Anyone here use an EQ?

[Ravon]

Just looking for something to enhance my tone. I'm kinda burned out on that heavy distortion/high gain sound and looking for a more 'clean' tone. Any real benefits? If so, what would ya'll recommend? I'm looking at this one http://www.zzounds.com/item--MXRM108 Thanks

 

[adorshki]

Just looking for something to enhance my tone. I'm kinda burned out on that heavy distortion/high gain sound and looking for a more 'clean' tone. Any real benefits? If so, what would ya'll recommend? I'm looking at this one http://www.zzounds.com/item--MXRM108 Thanks

Hi Ravon, first a disclaimer: I'm not a "'leccie" guy, know very little about guitar amps/ methods of generating distortion, but I do know a bit about basic audio reproduction from my
days with Heathkit, who offered a professional grade frequency generator/spectrum analyzer combo for the purpose of obtaining useful measurements for equalizing PA's and other audio sytems.
The real purpose of an Equalizer is to compensate for deficiencies in a given audio environment. Room size along with other factors such as dampening materials on walls, columns, etc. have an effect on the relative volume of frequencies to each other, and even in different places in a room. The EQ compensates electronically so that bass won't overpower or cause an out-of phase resonance with drums or other instruments, (Which makes both instruments sound very weak) to give a basic example. Normally a spectrum analyzer and a noise/frequency generator are used together to determine what the "frequency reflection" characteristics are in a given environment, and even aid in speaker placement for the best "basic" balance, and the EQ is used to make the adjustments to the signal to achieve optimum balance of volume between segments of the frequency spectrum in the "sweet spot" in the room. If it's done right it'll always sound best in the middle of the hall, not from your monitor. :wink:
Of course, it has become a glorifed tone control in most home audio applications.
So I don't see it as a means to a "cleaner" tone, unless it's by way of being able to make an undistorted instrument heard more clearly following proper spectrum analysis of the room and appropriate equalizing?

 

[fronobulax]

Although "equalizer" is most precisely used to deal with room acoustics, a lot of electric players use the same technology to emphasize or de-emphasize selected portions of the spectrum in order to give them a particular sound. In Ye Olden Days amps had a bass and a treble control. Sometimes real good amps would have a mid-range control as well. Expand the tone controls so that they can actively boost, as well as passively cut and add more knobs so that there are more choices for center frequencies and there you have it, EQ.

I have never used an outboard EQ but my experience is that "bright" running to "shrill" is what happens when boosting the high frequencies, "hollow" applies to the mids and boomy to the bottom. If I am running with any kind of distortion these still hold true except that the bright sounds start getting close to offensive.

To ravon's question, if I wanted something besides the high gain/distortion I might look for a cleaner amp rather than an EQ, but whereas Al knows nothing about electric guitars, I am a bass player so the level of ignorance is still pretty high ;-)

 

[adorshki]

To ravon's question, if I wanted something besides the high gain/distortion I might look for a cleaner amp rather than an EQ, but whereas Al knows nothing about electric guitars, I am a bass player so the level of ignorance is still pretty high ;-)

Could be worse, you could be a drummer. :lol:

 

[fronobulax]

Could be worse, you could be a drummer. :lol:

That would be my sister and, now that I think of it, we've never been in the same rhythm section.

 

[Christopher Cozad]

Hello Ravon,

If I was wanting to "tweak" the tone, the MXR EQ pedal might be just the ticket (the pedal will add a little noise to the mix but, at that price and for what it can do, you might be pretty happy).

If I was getting "bored" with the sound, in general, I would try amp modeling (if you haven't, already). With a myriad of combinations to select from, it would take some time before the search for new sound began again.

If I was becoming a "tone purist", I would be spending inordinate amounts of money on the finest amp(s) and pickup(s) available (I know absolutely nothing about this form of obsession, and refuse to further incriminate myself).

Christopher

 

[Ravon]

• I think you're right Al, that it won't actually enhance a 'clean' tone. There is actually a slider on the far right on the MXR that says 'Gain'. It's just that weird processed 'fuzz' and very high gain sound that seems to be in alot guitar players signal chain that annoys me (and alway's has). From experience a distortion pedal sound is not the tone I'm after (not that you said anything about one). I just know when I see and hear a player on stage that has that ultimate full, clear, clean tone (and endless sustain ), they're using a rack mounted or a floor type EQ

Frono, I play humbucker equipped guitars through tube amps so a little 'crunch' doesn't bother me at all. Actually that tube driven warmth is the basis of the tone I'm after. But not too much

• Christopher, the quest has reached into my pockets many times so adding this EQ will be nothing new for me. I've looked into a SansAmp as well but I'm hoping it all ends with the EQ

 

[AcornHouse]

I don't use an Eq pedal, but I just picked up a pedal that I think may be what you're looking for. It a Marsh MTS-1 pedal based on the original Tube Screamer. (Wait, wait, hear me out.)
It's not a distortion/high gain monster, it just has three knobs: drive, tone level. The drive adds overdrive from just a small boost to a powerful overdrive. The tone will switch from a classic "grandmother" tone to a screeching gain, and the level controls the overall volume. The great thing that I've found is that it doesn't change your guitar's sound at all. All I had at home when it got delivered was my X-170, and even overdriven, it sounded like an X-170.

