Acoustic bass quest

[wannabebass]

Hello LTG experts, and seasons greetings to all!
I've been scanning various posts here and am in awe of the encyclopedic knowledge of some of you folks!

I'm new (1yr) bass player looking to add an acoustic for easy, no plugging etc practice and playing. Obviously it would be great if I could play unplugged with a buddy on guitar, but I understand there are limitations of the small body of an ABG. I've also tried a few large bodied, 34" scale units and I don't think that will work for me.
I have played a jumbo junior and a few medium scale ABG's from other manufacturers, and the jumbo junior was just as loud as the larger bodied (and longer scaled) instruments, which surprised me.
Currently I'm trying to decide between a jumbo junior (new), a B-240 (new) and a used B4-CE on Reverb (S/N says it is from 1993) .
My questions:
1. Should I be wary of buying my first acoustic purchase on-line without inspecting it? (it is from an established store in Winnipeg, but I'm near Toronto)
2. Is there anything inherently "better" about this Made in USA "vintage" B4?
3. Would a B-240 or the B4CE necessarily be louder than the jumbo junior and therefore get me a tiny bit closer to playing unplugged with a buddy?

Any help you can provide is more than appreciated.
WB

 

[fronobulax]

Welcome. I, somewhat arbitrarily, decided to move the post here in hopes it has more visibility.

I note that the body dimensions contribute more to the volume than the scale length.

The only instrument on your list that I have actually had in my hands is a B4-CE. I had phosphor-bronze strings on it. Acoustically it sounded like a guitar, only lower in pitch. No surprise there. Generally when playing acoustically with an acoustic guitarist, I could hear myself. Usually the guitarist could hear me. The exceptions were when they were several feet away and playing "with vigor" or when they were playing their D-25 which puts out a lot of sound. I ultimately gave it to my sister because it wasn't as loud as I needed and I acquired a B-50 which is certainly louder. My acoustic only requirement involved accompanying singers and the B-50 let me get away with not using an amp in more places.

Some folks don't like the 90's Fishman pickups and preamps but I found the B4 quite versatile plugged in.

The world has changed and many purchases have to be made online without hands on experience. Not everyone has other choices. I'd look at the return policy. If you can return something for any reason by paying return shipping then that is a safer purchase than one where the seller has to approve your reason for return. I would not be wary of a new instrument purchased online unless my fear was that I would get it and then not like it. If I asked enough questions and had pictures I also consider a used instrument from a reputable dealer. But I would ask questions about the specific instrument. (If you are headed in that way we can suggest questions to ask and things to check).

There is a lot of love here for Guilds made in the USA. Generally instruments made by Guild in the US were targeted to sell at a higher price point than Guilds made overseas. So the consensus is that the more expensive instrument is likely to be better because of decisions made to keep costs down. But it has been hard to point to specifics. I'd choose based upon current price and whether things like the case (or lack thereof) or warranty matter to you.

I'll note the scale length of the Jumbo Junior. If you play other basses that might be a hard adjustment. But if you are a guitarist then you are in the target audience.

As an aside you can over think this. If, a year from now, an ABG is no longer of interest and you are not playing then it doesn't really matter which bass you are not playing. If you do continue to play and grow as a bassist you will find your experience makes you value features differently and you will be looking for another bass with those features.

Good luck.

 

[wannabebass]

Thank you Frono et. al. for your insights.
I think I am leaning more towards either the B240 (which seems widely unavailable here) or the used B4CE. I've asked the shop to check the following:
Braces etc are still glued and solid
Top scratches are only surface and not actual cracks
Electronics functioning
Cable jack is secure and not pushing into the body

Anything else I should be looking for?

Thanks again for your help

 

[fronobulax]

Check the action at the 12th fret and the neck angle. Basically you want to assess whether you will need a neck reset. I'm going to tag @davismanLV since he is usually pretty good about the reminding me what the neck checking instructions are.

 

[davismanLV]

Instructions for checking the neck angle HERE.

Information about action height and adjustment is HERE.

 

[RVBASS]

I use a Turner Renaissance bass for acoustic unplugged, although it sounds great plugged in with its piezo pickup too.

 

[mavuser]

I would get a Fender Mustang bass or possibly a Guild Starfire bass for where u are at, and use low tension lower gauge flat wound strings. those basses can really be made to sound woody and acoustic with some tweaks of the amp. Even a JS bass with Guild humbuckers.

just forget practicing or doing anything really without plugging in a bass. even an acoustic bass, playing it "unplugged" will get old pretty fast. The B4 is cool since it's not so big, but you get so much more out of a Mustang or Starfire.

 

[fronobulax]

I would get a Fender Mustang bass or possibly a Guild Starfire bass for where u are at, and use low tension lower gauge flat wound strings. those basses can really be made to sound woody and acoustic with some tweaks of the amp. Even a JS bass with Guild humbuckers.

just forget practicing or doing anything really without plugging in a bass. even an acoustic bass, playing it "unplugged" will get old pretty fast. The B4 is cool since it's not so big, but you get so much more out of a Mustang or Starfire.

Yeah, but.... There are times when an amp is just not allowed and in those cases even a Starfire doesn't compete with a real acoustic bass.

