Weird getting weirder anti-social media

JohnW63

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I've wondered what early century scientists did, when they spent many years believing something, based on current data only to find new technology gave new data and their " life's work " turned out to be wrong. Did the bars around that academic location get filled with guys in lab coats for a while?
 

Rocky

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I've wondered what early century scientists did, when they spent many years believing something, based on current data only to find new technology gave new data and their " life's work " turned out to be wrong. Did the bars around that academic location get filled with guys in lab coats for a while?
Real scientists actually like having their work expanded upon, because what they're really interested in is how things work.

A scientist may have an idea, and they devise their experiments to either reinforce that idea, or disprove it. If their idea is disproved, it just means they don't have a full understanding of what's happening. Frustrating, but just another step along the ultimate goal of understanding. A real scientist accepts that, and keeps moving.

Well performed science is rarely proved 'wrong.' The inclusion of additional data sets modifies the hypothesis to more fully explain the observations.

What pisses off real scientists are people who selectively choose observations and discard others to reinforce their preformed conclusions.
 

Midnight Toker

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Real scientists actually like having their work expanded upon, because what they're really interested in is how things work.

A scientist may have an idea, and they devise their experiments to either reinforce that idea, or disprove it. If their idea is disproved, it just means they don't have a full understanding of what's happening. Frustrating, but just another step along the ultimate goal of understanding. A real scientist accepts that, and keeps moving.

Well performed science is rarely proved 'wrong.' The inclusion of additional data sets modifies the hypothesis to more fully explain the observations.

What pisses off real scientists are people who selectively choose observations and discard others to reinforce their preformed conclusions.
Yep. There have also always been examples of people in science that have been blinded by fame/celebrity. Or the institutions that employ them use them as a way to boast their brand. That just comes down to personality type and will always come into play from time to time. Regardless, the overwhelming majority of scientific study is done quietly behind closed doors by people whose names the general public will never know, and is most often an openly shared discipline where like minded folks around the world regularly compare their findings in hopes of coming to a global consensus. We might not know them, but they all know each other. Sadly, a lot of science that is politically polarizing in the US, tends to be much more of a consensus globally. That all typically comes down to wealthy donors and interest groups creating a contradictive narrative just to protect their wealth, public/environmental health/safety be damned.
 

Midnight Toker

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I ran into a fair number of cult crazies when I was younger. As a taxi driver in NYC especially, I got to interact with great numbers of far out there folks. Which gave me an enduring appreciation for the varieties of mass populist delusions.

It occurs to me that:
  • People with emotional deficits, poor self image for example, often with little confidence in their own intellect, or judgement, look for easy, faux certainties, reassuring beliefs that can fill up the empty spaces. They become the believers.
  • Given the demand for easy, faux certainties, there is no lack of providers who cater to such needs for profit and/or power.
  • In this populist belief dynamic, actual self awareness, inner searching, is rarely on the table. It's a process more akin to addiction. Which seems to be about pleasure, but is actually about self-control and fear.
  • Cult, Q level conspiracy theory certainties are addictive. Believers invest in them to the exclusion of outside influences, and there is great power in this self delusion. It takes a lot of lies, a lot of propaganda to sustain the delusions.
  • Cult believers become their own self-supporting community, an automatic social reward of acceptance and self-identification.
You can't "reason" with people in this trap, because their belief has nothing to do with reason, with logic or any type of common sense. Just as with other addictive processes, intervention only works when things get bad enough, when the person wants to change.

I have a close relative destroying her own family with a couple of the au currant mass delusions. She's two people at once, a loving mother and a smart person ... plus this "Do your research" maniac diving deeper into crazy every day. I understand how she got there, but feel powerless to help in any way.
There's also the human element of simply wanting to be inclusive. A wanting belong to an organization or movement. Sometimes, organizations target people with low self esteem (or low IQ's) and easily indoctrinate them. I remember in my days of going to countless Grateful Dead shows up and down the east coast, I witnessed PETA reps first hand perusing the parking lot before a show, mostly singling out overweight and/or unattractive young women. They knew exactly the type they could easily sell their spiel to. I would just sit back and watch as this social experiment unfolded right before my eyes. Anyone breeding with confidence, they wouldn't waste a second of their time with.
 

twocorgis

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You guys are overthinking this. It's simple. You can't fix stupid.

