Tone enhancing gizmos

Boneman

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I saw there was another old thread on LTG with the title of the gizmo, but I didn’t want to revive that one to avoid any appearance the device is in any way endorsed by LTG or myself, or others. I simply decided to buy into the hype and bought my own to test it out.

Since getting the ‘68 D40, as well as playing my ‘82 D46 recently(which reminded me why I fell in love with Guilds in the first place), I came to realize I’m addicted to broken in tones. So that spurred my decision in all honesty. So I’ve figured I’d use it on my brand new Adi topped D50T. I mean why not, if it works as advertised, I won’t have to wait until I’m 80 for that one to fully break in. Trouble is it sounds so good now, it might be hard to tell if anything happened after running this unit on it for hours :ROFLMAO: But if it enhances an already outstanding guitar, money well spent. Then I can run it on all the others, make the vintage ones sound even better too :eek:

Now, I am definitely not being paid by them and not to mention I only just got it, so I don’t even know if it’ll work, or what impact it will have. However, the mad scientist in me says there’s no doubt it will work, so it’s on! Pun intended, lol. We shall see.

The other aspect is, it is LOUD, and I’m sure my wife won’t want to tolerate it. Heck I don’t know if I want to tolerate it. In fact as I type this, and listening to it drone on, I know I don’t want to listen to that, I’ll have to figure out placement. My walls are pretty thin, and the constant drone seeps through them.

Yes it has volume control, but low volumes won’t vibrate things as much and then I feel what’s the point? Short of a mechanical arm that swings a pick like a pendulum across the strings back and forth constantly, or the other similar gizmo tone rite, this at least allows for the top to vibrate while you are away, doing something else, whatever, boom, keeps the guitar top vibrating. So it has to be opening up, breaking it in faster than you can on your own. I mean you can feel it, it does vibrate each string, the whole top, sides, body, it’s pretty cool to watch.

The other neat thing is, you can select specific notes or a single string to vibrate and pinpoint the frequency to target that part of the tops tone range, and maybe enhance the bass strings for instance. If that works as imagined, then a guitar that is great except lacking in bass, well maybe you can run this with just the low e string or even a drop D tone for days, I dunno if that would wake up that part of the guitar, be an interesting test.

Ok, I am going to have to set it up in my spare bath downstairs. Even then, I am thinking I will hear it at midnight when everything else is quiet. If so, I guess I can’t run it constantly unless she’s not home lol. Whether the tones will reach the top floor I’ll have to see. Could become like white noise after awhile, and blend in with my tinnitus.

Also, since the guitar has to sit outside its case, I will keep the room humidity between 45-55. Easy peezy, and away it goes.

Day 1.
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I haven’t tried the Tone Traveler but I did make my own Tonerite using a $10 aquarium pump and some weather stripping. I want to say it helps break the newer ones in but it may all be in my head.
 
I worked on a bunch of stuff around the house, now time for dinner. It’s still going…;)
 
Trouble is it sounds so good now, it might be hard to tell if anything happened after running this unit on it for hours :ROFLMAO: But if it enhances an already outstanding guitar, money well spent. Then I can run it on all the others, make the vintage ones sound even better too :eek:
I'm a believer in "opening up" and I believe "playing hours" is the key to achieving it. If it can be done mechanically I don't mind but hey, I'd rather play it in.

Still your post reminded me of my own experience with my 3 Guild guitars: The entry level '96 D25 with an "A" top needed about 250 hours to open up and seems "topped out".

The AA-topped '03/'04 D40 is still improving with about 600 hours, but added much more slowly than the '25, and the '01 F65ce shows the least improvement but it was the best out of the box when new. The D40 only passed it in volume a few years back when it was about 8 years old IIRC.

So in my limited sample, my hypothesis is that the better they were when built, the less overall improvement they make.They'er just already "that good"

And that might be why quality of materials/labor costs can be justified, if the initial product is in fact "better" even if it doesn't seem to "improve" as much.

If it started off on a higher plane it probably stays there even as the lesser guitars improve, I suspect.
Nota bene I actually prefer the voice of the D40 the most now but the F65ce's a close second. Wouldn't want to give up the maple option.
 
It is my understanding that the objective of "opening up" an instrument is to use the sound waves to align the molecular structure of the woods and glues that it is made of so it will resonate at the frequencies it was designed to for.

That being said, molecular sonification being measured only by one's ear would be wildly subjective, even with those who have a trained ear, and most certainly by some of us in our later years where the ears do not function the same on a daily basis.

When you can pull different tones and timbres out of a guitar with different picks, or a violin with different bows, how can accurate measure truly be made?

