Compensated saddles.
- Thread starter evenkeel
- Start date
adorshki
Reverential Member
I can only hear my strings. Never hear my saddles. Maybe my horse can. :lol:
But seriously, once they're set up and tuned right I don't think it makes a difference. Otherwise I think Guild would have been doing it long ago.
But seriously, once they're set up and tuned right I don't think it makes a difference. Otherwise I think Guild would have been doing it long ago.
Qvart
Senior Member
evenkeel said:
It can help with intonation. Depends on the guitar. I wouldn't say it's necessarily an improvement if you aren't having any issues with intonation, buzzing, etc. I had a compensated bone saddle installed on my DCE1 and it helped a lot. Only so much you can do with the cheap stock saddles.
Taylor Martin Guild
Senior Member
Some guitars will benefit from a compensated saddle while others won't.
My Guild D-55 doesn't need one.
My Martin D-35 does.
My wife's Taylor 410 doesn't need one.
My Yamaha L-20A does.
When you check the intonation of the guitar, you will hear if it can be helped by a compensated saddle.
I won't try to explain what a compensated saddle can do for a guitar because I don't have enough knowledge to do so.
I do though, know how to test a guitar to see how it's intonation is.
Perhaps the 2 gents from the original post have guitars that are not in need of a compensated saddle.
I once played a Guild 12 string that belonged to Chris Proctor.
It was in a local Salt Lake guitar shop.
He had moved over to Taylor guitars and was selling the Guild.
It was the same model 12 string that I owned at the time.
I noticed that it had a fully compensated saddle and it sounded much better than mine did.
The intonation was much better than mine all the way up the neck.
The bridge slot had been enlarged and a wider saddle was used in order to have more room for compensation.
All of this leads me to believe that some guitars may benefit from a compensated saddle.
My Guild D-55 doesn't need one.
My Martin D-35 does.
My wife's Taylor 410 doesn't need one.
My Yamaha L-20A does.
When you check the intonation of the guitar, you will hear if it can be helped by a compensated saddle.
I won't try to explain what a compensated saddle can do for a guitar because I don't have enough knowledge to do so.
I do though, know how to test a guitar to see how it's intonation is.
Perhaps the 2 gents from the original post have guitars that are not in need of a compensated saddle.
I once played a Guild 12 string that belonged to Chris Proctor.
It was in a local Salt Lake guitar shop.
He had moved over to Taylor guitars and was selling the Guild.
It was the same model 12 string that I owned at the time.
I noticed that it had a fully compensated saddle and it sounded much better than mine did.
The intonation was much better than mine all the way up the neck.
The bridge slot had been enlarged and a wider saddle was used in order to have more room for compensation.
All of this leads me to believe that some guitars may benefit from a compensated saddle.
Bikerdoc
Senior Member
I was going to lay off Steve Earle but the compulsion is over-whelming. Steve, IMHO, doesn't play guitar well enough to make the "rubbish" comment. His songs, the lyrics of which I enjoy, aren't filled with much more than hard strumming (by Steve) and if there's a problem with intonation I doubt very seriously that he'd even notice. He has a particular finger picking style which he intentionally plays only in the 'G' position. He made the comment that he uses a capo and only plays G, C, D. I've never heard nor seen anything all that impressive as far as guitar technique goes.
I put a compensated saddle on 2 of my guitars and the difference was very noticeable. While I don't completely understand the mechanics I believe, in some guitars, a compensated saddle is an upgrade. If, in standard tuning the guitar sounds fine when you strum the 'G' chord but sounds off when you strum an open 'E', a compensated saddle will help. That was an issue with two of the guitars I own and I don't have that problem anymore. Also, I recently purchased a new Hummingbird (ooooooooops
) and it came with a compensated saddle. Intonation is just fine.
Peace
I put a compensated saddle on 2 of my guitars and the difference was very noticeable. While I don't completely understand the mechanics I believe, in some guitars, a compensated saddle is an upgrade. If, in standard tuning the guitar sounds fine when you strum the 'G' chord but sounds off when you strum an open 'E', a compensated saddle will help. That was an issue with two of the guitars I own and I don't have that problem anymore. Also, I recently purchased a new Hummingbird (ooooooooops
) and it came with a compensated saddle. Intonation is just fine.Peace
adorshki
Reverential Member
I humbly bow to the two voices of actual experience. I HAVE beeen curious about them but never truly heard a need. I DO get up and down the neck a bit. Guess my babies are just living up to my expectations, but this is the place where we go to get as many viewpoints as possible, as well as some good feedback regarding the "consider the source" issue... Thanks Bikerdoc.
plaidseason
Senior Member
Steve Earle is a better guitar player than I am! He's a pretty good fingerpicker too.