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walrus
And that is nothing new. Heck, these were around long before social media.

Fleounvi8yZyJ1g61Nf-A2yvr_KaggEOeEC15ek9Fmg.jpg
 

fronobulax

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And that is nothing new. Heck, these were around long before social media.

Fleounvi8yZyJ1g61Nf-A2yvr_KaggEOeEC15ek9Fmg.jpg

Of course I do remember when there was no label and people who were not necessarily stupid but were unfamiliar with silica gel would open the packages and perhaps ingest them.

A lot of food products (think boxed mac and cheese or Hamburger Helper) had similar, unlabeled packets and you were supposed to open the package and add the contents to the food concoction.
 

twocorgis

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Of course I do remember when there was no label and people who were not necessarily stupid but were unfamiliar with silica gel would open the packages and perhaps ingest them.

A lot of food products (think boxed mac and cheese or Hamburger Helper) had similar, unlabeled packets and you were supposed to open the package and add the contents to the food concoction.
Well, there was a bad reason the warning was there for sure, like a lot of what would otherwise be obvious traffic signs.
 

davismanLV

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Kind of a veer but I remember reading an article about differences in documentation here in the USA vs. anywhere else, mostly Europe. Due to the litiginous nature of USA, the Husqvarna company in Sweden noted that they sell their chain saws in Europe with a short page of instructions. When exported to the USA they have a 16 page handbook full of mostly useless things like, "Do not hold the chain saw by the chain while it is running!!" because if they didn't they'd be held liable for any such accidents. Such is the ridiculousness of our times and sadly, our country. :eek:
 

Westerly Wood

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Still floors me that companies have to put a blurb on the coffee cup that contents are hot.

we'd make great pets.
 

Midnight Toker

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Kind of a veer but I remember reading an article about differences in documentation here in the USA vs. anywhere else, mostly Europe. Due to the litiginous nature of USA, the Husqvarna company in Sweden noted that they sell their chain saws in Europe with a short page of instructions. When exported to the USA they have a 16 page handbook full of mostly useless things like, "Do not hold the chain saw by the chain while it is running!!" because if they didn't they'd be held liable for any such accidents. Such is the ridiculousness of our times and sadly, our country. :eek:
Not sure about all of Europe, but in several countries I know that if you sue someone, and you lose in court, YOU are responsible for paying your legal fees, THEIR legal fees, and all court costs!! That alone would stop over 1/2 of America's BS litigation in it's tracks! If only we could only adopt such a method here in the US!!
 

DougH

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Steve Martin, "Remember, Never....No....., Always...."
 

KeithKeb

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I've wondered what early century scientists did, when they spent many years believing something, based on current data only to find new technology gave new data and their " life's work " turned out to be wrong. Did the bars around that academic location get filled with guys in lab coats for a while?
On the other hand, I think some of Einsteins hypotheses have been confirmed in this century, given advances in technology and experiments. I think I am correct though I cannot tell you the last one. Some type of energy.
 

KeithKeb

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Yep. There have also always been examples of people in science that have been blinded by fame/celebrity. Or the institutions that employ them use them as a way to boast their brand. That just comes down to personality type and will always come into play from time to time. Regardless, the overwhelming majority of scientific study is done quietly behind closed doors by people whose names the general public will never know, and is most often an openly shared discipline where like minded folks around the world regularly compare their findings in hopes of coming to a global consensus. We might not know them, but they all know each other. Sadly, a lot of science that is politically polarizing in the US, tends to be much more of a consensus globally. That all typically comes down to wealthy donors and interest groups creating a contradictive narrative just to protect their wealth, public/environmental health/safety be damned.
Correct, I worry how much our fragile system can take.
 
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