I have a couple of top shelf investment grade mandolins that are pretty much a case queens. I break them out on occasion and after about and hour of playing they "open up" and sound like they are supposed to, at least to my ears.

Personally, I feel that just keeping the instrument out where it is subjected to every little sonic event is a big starting point, then just play it.

I watched a documentary on violin building years ago and remember that Stradavarius used finely ground gemstone dust in the varnish for effect. Gadgets are made to sell to people looking for that holy grail or secret shortcut. Good for the sellers, but caveat emptor.
 
It is my understanding that the objective of "opening up" an instrument is to use the sound waves to align the molecular structure of the woods and glues that it is made of so it will resonate at the frequencies it was designed to for.
NO snark intended, but I don't buy into that (and not saying that you do, you could simply be repeating what you've heard. I just don't believe molecules can be "realigned" at such low energy levels.

Sounds like the same pseudo-science arguments used for cryogenic strings and boiling bass strings, neither of which I buy into, either.

What I DO believe is that the oils and resins in the capillary tubes of the grain dry out/polymerize over time, and this affects the wood's ability to resonate. The vibration of playing would create a slight amount of heat which would accelerate polymerization, or molecular cross-linking as the H2O content lowers.

I also I believe the glue joints (especially hideglue) get "loosened up" from their original absolute adhesion and this again allows some extra vibration.

Lastly, NCL itself is in an ongoing state of "cure", as it ages it dries out until one day it returns to dust, literally, NC crystals. But as it loses the mass of its plasticizers/solvents it gets lighter and thus more resonant, less constriction on the top.

Re "Playing at the frequencies it was designed for", top and tap tuning are much better methods of inducing a particular "body resonant frequency", and I don't think "molecular realignment" would affect that if it even in fact occurs.

Oh yeah, Stradivarius also was known to store his wood under water and this is thought to have created some mineralization in the wood itself, possibly intentionally?
 
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NO snark intended, but I don't buy into that (and not saying that you do, you could simply be repeating what you've heard. I just don't believe molecules can be "realigned" at such low energy levels.

Sounds like the same pseudo-science arguments used for cryogenic strings and boiling bass strings, neither of which I buy into, either.

What I DO believe is that the oils and resins in the capillary tubes of the grain dry out/polymerize over time, and this affects the woods ability to resonate. The vibration of playing would create a slight amount of heat which would accelerate polymerization, or molecular cross-linking as the H2O content lowers.

I also I believe the glue joints (especially hideglue) get "loosened up" from their original absolute adhesion and tghis again allows some extra vibration.

Lastly, NCL itself is in an ongoing state of "cure", as it ages it dries out until one day it returns to dust, literally, NC crystals. But as it loses the mass of it's plasticizers/solvents it gets lighter and thus more resonant, less constriction on the top.

Re "Playing at the frequencies it was designed for", top and tap tuning are much better methods of inducing a particular "body resonant frequency", and I don't think "molecular realignment" would affect that if it even in fact occurs.

Oh yeah, Stradivarius also was known to store his wood under water and this is thought to have created some mineralization in the wood itself, possibly intentionally?
OK. I looked it up before I posted. It has more to do with the cutting, bending and positioning of the wood fibers and of course the finish. Interesting take on the glue. All instruments are designed with a certain pitch in mind, or they would never sound in tune. Tap tuning gets them closer.

 
So I had the device on for over 24 hours running constantly, loud as possible (but with the volume turned down for about 8 hours overnight). My initial reaction is that it works!. There is a noticeable difference in the responsiveness of the guitar, and I feel the guitar is most definitely more resonant. And by feel I mean as I play it, I feel it vibrating against me, it is pretty freakin cool.

I can also tell you that fingerstyle on this Adirondack top was hard to get good volume out of it. Playing Dust in the Wind would be a chore on the D50. Would have to really dig into it with fingers, to the point I figured I’d just use other guitars for fingerstyle. Now after just 20+hours it’s like a whole new guitar. No kidding, I am not even trying to dig into it and the volume and resonance is there.

As for frequencies, the instructions do say to tune the guitar to standard pitch. At that point, you can select a slew of notes, and they ring out at the different frequency. It’s no mumbo jumbo Al, you can hear it. Play just the low E it drones along but switch the B string on, weeeeee much higher tone rips out. Or play all 6 at once.