Matt Umanov knows about 100 times more than I know about guitars.
That said . . . I've definitely noticed a difference (on some guitars) using a compensated saddle. My F44 doesn't have one, and doesn't seem to need it. I've said like 15 times before, but while the F44 isn't particularly loud, it's intonation is good enought that more than a few people have borrowed it for recording - it kind of sucks to spend $2200 on a J-200 and then have to borrow someone else's guitar that he spent only $500 on, but that's neither here nor there).
But nearly every other guitar I've owned benefited from a compensated B string. I may be hack guitar player, but my ears are pretty good!
-Chris
Matt Umanov knows about 100 times more than I know about guitars.
That said . . . I've definitely noticed a difference (on some guitars) using a compensated saddle. My F44 doesn't have one, and doesn't seem to need it. I've said like 15 times before, but while the F44 isn't particularly loud, it's intonation is good enought that more than a few people have borrowed it for recording - it kind of sucks to spend $2200 on a J-200 and then have to borrow someone else's guitar that he spent only $500 on, but that's neither here nor there).
But nearly every other guitar I've owned benefited from a compensated B string. I may be hack guitar player, but my ears are pretty good!
-Chris
RussD
Member
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2006
- Messages
- 902
- Reaction score
- 9
- Location
- The Live Music Capital of the World
- Guild Total
- 12
A good strobotuner will show how well a guitar stays in tune up the neck.
Compensated saddles help most standard scale guitars, but there are enough variables to leave it open to argument forever. Depends on your guitar, set-up, materials, relief, style of compensation, and more.
I'm always experimenting with the tops of my saddles. Most of my Guilds are significantly better, for me, with a strongly compensated "b" string. But then the F-30 is straight as an arrow and folks love it. :?
Compensated saddles help most standard scale guitars, but there are enough variables to leave it open to argument forever. Depends on your guitar, set-up, materials, relief, style of compensation, and more.
I'm always experimenting with the tops of my saddles. Most of my Guilds are significantly better, for me, with a strongly compensated "b" string. But then the F-30 is straight as an arrow and folks love it. :?
Nigel Wickwire
Member
I think there may be a little mis-information about compensated saddles here. It is my understanding that a saddle that is NOT perfectly perpendicular to the strings is compensated. In other words, if the High E side of the saddle is closer to the nut than the Low E, your saddle is compensated. I think this is called slant compensation. Most all the steel string acoustic guitars I've seen are this way. It appears you gentlemen are discussing a Staggered position saddle, which can introduce even more compensation. Nylon strung guitars will commonly have un-Compensated saddles. That is to say, saddles that are perfectly parallel with the bridge and not at a slant.
I am certainly no expert, but I would refer you to Dan Erlewine's excellent book, the Guitar Player Repair Guide. In my third edition copy, this topic is very well covered on pages 63 - 64.
~nw
I am certainly no expert, but I would refer you to Dan Erlewine's excellent book, the Guitar Player Repair Guide. In my third edition copy, this topic is very well covered on pages 63 - 64.
~nw
RussD
Member
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2006
- Messages
- 902
- Reaction score
- 9
- Location
- The Live Music Capital of the World
- Guild Total
- 12
You're right, Nigel, go to the best on questions like these. The subject to which I was referring is portrayed in the third drawing down (which mentions the compensated saddle with staggered positions.) It's still a straight saddle, but it is compensated.
Which do you use and like?
I love talking about this stuff!
Which do you use and like?
I love talking about this stuff!
Nigel Wickwire
Member
My DV-6 (I bought it new) came with a Staggered position compensated bone saddle. I would say for a factory setup, the intonation is pretty darn good. If I tune the guitar with an electronic tuner and then check each string at the 12th fret, they are very close to being right on the money.
There are a lot of variables, string choice, guitar setup and the sensitivity of the guitar operator's ear, so I don't think there is a right answer. IMHO, the Staggered position saddles can make a difference.
Keep in mind Russ, I am a novice/hobbyist and not a pro with the guitar.............. :?
~nw
hideglue
Senior Member
Worn frets will render any compensation useless