Careful tweaking will dial in what you want, I think. I found one for $50 on TGP, but they retail, of course, higher. It's hand wired and uses the same parts as the original screamer.

Just one suggestion.

 

[adorshki]

I don't use an Eq pedal, but I just picked up a pedal that I think may be what you're looking for. It a Marsh MTS-1 pedal based on the original Tube Screamer. (Wait, wait, hear me out.)
Careful tweaking will dial in what you want, I think. .
Just one suggestion.

I like what you're describing. A buddy of mine played some of his original stuff on a CD and I loved the tone he was getting on his X-170, (or it might have been an ES) it was just on the verge of breaking up when he was "digging in" to it, getting a little "growl" while still maintaining that hollow body woody warmth I associate with classic "ultra clean" tone ala Wes Montgomery...and Gabor Szabo just came to mind as well.
Both of whom I would highly reccommend for study in your case, Ravon, because I think both of 'em also demonstrate how important technique is to that ultra clean tone. :wink:
Of course Carlos Santana does pretty good with solid bodies for clean and endless sustain, now that I think about it... even back when he was playing lowly SG's...
I don't remember if you've mentioned whether or not you've already checked any of 'em out, but I'd say you're ripe for studying some of the jazz masters, bearing in mind that we've discussed here before how much more important technique is than equipment, when it comes to "signature tone". Carlos Santana's gonna sound like Carlos no matter what he picks up, know what I mean?
Look also for Grant Green. :wink:

 

[Ravon]

• Thanks Acorn. Nothing wrong with a Tube Screamer (and its clones), if SRV used one it's gotta be ok. I've actually heard that TB's are the way to go and I'll never rule anything out. I'm actually closer to the tone I've been looking for with my X170/tube amp combo. Much happier with that sound than all the Strats and Pauls I've played in the past. I played a jam not long ago and didn't bring an amp and had to run straight to their old solid state Peavy board. I was getting some great tone from that, it sounded like I was running through a hot Twin.

• Al, oh yeah when you get right down to it it is all about technique. I've been listening to those jazz cats for years, Wes, Grant, Zoller....all of 'em. What I'm concentrating on now is playing/writing all jazz and blues based music. Lots of maj.7, 13th, 9th chords and dissonant scales (probably am overusing the Wes octave thing in my writing though :roll: ). Even though my background is '70's rock after 40 years I'm finally concentrating on the thing I love best. You know maybe that's what I'm looking for, a Wes meets Stevie Ray tone!

 

[gilded]

Ravon,

I don't get why you'd want an EQ pedal, but it may be because I don't know where you are starting from 'along the Tone Trail'.

So, if you don't mind, what make and model of amp do you use now? Do you currently use any FX? If so, what? How are the FX set?
How loud do you play? Are you currently getting a heavy distortion/high gain sound out of your guitar and amp or are you just
saying that you don't like heavy distortion in general and want to find something else to aspire to?

I've had MXR 10 channel EQ pedals. Not bad if you need one to boost or cut a certain part of the sound spectrum.
The gain control is nice if you need it, but there are plenty of FX pedals that do that.

If you use an MXR, you're also introducing a transistorized box into your tube chain. Sometimes that can suck tone from your
'Sound' (just like playing through a Roland tuner all the time, though this falls under the heading of 'little things can make a difference').

If you don't want to do all that, I understand. So, here's my quick opinion based on no info:

When I hear somebody say they want to sound like Wes and SRV put together, I'm thinking they want a sweet humbucker sound but also want to be able wail when they need it. Sustain doesn't come from an EQ pedal, although it might come from a gain control on an EQ pedal. Look into clean boost pedals, something that will hit the front input stages of the amp a little bit harder and kick it over into more of an overdriven sound.

Oh, and good luck with the Quest. It never stops does it? :lol:

 

[adorshki]

Al, oh yeah when you get right down to it it is all about technique. I've been listening to those jazz cats for years, Wes, Grant, Zoller....all of 'em. What I'm concentrating on now is playing/writing all jazz and blues based music. You know maybe that's what I'm looking for, a Wes meets Stevie Ray tone! [/list]

Shoulda known...there I go bringin' coals to Newcastle again...never underestimate a Kentucky boy... :lol:
As for "Wes meets Stevie Ray"....how about Harvey Mandel: "Christo Redentor"? or "Baby Batter"? or "Shangrenade"? :wink:

 

[Ravon]

Ravon,
Look into clean boost pedals, something that will hit the front input stages of the amp a little bit harder and kick it over into more of an overdriven sound.

