LB-1 replacement P90?

Crazylay

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Hi!

I have a Starfire V and would like to replace the stock LB-1 pups with P90 pups.

Does anyone have done this? What about size and fitting?

Thanks.

Marco
 

Default

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Hey Marco! P90s might need some sort of mounting ring to cover the route. I don't know anyone here who has done that particular swap.
 

matsickma

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You might consider installing a set of DeArmond 2k pups.They are P90ish and can fit in the existing route and you can install the pickup mounting screws at a slight angle into the original LB1 mounting holes.
M
 

dbirchett

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And, they are available at the Guild shop.

Default, Matsickma was talking about the 2K pickups that were used in the DeArmond guitars at the turn of the century. The ones that are available through the shop are more like the 2000 pickups. They look similar but are two different beasties.

Either would work but the 2Ks were the ones that were P90ish.
 

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The DeA's they sell at the Guild store aren't the classic DeAs we think of. Iirc, they don't have the springs. I think Ralf posted a pic of the underside. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if they changed the base plate to make them standard with the LB pups. I just haven't bothered to get a pair to look at. I am going to build a lapsteel, they might be decent for that, and I could poke them with a stick too.
 

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DA Dyna3.jpeg.540x540_q85_autocrop.jpg
 

matsickma

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Default,
You posted the DeA 2k's that I was referring to. Either Model 2k or 2000 would work. Pretty sure the Gretsch reissues with the long magnets, adjusted screws and springs would also work. But I was thinking 2k version due to the P90'ish growl inlieu of the brighter 2000.

M
 

matsickma

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To be honest... I often think of adding a middle 2k pickup to an M70 ir X160 to add some variety between the two different pickup types.
M
 

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I'm confused between the two, but this was the construction I was referring to, i.e., not the classic DeArmond that Guild used, but the cheaper one to manufacture. I have the same on my DeA M-75, and it sounds good, just not Duane Eddy.
 

swiveltung

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P90's can fit over a HB rout if you want to really work at it and have enough string to body height. I did this on a Gretsch once with no added holes or detriment to the guitar:

Here's what I did:
 
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Default

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If you kiss the underside of the p90 cover with a little acetone, I bet you wouldn't need the wooden block to hold it together.
 

swiveltung

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Yeah possibly, the drawing doesnt show any archtop curve though!
P90 dog ear covers would be easier, but then you have some holes to drill in the guitar top, so you better be sure!
 

SFIV1967

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Those new BHK made DeArmond Dynasonic (as available from the Guild store in nickel and gold) look like copies of the early 2000 DeArmond 2000 pickups (not the 2k). GAD said about them: "It’s a DeArmond 2000, which is not a 2K but not an original 2000, either. Got it? The important thing to remember is that these 2000s sound more like the original 2000s than the 2Ks do."

The 2k (as shown in the middle below) was the P90 sounding one as Bill Turner (who designed them at Fender) explained in a post at the Fender forum which was reposted later at The Gretsch Pages: "...the 2K is configured like a P-90. The pole pieces and pole adjust screws are steel. The poles extend through the bobbin where they are trapped between a pair of like pole Alnico 5 bar magnets. The bobbin is surrounded by a thin steel U channel from below the bobbin to enhance the pickups inductance.
DC resistance: 7.4K Inductance: 6 Henries 43 gage magnet wire. The sound is like a P-90, in that it is a very fat single coil, but not quite as heavy as a P-90."
Regarding the early 2000 re-issue 2000 (which Bill Turner also designed) he said: "The 2000 uses only 1/4 inch Alnico 5 pole pieces in the bobbin, the sound is bright with that great rockabilly snap. DC resistance: 8.85K Inductance: 3.55 Henries 44 gage magnet wire"

Dearmond-50s-90s-00s-2k-2000-Pickups-Back-Labeled-210x300.jpg

Inside pictures of the 2000 and the 2k were posted in detail here.


Ralf
 
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GAD

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P90's can fit over a HB rout if you want to really work at it and have enough string to body height. I did this on a Gretsch once with no added holes or detriment to the guitar:

Here's what I did:


i applaud your engineering drawings and attention to detail!
 

dbirchett

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Those new BHK made DeArmond Dynasonic (as available from the Guild store in nickel and gold) look like copies of the early 2000 DeArmond 2000 pickups (not the 2k). GAD said about them: "It’s a DeArmond 2000, which is not a 2K but not an original 2000, either. Got it? The important thing to remember is that these 2000s sound more like the original 2000s than the 2Ks do."

The 2k (as shown in the middle below) was the P90 sounding one as I understood.

Dearmond-50s-90s-00s-2k-2000-Pickups-Back-Labeled-210x300.jpg


Ralf

The top picture is the DeArmond 2000 redesign that Fender made for Gretsch for the Historic and Electromatic (512X series). Guild used them on the X-160 Rockabilly as well. It sounds like a more polite version of the original 2000 that is the bottom picture.

The middle picture is of the DeArmond 2K that Fender designed for the DeArmond brand of guitars. These were made in a similar design to P90s and sound a lot more like p90s.

The bottom picture is of the Original DeArmond 2000 that was released back in the '50s. Gretsch called them Dynasonics.

The Guild Dynasonics (current model available on the Starfire Dynasonic and the X175 Manhattan Special) appear to be a reissue of the top pictured 2000 that Fender made for Gretsch. They may have changed the specs some. This is what is available through the Guild Shop.
 

matsickma

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Cool stuff. Since I have all the varity from vintage to early 2000 I can experiment. My main point is the Dearmond can cove the LB1 routing without a mess.
M
 

Crazylay

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Thanks all for your replies and help!

I am really searching for p90 pups so not anything that comes close to it. So what I did is this..

A while ago I needed some special pups for my diy strat. A guy I know has his own pickup shop and he has made me these pickups.(handwound)
So I asked him if he could make me 2 p90 pickups in the size of a LB-1 pickup. And he can! He is now making me some custom handwound p90 pups for my Starfire v!

Size: 68x28mm (little smaller), but adjustment screws on 81mm.
Neck: 7.2K
Bridge: 8.4K
Alnico 5 and heavy enamel awg 42 wire.

I will have them within 2 weeks.. can't wait to test them!
 
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