The OP did say

looking to add an acoustic for easy, no plugging etc

 

[wannabebass]

Thanks for all the input. Just to clarify I do have an electric which I’ve been playing for the last year- an Ibanez Mikro, which has been working great for me so far.
The goal of this guitar is to be able to practice/ plunk around wherever I want without necessarily plugging in, and maybe even with another guitar if they’re restrained (and I miraculously learn to play with a pick). The Starfire definitely looks appealing ( to say nothing of the Rick Turners!), but right now I’m focused on a pure acoustic.
The shop (through reverb) that has the B4 has agreed to do a few measurement that will let me get an idea about the neck angle and confirm that it isn’t in need of immediate drastic work, thanks to the links you folks have providedI will keep you posted.

 

[mavuser]

understood thats cool in that case I would also look at the Tacoma Thunderchief if u are looking at used from around the same time period as a B4, as the Thindercheif is probably nicer (never really seen a B4)

 

[mellowgerman]

I can speak from experience regarding two of the basses mentioned in this thread.

Guild B-240; I bought one of these when they first came out. A nice sounding, comfortable short-scale bass. Volume was decent and should do fine when playing along with a single 6-string acoustic, especially indoors. Once you add a second guitarist or move things outdoors, you may get lost in the mix. As mentioned though, the tone was nice, especially once I strung it up with a set of D'Addario black nylon tapewound strings. Very natural warm sound. Also, if you're buying this new, you likely won't have to worry about any structural surprises like loose braces or need for neck-reset.

Tacoma Thunderchief; I owned one of these about 12 years ago, so it's been a while. That said, they are big, loud and proud. Long scale with that big body makes for quite a reach to the first few frets. Volume-wise these will do quite well facing dual 6-string guitars and/or in outdoor scenarios. All that said, their prices have risen quite a bit in the last few years and if I was spending that much, I would go for a Guild B50 or B30. Deeper body and short scale with even more low end boom.

 

[wannabebass]

Agreed, those (thunderchief and B-30/50) would be awesome.... perhaps out of my price range (and skill level) at the moment!

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[twocorgis]

I've owned a B4ce, a B50, and my present B54ce.The only one of the the three that didn't get drowned out by playing with more than one dreadnought is the B54ce, and even then, just barely. As much as I love the thought of an acoustic bass, in practice they're really not that useful. And my G&L JB solid body arguably gets better acoustic tone than my B54ce.

 

[mellowgerman]

Agreed, those (thunderchief and B-30/50) would be awesome.... perhaps out of my price range (and skill level) at the moment!

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That one is a little overpriced in my opinion. In the US, a patient buyer should be able to score a B30/B50 for ~$1250, especially if you don't mind cosmetic wear and headstock repairs. Understandably though, in Canada they will likely be harder to come by and your best bet might be finding a US seller who's willing to ship over the border... in which case I would think you could end up with one for $1500-1750. Still not particularly affordable though for most folks.

In any case, I think you'd be happy with the B-240. It would be a low-stress purchase and you'd end up with a nice acoustic bass which should be capable of holding it's own in mellow jam settings. I've never owned a B4, but have played them. Nice craftsmanship as should be expected from any USA Guild, but in my opinion, they were designed to be used plugged in or for quiet unplugged couch practicing. Acoustically I remember the B4 being relatively quiet and thin sounding, which makes sense since it has a smaller body than something like a B240.

 

[wannabebass]

Thanks for all this information - I think I will try for a B240, and I like the stress-free purchase idea. Unfortunately they don't seem very available right now. I did receive this picture from the seller of the B4 which is putting me off a bit. Could it have been re-fretted over the existing frets effectively raising the fretboard to compensate for a bad neck angle? I'm not at all experienced with repairs, but this looks unusual to me.

 

[mellowgerman]

To me that just looks like the finish bubbling a bit around the fret channel edges. Since it has clear coat checking as well (the hairline finish cracks running up-and-down in the photo), that looks consistent with temperature and humidity fluctuations over the years. It's certainly possible it's been re-fretted, but there are no new frets over top of old frets there -- if I understood your concern correctly. If it's been re-fretted, the old ones were removed as they should have been.

 

[wannabebass]

Thank you again for all your replies, especially frono and mellow G.
I’ve been quoted a 16 week delay to get a b-240, but maybe that will be my ‘cooling off’ period. Think I will pass on the vintage instrument as good as it may appear, and try to decide between the jumbo junior (readily available) and waiting for the B-240.
starfires also look awesome….

 

[fronobulax]

Thank you again for all your replies, especially frono and mellow G.
I’ve been quoted a 16 week delay to get a b-240, but maybe that will be my ‘cooling off’ period. Think I will pass on the vintage instrument as good as it may appear, and try to decide between the jumbo junior (readily available) and waiting for the B-240.
starfires also look awesome….

The scale length would make me wary of the Jumbo Junior. All Guilds are entry level in the sense that most people who have played one want another. I've never had any appreciable success with an ampless Starfire unless I was playing alone but they are fun instruments.

 

[wannabebass]

My thoughts exactly. My EB is already a VERY short scale so my preference would be to have a "normal" SS acoustic. I've no misconceptions about playing a starfire acoustically.
The search continues!

 

[mavuser]

there is also an Epiphone acoustic bass that D'arcy Wretzky played with Smashing Pumpkins acustic shows and she sounded amazing on that thing.