Question about Intonating a Guild Aristocrat/M75

PittPastor

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I'd like to intonate the new Aristocrat I got in, but the strings come up from the Guild harp tailpiece through the tunomatic... and the strings then cause interference when trying to get a flat-edge screwdriver into the screw at the base of the tunomatic to change intonation.

Is there a trick to this I don't know?

I don't have to remove the string, adjust, and replace the string, test, and repeat... do I?
 

GAD

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I've always used a long skinny screwdriver for this.
 

GAD

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So you can reach it without removing strings? That's a relief. Did you get it at StewMac or one of the big box stores?

Probably a big box. I usually only buy specialized stuff from StewMac.
 

PittPastor

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Thx GAD!

Where do I go to get the setup specs for my Aristocrat? Should I start with Gibson's specs for the Les Paul?

Because according to Gibson's, the Bass string is supposed to be pretty high, and I am out of room on the thread and it still isn't at spec.

ActionBridgeGuildAristocrat.jpg
 

Quantum Strummer

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For a long time I set bridge heights strictly by feel and sound. Then it finally occurred to me: "I should measure a bunch of guitars and see how consistent (or not) I am." Pretty consistent as it turned out. Using one of my dad's old drafting rulers and measuring with the ruler resting on the guitar's upper two frets, strings tuned up standard, my typical setup is 8/64" low E string height above the fret tops and declining down to 5/64" for the high E. I'm looking at the top of the strings when measuring…this is normally relevant only for wound strings. Sometimes I tweak a bit depending on the guitar but most of the time this works fine. Note that I play with more force than typical, do like some pushback from the strings and do not like buzzing.

Also, I don't touch the bridge (saddles) until I've dialed in the neck relief.

This may not be useful in the end to anyone else but me, but it's a starting point.

-Dave-
 
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PittPastor

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For a long time I set bridge heights strictly by feel and sound. Then it finally occurred to me: "I should measure a bunch of guitars and see how consistent (or not) I am." Pretty consistent as it turned out. Using one of my dad's old drafting rulers and measuring with the ruler resting on the guitar's upper two frets, strings tuned up standard, my typical setup is 8/64" low E string height above the fret tops and declining down to 5/64" for the high E. I'm looking at the top of the strings when measuring…this is normally relevant only for wound strings. Sometimes I tweak a bit depending on the guitar but most of the time this works fine. Note that I play with more force than typical, do like some pushback from the strings and do not like buzzing.

Also, I don't touch the bridge (saddles) until I've dialed in the neck relief.

This may not be useful in the end to anyone else but me, but it's a starting point.

-Dave-

I'll take any advice for starting points. Grabbing Gibson measurements probably isn't the best idea, but its all I could think of.

Thanks! When you say "Upper two frets" do you mean the last two frets on the guitar? Or are you measuring at 12th Fret?

(I already have the neck relief where I want it. I think. At least it is the Gibson's factory settings for the Les Paul.)

Thanks again!
 
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GAD

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I actually have a Guild document somewhere with specs. It's from the Fender days I think. I'll see if I can find it.

I'm in the camp of dialing it in until it feels right, though.
 

PittPastor

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If you need more room over the pickup why not lowering the pickups? Looks like you have plenty of room to lower the pickup to be flat with the black mounting rings.
Ralf

The pickups are kind of squishy, TBH. That's another question I have. I'll probably have to do a idea to show what I mean, tho. They rock really easily though. IDK if that is normal, or what.

But help me here, because I am new to this and don't know much about doing a setup. I was measuring the distance from Low E string to the fret at the 12th fret position. Gibson specs for a Les Paul is 6/64ths (although why we aren't calling that 3/32nds is beyond me!) And I do realize that they are similar body style shapes, but not the same guitar, so that might be a bad starting place... But it was all I could think of, short of getting specs from Guild, which I could not find.

According to Gibson spec, my Guild Aristocrat HH is too low. So, I'm trying to raise the action by raising the bridge in the back with the set screw. It seems to me that my set screw has been raised as high as it can, and still my string action is lower than the Gibson spec

So, how does changing the pickup height change the string height issue?

- - - Updated - - -

I'm in the camp of dialing it in until it feels right, though.

What does that mean? You just play, and if you get buzzing, you raise the bridge until you don't and then you stop?
 

Nuuska

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Hello

My 2c about setting electric guitar.

- Set the neck straight or slight bow - according to your preference - I prefer straight.
- Adjust bridge height so it is comfortable. Depending on how hard your right hand is - the height may vary.

- Plug into amp and adjust pickup distance from strings - never mind intonation yet. Adjust the distance to your personal "sweet-hot-spot".