Yes, I feel playing them is best. But with more than one guitar, you can’t play them all, and there could several other use cases for these. They’ll definitely wake up any sleepers lol
 
As for frequencies, the instructions do say to tune the guitar to standard pitch. At that point, you can select a slew of notes, and they ring out at the different frequency. It’s no mumbo jumbo Al, you can hear it. Play just the low E it drones along but switch the B string on, weeeeee much higher tone rips out. Or play all 6 at once.
Oh I don't doubt it, I think the vibration is a legitimate substitute for playing time, I only disagreed with the "molecular realignment" thing.
Yes, I feel playing them is best. But with more than one guitar, you can’t play them all, and there could several other use cases for these. They’ll definitely wake up any sleepers lol
IIRC I put about 900 hours on my D25 by the time I got my Corona D40 brand new. I didn't actually play it till I got home I was amazed at what wimp it was. :LOL: I actually used to call it "the sonic runt of the litter". Even my F65ce only a couple of years old with maybe a hundred hours was equally loud with far longer "fade", the time until a full 6-string 12th-fret harmonic chord took to fade to silence. something like 15 seconds vs 9 IIRC, and the '25 was real close to the F65ce, and louder than the '40.

Over the years a couple of things led me to start playing then D40 as much as I could and the improvement was l slow but when it was about 8 years old one night I realized it was louder than the F65ce, was up to about 11 seconds in "fade", and had more presence than the '25. Like a brighter light bulb.

But yeah, even with only 3 guitars I never really gave 'em all equal playing time. The '25's up to about 1400 hours now I think, the '40's probably around 500, the F65ce's probably around 400. I stopped tracking when the '40 became my favorite voiced wife.

(My GF understands. :D)
 
I've done this, and posted my perceived results either here, or on the Collings page.

About 3 years ago I ordered a Collings D1A with Adirondack bracing. In preparation, I bought a Tone-Rite after having read very mixed reviews. I'd say opinions were 50/50 with some swearing by the Tone-Rite while other not so much. I received my Tone-Rite maybe two months prior to the arrival of my D1A, so had the opportunity to try it on my other guitars.....all of them. To be honest, I saw little improvement, though it seemed to help my newer guitars more than my older ones.

Then the D1A arrived and I played her for a few days.......she sounded pretty incredible out of the box. But I went ahead and ran the Tone-Rite for about 5 straight days and nights, constantly changing the frequency. There was a very noticeable difference afterwards. My opinion is that they indeed help new guitars. Now whether that's just a function of settling joints and everything finding its place, I couldn't tell you. But it made a noticeable difference on my new guitar. It seemed to help my D2HA as well, but not as pronounced. It too has an Adirondack top and is a 2018 model.

West
 
Great anecdote West. Ok so quick question, have you noticed if the D1A reverted back at all, or did the work stick?
 
Great anecdote West. Ok so quick question, have you noticed if the D1A reverted back at all, or did the work stick?
It definitely stuck. The thing is, they tell you to them to run your guitars on them periodically. I've never done that. Makes sense though to simulate constant playing. I might also be a bit apprehensive about running it with a pickup of any kind. They sure shake a guitar.....the Tone-Rite does anyway......I can't speak to the others.

West
 
Great anecdote West. Ok so quick question, have you noticed if the D1A reverted back at all, or did the work stick?
I'd expect it to"stick" as he said. Also seems to corroborate my earlier observation:

"So in my limited sample, my hypothesis is that the better they were when built, the less overall improvement they make. They're just already 'that good'. "
 
they tell you to them to run your guitars on them periodically.

I may throw it on once in awhile, but honestly, I’ve been playing my D50 in between sessions on the tone device so far. I’d say between the device and my playing, the top has been in near constant motion, since what Saturday morning. I don’t know how much more it will need because it sounds pretty freaking awesome right now. It’s most definitely opened up a lot since starting the treatment, but the low bass notes rumble more, it has a much more pronounced snarl, growl, whatever you want to call it when you grab that Em chord from an F#minor. The D major chord shimmers a bit more now, very noticeable to my ears.
They're just already 'that good'. "
It really was, and this is just like tuning up the engine to get top performance out of it :)
 
I may throw it on once in awhile, but honestly, I’ve been playing my D50 in between sessions on the tone device so far. I’d say between the device and my playing, the top has been in near constant motion, since what Saturday morning. I don’t know how much more it will need because it sounds pretty freaking awesome right now. It’s most definitely opened up a lot since starting the treatment, but the low bass notes rumble more, it has a much more pronounced snarl, growl, whatever you want to call it when you grab that Em chord from an F#minor. The D major chord shimmers a bit more now, very noticeable to my ears.

It really was, and this is just like tuning up the engine to get top performance out of it :)
Yes, a noticeable bass improvement and general overall projection and sustain enhancement.

West
 
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