My 1974 S-100

Nilfisken

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Update!

Took the plunge on ebay and bought a worn incomplete wiring loom from ebay stated to be from 1971 Guild that looks correct for my S-100. Switch is tested for function and should be easy to restore anyway, and the heavy patina might work with the rest of my guitar. According the the seller the switch top and nut are heavily worn nickel/chrome and the switch body possibly more yellow. Should have the parts in the coming days and hopefully it will work! A bit silly to buy a quite expensive piece of worn switch, but this guitar is starting to demand originality and who am I to blame her?

Thanks again Hans for helping me to understand the intricacies of the Guild switches!

Cheers,
Oskar

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Nilfisken

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Small update:

The selector switch I found on ebay turned up today and was in fairly good shape and mechnically flawless so went ahead and installed it. The switch polished up quite well turning a bit more chrome loosing the copper like tint, but it remained dull. Think the patina works well with the rest of the guitar.

Whilst I had the guitar open I also checked the resistance of the pickups (need to kill time while socially distancing these days...). Neck pickup came in at 6.85kΩ and bridge pickup at 7.23 kΩ.

Cheers,
Oskar

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Electronics_updated.jpg


Neck_DCR.jpg


Bridge_DCR.jpg
 

hansmoust

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The selector switch I found on ebay turned up today and was in fairly good shape and mechnically flawless so went ahead and installed it. The switch polished up quite well turning a bit more chrome loosing the copper like tint, but it remained dull. Think the patina works well with the rest of the guitar.

That's what nickel is supposed to look like. Like I said earlier ....... you did well!

Now there's one thing that bothers me and that should be an easy fix; it's the mounting screws of the pickguard!

Good luck!

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl
 
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Nilfisken

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A bit of an update!

Even if it is probably not a big issue in practical use, the inherent looseness of the early Muller bridge design without threaded bushings making it possible to push it probably 2mm or so back and forth have been driving me mad. I found an old thread on the forum (https://letstalkguild.com/ltg/index...on-problems-early-muller-adjustomatic.176810/) and decided to see if I could have a similar go at tightening up the wiggle.

Using some leftover adhesive copper tape (0.05 mm thickness) from a previous shielding job on my other guitar (Japan Squire Strat with Fender Custom Shop pickups and completely rewired electronics) I wrapped one full turn around each body bushing and two turns around the base of each bridge stud. Result seems really good, hardly any play left in the bridge and the screws still easily turn in the bushing making height adjustments as easy as before.

Been experimenting with relief settings and string heights and I some issues with the G string feeling like it is lower down than the rest. I am not sure if Muller bridges are prone to ‘collapse’ like some Tune-O-Matic style bridges making them flatter with age, but I am thinking about buying some under sting radius gauges and see if the string radius is matching the board or not. I could then make small flat shims and place them under the rollers to raise any low strings. At the moment I need to have a small shim (temporarily constructed by folded aluminium foil…) under the G-string roller to be able to have it playing clean even when the other strings can still manage quite a lot of lowering.

Also desperately need to update the tuners, one of the pegs fell out (low-E) and had to be forced back in the tuner, I don’t think they will survive much longer. Even if I love the look of the deluxe tuners I think I will go for Rotomatics since everything else is returning to stock now, but not sure about 14 or 18 ratios?

Cheers,
Oskar

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GAD

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Few things make me happier than a Guild restored to its original period-correct parts. Well done!
 

kakerlak

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Thanks for bothering to have an old guitar with a ton of wear on it that still looks CLEAN. I'm so tired of unsanitary-looking guitars getting passed off as having "mojo."
 

Nilfisken

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Thanks for your comments guys, happy to know my gradual restoration meets the approval of senior Guild addicts :)

Continued with some more tinkering today. After taking delivery of a set of under-string radius gauges I confirmed my suspicions that the bridge radius was not matching the fretboard. I first established that the fretboard is in the region of 16" and then went on to try and match the underside of the strings to this at the bridge level. It took quite some trial and error but in the end using the same left over copper tape I used to tighten the bridge posts I placed shims under some of the rollers. A pair of shims made of four tape layer (first glued back on itself and then folded) under the A and B string, and another fold for the shims under the D and G string worked pretty OK. I can now lower the action to about 4-5/64" or 1.6 - 1.9 mm and it plays much cleaner on every string than it did before. Will keep tinkering with this, but the difference after setting the string height is marked in terms of playability. Now I need to find something better to use for shims, would prefer something that is not layered to transfer vibrations better, but not sure if it makes much of a difference. Also would be nice to have something that blends better in with the bridge itself.

With regards to getting a set of new Rotomatics, does anyone here know if chrome or nickel would be closest to the original 70:s Grover tuners?

Cheers,
Oskar

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kakerlak

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Re Grovers, they are reproducing the milk bottle shaped ones that would be correct to the era now.
 

GGJaguar

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Rotomatics from around 1972 to 1974, but '74 is tricky because it seems the transition from Rotomatics to Schallers occurred during that year. Certainly Schallers were in use on the S-100 from 1975 to 1977. And as always, exceptions exist. If Hans says this particular guitar should have Rotomatics, that's the final answer. :)
 

kakerlak

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Don't forget Sta-tites on the early ones, just to further muddy the waters!
 

Nilfisken

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Good points about the different tuner possibilities! Until reading about the Grovers again after seeing the replies here I never realised before that milk bottle was a special vintage design, I just thought it was the nickname for all Grover 102 Rotomatics. My guitar have the serial number 97877 suggesting it's an early 74 (74 series is 95497-112803). Looking at the base (different shape between normal 102 and milk bottles) and mounting screw patterns (side mounted on Shaller) its was clear that the easiest way to find out would be to do some minor surgery.

Cheers,
Oskar

Tuner_comparison.jpg

Left: Milk bottle ---------- Centre: Standard Rotomatic ---------- Right: Schaller M-6


Tuner-close.jpg

Never seen Grover Deluxe with the text in this order, quite sure these must be some cheap copies?


Tuner-markings.jpg

Clear imprint from milk bottle Rotomatics! Looks like the original screw holes were a mm or two further away from the centre pin.


Tuner-underside.jpg

Current tuners underneath showing where the rectangular imprint comes from.
 

F30

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Great to hear all about the guitar and its' journey back to a great axe again.
Sweet!
 

walrus

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I have no skills in this area, but this is a great story and an informative thread! Very cool!

walrus
 

kakerlak

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Good points about the different tuner possibilities! Until reading about the Grovers again after seeing the replies here I never realised before that milk bottle was a special vintage design, I just thought it was the nickname for all Grover 102 Rotomatics. My guitar have the serial number 97877 suggesting it's an early 74 (74 series is 95497-112803). Looking at the base (different shape between normal 102 and milk bottles) and mounting screw patterns (side mounted on Shaller) its was clear that the easiest way to find out would be to do some minor surgery.

Cheers,
Oskar

Tuner_comparison.jpg

Left: Milk bottle ---------- Centre: Standard Rotomatic ---------- Right: Schaller M-6


Tuner-close.jpg

Never seen Grover Deluxe with the text in this order, quite sure these must be some cheap copies?


Tuner-markings.jpg

Clear imprint from milk bottle Rotomatics! Looks like the original screw holes were a mm or two further away from the centre pin.


Tuner-underside.jpg

Current tuners underneath showing where the rectangular imprint comes from.

I really hate those Grover/Schaller screw-down Klusons. Those little hammered tangs aren't sufficient to secure the backs and any slight bump of the tuner botton against a wall/etc pops the back loose a little and then the shafts are forever floppy. The kind of tuners where you give the button a slight tap and it slips flat.
 
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