-Adjust intonation. Reason for adjusting intonation last - when pickup is closer, the magnetic pull is stronger and causes sharp notes when fretting higher on neck. So adjust with amp and play where you normally play and adjust.


Finally the obvious - if fretting higher produces flat notes - then you have to shorten the scale length - and vice versa.

Remember, too - that some folks press them strings harder with fretting hand while others merely make them touch the frets - this makes a real difference, if frets are high - so you better practice and learn to do your own setup, that matches your playing technique.

Have fun. :watermelon:
 

PittPastor

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Thank you for your comments Nuuska. All suggestions are welcomed.

I guess what concerns me is that I think my bridge is as high as it can go. (I don't know if you can tell from the image in Post #5

My guitar came with D'Addario 10's. I was thinking about experimenting with lighter gauges -- maybe even going to 8s. But I already get a slight "string slap" on the low E with the 10s. If my Bridge is as high as it goes, does that mean I can't go lower than 10s on it? (I'm assuming that lighter strings are going to require the bridge being raised.)

Any thoughts?

Hello

My 2c about setting electric guitar.

- Set the neck straight or slight bow - according to your preference - I prefer straight.
- Adjust bridge height so it is comfortable. Depending on how hard your right hand is - the height may vary.
...
 

SFIV1967

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...how does changing the pickup height change the string height issue?
My mistake, I misunderstood your question and thought you had a clearance problem over the pickup.

Gibson specs for a Les Paul is 6/64ths
That sounds a little bit too high for an electric guitar. (and it's 64th because such rulers are in 64th).
Typically an acoustic guitar is setup to 6/64th at the low E and 4/64th at the high E-string at the 12th fret.

A good place to start for the action of a Les Paul type guitar is at the 12th fret (with no capo on) 5/64th" or 4/64″ on the low E string and 4/64th or 3/64″ on the high E.
Or for our European friends on the low E string a max of 2mm and on the high E String a clearance of max 1.5mm.

Mind that all depends on the players preferences. A hard strummer or a bluegrass picker might like the action relatively high, in order to avoid string-buzzing. Many jazz guitarists prefer low action, which is friendlier to
fingers playing fast scale runs and numerous, rapid, frequently complex chord changes. Lower action is more likely to produce string-buzzing.

So this would be o.k. for many, or a little bit too high for some. Depends also what string gauge you use and how hard you bend strings:

20190118_005828.jpg




Before you adjust the bridge height you should however see if the neck is straight and correct if necessary with the truss rod nut.
Stick a capo on the first fret, press down on the 15th fret and then use the straight string as a guide to see how bent forward the neck is. The feeler gauge is put over the eighth or ninth fret underneath the string - .007” is the magic clearance, which is like a thin business card or two sheets of paper. Any smaller than that clearance and the string will bang onto the frets when played; much larger than that and the string’s height will be excessive.

CxmkugnhSi4YGC8ypdMYRC-650-80.jpg



With your action set and test played for buzzing, it’s time to set the intonation.

Sbu4uYyEnJvjmpEEECq7tB-650-80.jpg



And at the very end set the pickup height:

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/22114-mod-garage-humbucker-height-adjustment


Ralf
 
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PittPastor

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Thanks Ralf! (PS: I'm not sure... I might be getting pickup buzz too. Like I said, these pickups seem weird to me the way they are set. I'll get a video up eventually)
 

Nuuska

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.... I guess what concerns me is that I think my bridge is as high as it can go. .....


Hello

If the thread is about to end - then you can not set the posts any higher by screwing - but there's an alternative.

Remove strings - or at least turn them way slack. Lift off the bridge. Put a washer or two on the post. This will give you more height.
 

PittPastor

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Hello

If the thread is about to end - then you can not set the posts any higher by screwing - but there's an alternative.

Remove strings - or at least turn them way slack. Lift off the bridge. Put a washer or two on the post. This will give you more height.

OK, I was wondering of that would be OK. Thanks!
 

PittPastor

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FWIW, I reached out to Guild to ask for the factory settings for the pickup height and they sent me a 1 pager PDF. I took pics of it so I could post it here.

Guild Setup Specs1.jpg
Guild Setup Specs2.jpg
In case anyone else wanted to know...
 

kakerlak

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Hello

If the thread is about to end - then you can not set the posts any higher by screwing - but there's an alternative.

Remove strings - or at least turn them way slack. Lift off the bridge. Put a washer or two on the post. This will give you more height.

That sounds a little precarious if there's no more post to hold the bridge and washers in place.
 
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