Just got a new D20

Bob Aldo

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The D20 is a surprisingly loud guitar for an all mahogany dreadnaught - very "open" right away.
It comes strung with EXP16 light gauge coated strings.
I have tried several different sets of strings on it, and have found that the guitar seems
to like the coated light gauge strings the best. They seem more natural on this guitar somehow than mediums
for instance. The D20 has a lot of bottom, but more sparkle in the high range than I thought it would (perhaps a bit
more than I really wanted).
I know this is an "all mahogany" guitar, but the word "mahogany" is used pretty loosely these days. So, I wonder if it is
what is generally called "genuine mahogany" (South or Central American), or maybe one of the several different species of
red woods found in Africa that are also called "mahogany" (of which Sapele is just one, by the way).
According to the Guild website, the new D40, for instance, has "solid African mahogany" back and sides. This is what leads me
to wonder about the particular wood used in the new D20. Does anybody here know for sure?
 

Rayk

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Yikes good question Guild says African Hog but not specific so then this falls into play without confirmation from Guild .

http://www.wood-database.com/african-mahogany/

What I get is if ain't Honduras it ain't real lol
But what do we have here in the US ? As I did not look it up . :)
 

Bob Aldo

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Yikes good question Guild says African Hog but not specific so then this falls into play without confirmation from Guild .

http://www.wood-database.com/african-mahogany/

What I get is if ain't Honduras it ain't real lol
But what do we have here in the US ? As I did not look it up . :)

I don't think we have any way of growing mahogany in the US. And, yes, if it ain't from Honduras, it ain't what we know as "genuine mahogany".
 

adorshki

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According to the Guild website, the new D40, for instance, has "solid African mahogany" back and sides. This is what leads me
to wonder about the particular wood used in the new D20. Does anybody here know for sure?
Hi Bob, welcome aboard!
That's actually a great question and I can't recall if it's been answered yet.
"What Ray said."
They're using African varieties extensively as pointed out on the D40 specs.
I just noticed the M20 also just says "solid mahogany" but I thought we figured out it's African too.
I'm about 99% sure they're using an African variety in the D20, too.
For one thing, real Honduran would probably be too expensive these days.
But I could be wrong.
Also, just specifying "mahogany" allows 'em a lot of flexibility in case of supply problems with a given source.
It's acceptable in that industry (instruments are considered part of the cabinetry/furniture industry) to use the generic term "mahogany" for varieties other than "true" mahoganies.
 

txbumper57

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Welcome to LTG Bob! I do know that it has been mentioned here and stated in Official Guild interviews on Youtube that Guild used Honduran Mahogany for USA production through the New Hartford plant closing in 2014. The switch to "African Mahogany" or "Not Really Mahogany" on the American Made Guilds was one of the changes that some of the folks around here noticed immediately when Cordoba bought Guild and began production in Oxnard. The few Oxnard made D20's, M20's, and D40's I have seen and played in person all resemble Sapele in appearance and tone to me much more so than that Dark smokey tone of the Honduran Mahogany built guitars.

Don't be alarmed if your first few posts don't show up immediately after posting them. As a new member your first few posts have to be approved by a moderator to make sure you are not an internet bot. Have a good one!

TX
 
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richardp69

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Welcome. I also own a D 20. It really is a fine sounding Guild. I know there a some on this forum who are not real fans (or at least feel the jury is still out) of the Cordoba build/production guitars. Personally, I believe they got this D 20 right and think it is a fine all Hog Guild.
 

Bob Aldo

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Thanks much, PTC Bernie! I think we are on track to clearing up this whole "mahogany" question.
 

Bob Aldo

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Although, come to think of it, it may be impossible to ever know what exact species of so-called "mahogany" any particular
"mahogany" guitar is made from!
 

PTC Bernie

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I just wish they'd be a little more specific about it.

At least Taylor calls Sapelle Sapelle. The whole Genuine Mahogany versus just Mahogany thing doesn't feel right to me.
 

adorshki

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I just wish they'd be a little more specific about it.

At least Taylor calls Sapelle Sapelle. The whole Genuine Mahogany versus just Mahogany thing doesn't feel right to me.

