Top cracks (as opposed to....)

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

Top cracks on natural spruce often look very dark. I suppose the darkness is caused by dirt getting into the crack (if you'll pardon the expression). Is there a way to reduce the darkness in spruce top cracks? I'm thinking maybe something would clean out the dirt, or maybe lighten the color of it.

 

[Mr. P ~]

Chlorine Bleach will lighten darkened wood, but I have only used that on unfinished wood where I could use baking soda and water afterwards to neutralize the chlorine.

I don't know if that method is safe around a lacquer finish.

Sorry, not much help.

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

So the baking soda itself wouldn't help?

 

[Mr. P ~]

You would need to brush it somehow I guess.

As a kid when we ran out of toothpaste, we used a 50/50 mix of baking soda and table salt. I never knew if it was the abrasive nature of salt crystals or some action of the soda.

Again, I don't know.

Dan Erliwine's book on repair migt touch on the subject.

 

[curt]

Unless you FIX the crack you will always see the depth of the clear. There is a lot of clear on Guilds and as it ages it gets a little more amber. It's an easy fix if you have spray equipment and patience but the key is preparation. DON'T bleach it or you will always see the crack. Remember that what you are seeing is the mill thickness of the clear.

 

[West R Lee]

Can anyone tell me, in a nutshell, how you repair a cracked guitar top? Or do you simply stabilize the crack to prevent it's propagation?

West

 

[West R Lee]

Another thing I've always wondered about, is how you replace frets on a guitar that has neck binding?

West

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

Along that line, is it possible to replace frets without it showing?

 

[West R Lee]

I would think you could if the neck were not bound Darryl, what I would think would be difficult, would be to pull and replace frets without marring, cutting or otherwise defacing the binding around the neck. I'm sure it can be done though.

West

 

[Jeff]

Along that line, is it possible to replace frets without it showing?

Pretty tough to do if the ends of the frets are covered with finish. At least my guitar fixer hasn't been able to do it. I asked him about it & he simply said "It's part of the game". The lacquer fractures when the frets are moved. Now if money were no object, a couple hours carefully removing the lacquer on the edge of the fretboard & then carefully reapplying a couple coats of finish on the edge could work.. Or not replacing the finish on the edge of the fretboard.

Probably easily done on a bound neck, I'm sure the binding has to be removed & reinstalled after the frets are replaced. They price lists I've seen charge a pretty stiff extra fee to do frets on a bound neck.

So, West,, you ever need a refret on the DV 72, I'm guessin you're going to have to pay someone big bucks to disassemble your little beauty a bit.
Then you gotta trust him to get it back together like it never happened.

How's that feel ??? :? You could start playing with gloves so the frets will last longer. Probably the white gloves the marching bands use would work best. :wink:

Maybe someone who really knows will chime in with the facts.

 

[West R Lee]

I could even put on a little futuristic general's uniform, wear the white glove while I grab my crotch a lot, singing "ooooooo" You could call me West Jackson!

West

 

[Mr. P ~]

West,
The order of operation for fretting a bound neck on a new guitar is as follows:
1. Fret slots are cut in the fingerboard.
2. Binding grove is cut around the fingerboard.
3. Binding is applied.
4. Frets are cut to length.
5. Fret tangs are trimmed away on both ends of each fret so they don't touch the binding during installation.
6. Frets are installed, ends dressed, crowned, and leveled.

So for a refret job on a bound neck:
1. Pull the frets
2. Clean the fret slots
.....then pick up at number 4 above...
4. Frets are cut to length.
5. Fret tangs are trimmed away on both ends of each fret so they don't touch the binding after installation.
6. Frets are installed, ends dressed, crowned, and leveled.

I expect Jeff's repair guy said it was just part of the game because to do an invisble job takes so much more time few people would want to pay the added cost.

I mentioned Dan Erliwine earlier, and his method requires heating the frets with a modified soldering iron to loosen any glue that might have been used in the original fret installation. Extra heat applied on the ends just before starting to pull the frets would soften the lacquer and prevent chipping.

 

[Jeff]

Is this the tool most commonly used to pull frets? Looks like little more than a delicate set of nippers.

I envisioned something a little more complex. Sure enough would want to go slow and easy on West's DV72.

A guy might want to practice the soldering iron technique on a couple Gibsons first. Heat makes sense, just a real fine line between softening & burning.

http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tools/Speci ... llers.html

interesting close up pictures & tool & technique discussion.
http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier ... fret4.html

 

[Mr. P ~]

That is a new tool available from StewMac, and is smaller and lighter than the older tool that has been in use for many years. In the electronics industry it is refered to as a "flush cutter", since it does not leave a pointed end on a resistor lead for instance like a pair of diagonal cutters. The idea is to rock the frets out gradually to prevent chipping of the fretboard.

The Frank Ford description of refretting is very thorough and you may notice that he gives credit to Dan Erliwine for convincing him to start teaching.

As far as the soldering iron goes.....a Gibson would be a good choice to practice on!!:wink:

Seriously, practice on a pawn shop guitar is a must unless you have a professional helping you like I will.

 

[West R Lee]

All extremely interesting. Thanks a bunch guys.

I don't think I'd ever attempt it myself. It conjures up visions from a Saturday Night Live episode that ran many years ago. They had been running some car commercial (Lincoln or Cadillac), in which a diamond cutter cut this huge diamond while driving down a cobblestone street. The Saturday Night Live version had them performing a circumcision while driving down the same street. Of course, on SNL, the cutter missed .

I'm afraid my guitars would look like that poor child after I did a refret!

West

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

My work would look like Red Green did it. Frets attached with duct tape and doing double-duty as a grater.

 

[West R Lee]

 

[West R Lee]

Darryl, together we could be the "Tim the Toolmen" of
Luthierdom. We'd have people...professionals from all over bringing us their instruments knowing they would truly be "unique" when they left our shop. West Hattenhauer's Uniquely Custom Shop. Our Motto :"Anything Goes"

What da ya think?

West

 

[Darryl Hattenhauer]

It's so far out there that Hollywood would make a series out of it.

 

[Jeff]

Red Green

Sounds more like a Red Green gig to me.

You could sort of set the tone in the first episode.

'How to Turn a Gibson Jumbo into a useful Fish Smoker with duct tape & a Coleman stove."

Hedious idea, shamed I thought of it.