Al, they really were just a great garage rock band. Maybe the greatest!

[sailingshoes72]

It's fun to see Clapton genuinely smiling during Jeff Beck's solo! And then, before he begins to sing, he raises his arms in the air as if to say " How do you top that ???".

sailingshoes

 

[Westerly Wood]

Maybe this deserves its own thread, but I believe I am still on topic here: Pete Townshend...

He will always be my fave of the main British guitar guys. Not cause I think he was the best player, as he most likely was the least of them all (Beck, Paige, Clapton)...but he was the best song writer of them all, if you look at the body of work and the rock operas. I know it's a matter of taste and mostly for fans to debate over for fun, but I wonder what his peers think of Pete as a guitar player? I know he and Clapton were close at one time, used to go see movies together, etc...I know in a documentary on the Who once, Keith Richards (oh I forgot to include him...) said he thought Pinball Wizard was the most perfectly organized song ever written. He called it "perfect". One of my least fave Who songs. I could go the rest of my days and never listen to it again, please...

I also believe he could out strum them all. Fastest strummer and that is another reason I liked him so. And his strumming was truly unique and an original take on strumming an acoustic guitar. always blows me away, from a ROCK band perspective, how acoustically oriented and foundational both Tommy and Who's Next were.

 

[walrus]

Can't argue with Townshend's songwriting genius, WW. When I read his autobiography a few years ago, I realized he was a very tortured soul, who used his angst to create a massive amount of music. And lucky for us that he did!

walrus

 

[Westerly Wood]

Can't argue with Townshend's songwriting genius, WW. When I read his autobiography a few years ago, I realized he was a very tortured soul, who used his angst to create a massive amount of music. And lucky for us that he did!

walrus

Yeah, and it is all a matter of taste. Like there are very few songs Clapton wrote himself that I like at all, even a little bit. I think his work with Blind Faith is my fave part but outside of that, I just don't dig it. His solo on the recorded live version of "crossroads" is a crowning lifetime achievement, IMHO.

Paige had some killer guitar progressions, wow. Bron Y Aur, holy crap.

and Beck is most likely the most wizard of them all.

But yeah, Pete, who's next was my first Who album, 13 years old, so how can I not be biased? The Baba O'Riely moment: It was day of junior prom, 8th grade. My Mom took me out to get a flower thing for my date. We stopped by a record store on way home, a friend had played Meaty Beaty Big and Bouncy for me like a week earlier and I was hooked and thought My Generation was the greatest song I had ever heard. So we go to store, dude does not have that album, but he says, "really, you want this one"...and he pulls out a cassette tape of Who's Next from the glass case and hands it over to me, like cost $7. Paid cash . Get home, getting dressed for the dance, got this boom box, big one. I put tape in, and wait. No idea what was about to happen. then I hear this "what the hell is that?" the opening electric music pattern. I am like, "wait, this is not My Generation at all crap..." But I wait, then i hear the first chord, then i wait some more. then I get it. I totally get it.

 

[bluesypicky]

Never liked anything about him, and particularly disliked his guitar playing.
Now would you like to really know my feelings about him?

:calm:

 

[Quantum Strummer]

Townshend is by far my fav of the British lot. By far the best songwriter too. In his playing you never get the sense he's coasting on technique or sheer riffery. He has his "bag of tricks" like every player but IMO he's smarter at using 'em. And anyway he originated a bunch of 'em! Pete gets, as did Hendrix, that R&B is rhythm first and blues second. And he's not afraid to embrace & deploy simple when simple is what works best for the song.

-Dave-

 

[Westerly Wood]

Never liked anything about him, and particularly disliked his guitar playing.
Now would you like to really know my feelings about him?

:calm:

Interesting. As I said, so subjective this thing but fun to discuss. And I can see how much you dig Beck, then hearing Pete, yeah, that might not work out at all.

 

[bluesypicky]

Interesting. As I said, so subjective this thing but fun to discuss. And I can see how much you dig Beck, then hearing Pete, yeah, that might not work out at all.

Yeah I walked away from him very early. His sound was even unbearable to me.
Funny thing is I actually owned one of these Hiwatt amps for a while, and I never could get a decent sound of it in a straight connection.... lol
But like you say, it's whatever floats your boat. I guess he has fans. Actually I already count two on this thread. layful:

 

[richardp69]

Well, he plays better than I do, that's for sure. Saw them live a few times. One heck of a showman.