I think with Taylor they've probably got a more dependable source of supply and can commit to saying it's going to be sapele.
Guild may not have such reliable sourcing , and don't forget old price lists used to say "Specs subject to change without notice" in order to avoid disputes about a given guitar not conforming to published specs.
So yes it seems a bit disingenuous to simply call it "mahogany at first blush", but I think it's still preferable to committing to a given wood and then not delivering the published spec if a source dries up.
 

Br1ck

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I think the term solid mahogany these days is a catchall phrase for whatever mahogany variant we can get these days. Honduran mahogany is now a premium tone wood. I got my Martin custom 00 15 a couple of years before the variants came into play. Honduran is now a $500 upgrade. Yikes.

You like the guitar, you bought the guitar, go play the guitar.
 

Rayk

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I don't think we have any way of growing mahogany in the US. And, yes, if it ain't from Honduras, it ain't what we know as "genuine mahogany".

Holy bat water , I never made the connection now I feel like a complete DA lol

In all the times I worked with it I never knew where it came from though it said American it was South American .

I feel like a phd scientist leaving the house with no pants on . I swear I never seen any reading that could of tipped me off to that fact .

Funny thing is all the trees I keep teaching telling folks who call them the wrong thing are other you'd figure the Mahogany would of come up , but not so . :(
Schooled ! Lol
 

Rayk

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I feel all manufacturers should not rely on false words as to the woods used .

My example would be Saga who makes Blueridge . I'm not saying there using misinformation but their new models will sport Santos Rosewood which is not a rosewood but offers similar tonal qualities.

My point is I don't care what's made out of so much as it's tonal quality, if it can rock I'll buy it .
 

adorshki

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Holy bat water , I never made the connection now I feel like a complete DA lol
In all the times I worked with it I never knew where it came from though it said American it was South American .
And prior to that, w-a-a-ay back when, it was Cuban.
And Honduras would technically be Central American which is considered part of the North American continent whose southernmost tip is Panama.
Genuine mahoganies are of the genus "Swietenia" found only in sub-tropical latitudes of the western hemisphere, so there are other "true mahoganies".
But for practical purposes yes Honduran is the prevailing variety in the market.
From "the usual source":

" Mahogany is a kind of wood—the straight-grained, reddish-brown timber of three tropical hardwood species of the genus Swietenia, indigenous to the Americas,[1] part of the pantropical chinaberry family, Meliaceae. The three species are:
Honduran or big-leaf mahogany (Swietenia macrophylla), with a range from Mexico to southern Amazonia in Brazil, the most widespread species of mahogany and the only true mahogany species commercially grown today.[1]Illegal logging of S. macrophylla, and its highly destructive environmental effects,[2] led to the species' placement in 2003 on Appendix II of Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES), the first time that a high-volume, high-value tree was listed on Appendix II.[3]
West Indian[4] or Cuban mahogany (Swietenia mahagoni), native to southern Florida and the Caribbean, formerly dominant in the mahogany trade, but not in widespread commercial use since World War II.[1]
Swietenia humilis, a small and often twisted mahogany tree limited to seasonally dry forests in Pacific Central America that is of limited commercial utility.[1] Some botanists believe that S. humilis is a mere variant of S. macrophylla.[1]"
 
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adorshki

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I feel all manufacturers should not rely on false words as to the woods used .
Again the issue is a given maker may not actually know where the next batch of hog is coming from once they've worked through what's on the floor, and since the industry accepts the usage of "mahogany" as a generic term and has for over 20 years if not longer, I still say no harm no foul.
But since Honduran is now a premium tonewood like Braz (meaning they can charge more for it) you can probably rest assured if it really is Honduran they'll make sure you know it.
 
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chazmo

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Welcome aboard, Bob. That's great that you've got a D-20 from Oxnard, CA. They look really nice. I hope to get one to play one of these days.

In all honesty, I don't think any of us really has the information to answer your excellent questions about the wood. Maybe someone from Cordoba will eventually come forward and be a reliable source on what's going on there, but our experience so far has been that we should make no assumptions when there is vagueness from the factory.
 
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