 2 as well.
Here's an article from a '99 Guild Gallery:
http://www.westerlyguildguitars.com/articles/visionofquality.pdf
I also strongly suspect that when it came to their high-end models like the JF-55, that much more care was taken to ensure they'd "represent" well for the brand.
That thing bout JF-55's being under-valued due to being under-recognized appeals to my personal tastes, too.
Always love an underdog.
***and not to say they didn't do this in Corona, Tacoma, and New Hartford, I don't know, and they were certainly still "small enough", but I can present evidence for what they did in late Westerly.
:friendly_wink:
Just to make sure we're on the same page my meaning of dud was not to explain a plan out bad guitars build wise so much as one that didn't sing like the others . These are just the effects of the woods character as we have discussed before tops off the first two feet of trunk might sing like angels the next 2 ft above sound ok but with less angels these type duds are the ones the player says yeah or nay . I should of clarified that lol
Acoustic over resent years have gone through a sound/tone change which they call the modern tone . I would think the older Westerlys would carry a more woodier tone and or warmer sound compared to today's more brighter sounding guitars. The later or more recent of the Westerly line might have started that move to the so called modern tone .
Over all the Westerly owners would have to chime in for me to know if my discription is some what correct lol if not there's that crumbling Clif edge again ! Lmao .
My unfair comparison of my Westerly D55 and forget the year the last yr made 200 and ? Anyway my 2016 Blueridge has a Adirondack top where the D55 wise Sitka both rosewood backs and sides .
The D55 was great don't get me wrong it was balanced warm and articulate sweet ! My Blueridge was brighter and more sparkly. I lean more to the modern tone guitars . So I sold the D55 . I will own another one though in time .
The Tacoma CV-1 that I loved and sold was definitely warmer them the NH F30 and F30R that I played . The CV-1 had a 16" lower bout but I don't think the other account for that kind of difference .
Ok I'm done , thank God I was not drinking and forgive my typos and Ray speak . Lol
my Br ('71 D25 all hog flatback dread) is real warm and rather on the dark side tonewise. it took me a long time to really appreciate it. it has a very "woody" sound too, like a Gibson J45, but not as bright. it's hard to say, it is 48 years old tone woods, all solid construction, the top has no doubt opened up decades ago, but every now and then i notice more depth. my hard to say comment is more re this fact: any 48 year old solid wood dread will sound really good, in most cases. regardless of the manufacturer. one would think. what does never cease to amaze me is Guild's build quality even on their lower end models back then. my guild dread would have been the entry level dreadnought in 1971, msrp i think was around $225. I bet you could have got it with case for that or for 200 maybe even less. it has had one neck reset, that i know of. I also like the fact that Guild used truss rods way earlier than Martin did. 70 Martin dreads had to truss at all, and I dont think Martin added the truss till the late 80s. not sure.
Ah, fair enough, but in Westerly's case I think it was very rarely about the wood, at least not while Willie Fritscher was on the job:Just to make sure we're on the same page my meaning of dud was not to explain a plan out bad guitar build wise so much as one that didn't sing like the others . These are just the effects of the woods character as we have discussed before tops off the first two feet of trunk might sing like angels the next 2 ft above sound ok but with less angels these type of duds are the ones the player says yeah or nay to . I should of clarified that lol
I agree about the "modern tone". The idea that Westerlys might sound woodier sound plausible to me, going by my experience with my D25, which is now about 90% of my entire guitar experience.Acoustics over resent years have gone through a sound/tone change which they call the "modern tone ". I would think the older Westerlys would carry a more woodier tone and or warmer sound compared to today's more brighter sounding guitars.
Actually the late Westerlys saw the development of the "vintage" design principles in the "DV" 's and "GV"'s.The later or more recent of the Westerly line might have started that move to the so called modern tone ????
Interesting you mentioned that given my speculation about 'em above.The Tacoma CV-1 that I loved and sold was definitely warmer them the NH F30 and F30R's that I played . The CV-1 had a 16" lower bout but I don't think that accounts for that kind of difference .
's OK we wouldn't have it any other way.Ok I'm done , thank God I was not drinking and forgive my typos and Ray speak . Lol
Here here ! The OM-120 all hog I have actually is brighter then I wanted in this case . I want your guitars evilness !!! So the 120 will go up for sale.
Nah I think she's gunna round out but pretty much remain the same . She's got killer overtones plays great but I've become a bit of acoustic snob and I can no longer help myself my pinky is out and it means business! lolWhat you don't want to give it a 48 year chance?
Or you could get lucky:
My Corona D40 only needed 7.
Just FYI, my "best of breed" comment was meant for the (maple) F-50 from NH. That instrument outshined all the older F-50s (and JF-65s) I've played over the years.. . . I could swear Chaz has even cited New Hartford F50's as the "best of the breed." Ahhh, post #7, here, and not the first time he's said it:
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/showthread.php?195448-JF-30-12-With-F-412-Comparison
. . .
Just FYI, my "best of breed" comment was meant for the (maple) F-50 from NH. That instrument outshined all the older F-50s (and JF-65s) I've played over the years.
I'm not sure I ever tried NH version of the (rosewood) F-50R. I'm sure it's wonderful, but I have played some world-rocking older versions of that axe that would make me hesitate to call the NH version best of breed.
No apologies necessary, Al. But, since Geoff was asking about the F-50R I wanted to clarify.
I played a NH F-50-R a while back and that particular guitar did not do much for me (however the NH F-512 blew me away).
I also played a JF-55 and again, in addition to a crazy slim neck, for me personally just no real magic.
i like the rosewood dreads!