 

[walrus]

As Quantum said, Townshend was always more of a rhythm player than a lead player - the opposite of Beck, I suppose. I'm more a Townshend fan than Beck, that's for sure, but they really take two different approaches to guitar playing.

walrus

 

[adorshki]

But when I think of pure, raw "garage bands" of the 60's, I think of the local guys I heard WAY back...like:

Syndicate of Sound "Little Girl"
the Count Five "Psychotic Reaction"

Absolutely, in fact those two were local heroes here.
But note those 2 hits were also '66, just like "Dirty Water".
And "Psychotic Reaction" ends with a perfect Yardbirds "rave-up" style finish.
All of 'em following in the wake of Having a Rave Up, which inspired thousands of young wannabe's to form a band and not have to worry about singing harmony or sophisticated compositions like the Beatles.
Not to say that was the only influence, but definitely a major one.
(I had a neighbor whose garage band always started their practice with a Beatles tune and would give up and revert to Louis Louis, House of The Rising Sun, and Wipeout, :biggrin-new

The Music Machine "Talk Talk"
The Seeds "Pushin' Too Hard"
Blue Cheer "Summertime Blues"

I'd also include the Beau Brummels...but they did a bunch of studio stuff, so they're not exactly "garage".

Fun stuff!!!

Yeah garage bands were just raw. The records production quality was almost as good as the live act, LOL!
Sky Saxon and the Seeds, definitely!
Not sure I'd put Blue Cheer in there though, as that was actually '67 and was picked as filler for the first album (even though it was their first single), and they were more of an outrageous psychedelic power trio.
But close cousins, or the first generation descendants, sure enough.
Also think of "I Had Too Much To Dream Last Night" by the Electric Prunes and "Journey to the Center of Your Mind" by the Amboy Dukes (actually another one that was more in the psychedelic school but featured Ted Nugent's typically rough edged sound, for those who care, lol!)

 

[Westerly Wood]

Townshend is by far my fav of the British lot. By far the best songwriter too. In his playing you never get the sense he's coasting on technique or sheer riffery. He has his "bag of tricks" like every player but IMO he's smarter at using 'em. And anyway he originated a bunch of 'em! Pete gets, as did Hendrix, that R&B is rhythm first and blues second. And he's not afraid to embrace & deploy simple when simple is what works best for the song.

-Dave-

Brilliant synopsis Dave. Better than I could have ever said...

 

[adorshki]

As Quantum said, Townshend was always more of a rhythm player than a lead player - the opposite of Beck, I suppose. I'm more a Townshend fan than Beck, that's for sure, but they really take two different approaches to guitar playing.

walrus

I absolutely have a place in my heart for Pete ever since "I Can See For Miles".
And while I only truly cherish about 3 tunes on Tommy itself (plus the Woodstock/Live at Leeds material from it), I can't live without Live at Leeds.
I also have a bootleg tape of the Isle of Wight performance where they did most of Tommy (I think it's been released officially since I got it) in which he astounded me by doing impressions of Hendrix, Clapton, and Alvin Lee in various solos.
So he could do it if he wanted but just kept following his own muse.
's also what I loved about Beck.
I did kind of lose interest with Quadrophenia and the only thing I liked after that was "Who Are You".
But "My Generation" also deserves to be on the list of seminal garage band influences.
Let's not forget the Kinks' "You Really Got Me" and "All Day and All of the Night" as another British Invasion influence on garage rock.
And of course, "Satisfaction" (released in '66 and the Stones' first real hit here).
I mean, for a while there all you had to do was be British and you were guaranteed 10,000 units in singles sales.
Even Herman's Hermits was giving the Beatles strong competition here.
(Full disclosure: I actually love and revere about 5 Hermits' cuts)
And yeah the Beatles could get just as raunchy as anybody ("Run For Your Life"comes to mind ) but Martin and Epstein just tried to keep 'em slicked up in pursuit of a wider audience, which they achieved in '65 with "Yesterday".
Which no self respecting garage band would cover, although I'd bet the Sex Pistols coulda given it a good working over.
:glee:

 

[Westerly Wood]

Satisfaction, I turn the radio channel when that tune comes on. I cannot stand that riff. But I can imagine in 1966, quite the head turner...

 

[sailingshoes72]

At some point we should decide what a "garage band" really is! For me, a true "garage band" has to meet several criteria:

a) They must have NO recording contract.
b) They must practice in a garage, basement or rented self-storage space.
c) They must play cheap guitars and amps. (Silvertone, Harmony, Kay, Supro, Danelectro and Airline all qualify.)
As Rick Miller of Southern Culture on the Skids once said "You can't imitate cheap... you gotta have the real thing!".

We have probably never heard of most "garage bands", unless the were practicing in our own neighborhood.

Then there are the rock bands that try and capture the raw energy and low-fi sound of a garage band... there are lots of those. :saturn:

sailingshoes

 

[adorshki]

At some point we should decide what a "garage band" really is! For me, a true "garage band" has to meet several criteria:

a) They must have NO recording contract.
b) They must practice in a garage, basement or rented self-storage space.
c) They must play cheap guitars and amps. (Silvertone, Harmony, Kay, Supro, Danelectro and Airline all qualify.)
As Rick Miller of Southern Culture on the Skids once said "You can't imitate cheap... you gotta have the real thing!".

We have probably never heard of most "garage bands", unless the were practicing in our own neighborhood.

Then there are the rock bands that try and capture the raw energy and low-fi sound of a garage band... there are lots of those. :saturn:

sailingshoes

With respectful disagreement, the real point is that "garage rock" actually refers to a phenomenon that only existed for a short period of 2-3 years in the mid '60's.
What "IS" a garage band isn't a valid question, they don't exist anymore, especially according to your criteria.
There were plenty of guys who thought it had to be easy (and cheap) enough to buy some equipment (or get their parents to do it) and start a band, and it was easy enough to practice in somebody's garage, especially in suburbia of the '60's.
Trust me, most of 'em wanted a hit record and recording contract.
They wanted the fame and perks that went with it (especially "chicks").
Most or 'em were oblivious to the hazards and vicissitudes of the of the industry, thus the high percentage of one-hit wonders and short band lifespans. ("the Draft" played a not- insignificant role there, too)
The industry demand for product was huge enough (baby boomers just entering puberty) to enable the dream for many a band that wouldn't have gotten a full demo listen only 5 years later.
Teen pop was a moneymaking machine for the industry and garage bands offered a plentiful flow of cheap fodder for a couple of years until new musical styles became the vogue.
The term itself wasn't even used in the day, it wasn't coined until a few years later by journalists trying to come up with a name for the phenomenon and that also led to it being used to describe the sound you're describing.
Wikipedia actually has a page on it that sums it up pretty darn well, but the single detail that jumps out at me to define the whole era is this:

"Though it is impossible to determine how many garage bands were active in the 1960s, according to Mark Nobles, it is estimated that over 180,000 bands formed in the United States,[4] amongst which several thousand made records.[5][nb 1]"

That'll never happen again.
The baby boom is over.
As is top 40 AM radio.
And the attraction of illicit but still relatively safe recreational pursuits at the drive-in.
I like the Black Keys though.
Edit:On reflection I don't dispute your use of the term garage band to describe bands that want to sound like garage rock, I prefer the term "retro" myself, to distinguish modern practitioners of "the sound" from the originals.
And I even dislike using a label for anything musical, but "garage rock" is a truly good one given that 95%+ of 'em definitely hatched in one..
:biggrin-new:

 

[walrus]

"Though it is impossible to determine how many garage bands were active in the 1960s, according to Mark Nobles, it is estimated that over 180,000 bands formed in the United States,[4] amongst which several thousand made records.[5][nb 1]"

That'll never happen again.

:biggrin-new:

And to circle back to the OP, you can thank The Beatles for this. And I agree 100%, it will never happen again.

walrus

 

[Westerly Wood]

And to circle back to the OP, you can thank The Beatles for this. And I agree 100%, it will never happen again.

walrus

Though to a lesser degree, the Seattle grunge rock scene had a minor version of the phenomenon with Mudhoney and Nirvana and a few others, but then everyone and their mother tried to replicate and it diluted into crap fast.

 

[walrus]

Agreed, WW. Although it has been said that Neil Young is the "godfather of grunge"!

walrus

 

[sailingshoes72]

"Though it is impossible to determine how many garage bands were active in the 1960s, according to Mark Nobles, it is estimated that over 180,000 bands formed in the United States,[4] amongst which several thousand made records."

Wow! That is an amazing number of bands. And, I proudly count myself, and a couple of my hometown friends, as part of that number. Although, we never had a paid gig or made a record.

From the AP obituary for Chuck Berry:

"Berry's core repertoire was some three dozen songs. His influence was incalculable, from the Beatles and the Rolling Stones to virtually any group from garage band to arena act that called itself rock 'n' roll."

sailingshoes