Oh, and good luck with the Quest. It never stops does it? :lol:

Any clean boost pedal you'd recommend gilded? That's very interesting too when adding transistors in the chain. '90's 40 watt Fender Blues Deluxe and some times AB'd with a Fender Twin Amp. No pedals now other than occasionaly a Danelectro delay. I'm rethinking this EQ business now. Thank you very much

 

[Ravon]

Shoulda known...there I go bringin' coals to Newcastle again...never underestimate a Kentucky boy... :lol:
As for "Wes meets Stevie Ray"....how about Harvey Mandel: "Christo Redentor"? or "Baby Batter"? or "Shangrenade"? :wink:

Just don't start overestimating me Al :lol: . I'll have to check Mr. Mandel out 8) I've been digging Brian Hughes (Weather Channel theme) more of late http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vv1PcXT ... re=related

 

[Ravon]

Oooh, I like Harvey Mandel. Thanks Al 8). Where have I been?

 

[adorshki]

Oooh, I like Harvey Mandel. Thanks Al 8). Where have I been?

Gotta admit he's been kinda "under the radar" for basically his whole career.. but he still gets out and gigs. If you didn't see his Wiki page, he got started in Chicago, served some apprenticeship under John Mayall, then broke out on his own for a bunch of solo albums, even got auditioned by the Stones when they were looking to replace Mick Taylor. Speaking of John Mayll you might want check out another of his proteges, Coco Montoya. That Mayall, he sure can pick 'em! :wink: :lol:
Well heck, now that I think about it, you do know about Eric Clapton and Peter Green doing time with Mayall, right? I've posted about Mr. Green, the founder of Fleetwod Mac, many times, but again, and just in case you don't know him yet, the "tone" thing: Try to find "Albatross" (BIG single in England in 1970 and I think Paul actually ripped it off for "Sun King" on Abbey Road), also "Need You Love So Bad", a nd "Black Magic Woman", which he wrote, by the way. BB King once said Peter Green "has the sweetest tone I ever heard, he was the only one who gave me the cold sweats" .... :shock: Read between those lines....:wink:
There's also method of wiring the pickups on a Les Paul out of phase which is called "the Peter Green setup" :wink:

 

[Ravon]

Oh yeah! I started playing guitar around '72 when I was 11 or 12 and loved anything guitar, especially blues. I never owned any Mayall or Peter Green albums but I knew all about them . As a matter of fact, if I could sing better than I do (or had a singer willing to) I would be perfectly happy in a band covering all those guys, especially Montoya. Also later on in my life I started to become a big Gary Moore fan. Thanks for reminding me of them.

• Hey Gilded, this is what I've found. A little pricey though http://www.sweetwater.com/c631--Keeley- ... Mgod-1QApg

 

[gilded]

11 or 12 in '72, huh? Well, Ravon, my boy, you can call me 'Mr. gilded' from now on, 'cause I'm older

Just for grins, go to eBay and search under 'clean boost*'. Forget the italics, of course, but don't forget the asterisk, because that will boost, booster, boosted, etc.

I did it and came up with 200+ clean boost auctions, only 29 of which were Keeley Katanas. Por Ejemplo, there is a TC Elec. Sparkle Boost pedal for $129. That might be a good one. TC pedals usually are good.

Anyway, round up a few makes and models that you like and the go to youtube for yet another search and have a listen. See if you like what you hear! Also, you could do a general google-type search like 'Keeley Katana reviews' or 'TC Electronic Sparkle Boost reviews'. See what you come up with.

Finally, you never told me what kind of amp you are playing through.....enquiring minds want to know! You could even incorporate your amp choice into a google search: deluxe reverb clean boost.

Have fun, youngster.

HH

 

[Ravon]

Ravon,
Look into clean boost pedals, something that will hit the front input stages of the amp a little bit harder and kick it over into more of an overdriven sound.

Oh, and good luck with the Quest. It never stops does it? :lol:

'90's 40 watt Fender Blues Deluxe and some times AB'd with a Fender Twin Amp. No pedals now other than occasionaly a Danelectro delay.

There ya go MR.gilded sir !

 

[adorshki]

Ravon,
Look into clean boost pedals, something that will hit the front input stages of the amp a little bit harder and kick it over into more of an overdriven sound.

Oh, and good luck with the Quest. It never stops does it? :lol:

'90's 40 watt Fender Blues Deluxe and some times AB'd with a Fender Twin Amp. No pedals now other than occasionaly a Danelectro delay.

There ya go MR.gilded sir !

BTW in case you haven't stumbled across the reference, an extremely large element of Harvey Mandel's signature sound was his extreme proficency with a volume pedal. Just kick it s-l-o-w-l-y while the attack is decaying, and it sounds like eternal sustain. :wink: