Starfire IV vs. Gibson ES 335

[lungimsam]

Owned both? Or even any Starfire vs any ES?
What was your experience with the guitars?

 

[DeArmond Hammer]

If they were ice creams, they'd be strawberry and vanilla. The Starfire being strawberry, of course.

 

[GAD]

I’ve probably been tainted by playing Guilds for so ling that I’ve never been wowed by an ES335. To be fair I’ve never played a vintage one.

 

[GGJaguar]

I had a R9 Historic 335 that I was never totally happy with. I tried different pickups, pots, caps and... just wasn't what I was looking for. The Starfire IVs from the 1990s hit the mark with nothing more than putting on my favorite strings. I think the main difference is the Starfires are more "lively". I have also played some Heritage 335 style guitars that were more lively than their Gibson counterparts.

 

[GSFV]

I haven’t owned both. But I played an ES335 in the store for a few hours and even had convinced my wife we could afford this guitar we very much could not afford! A friend told me to check out Guild beforehand. But there weren’t any in town. So I ordered one from guitar center because they have a 30 day return policy.

Other shop assured me the guitar would be there a few days because they weren’t ready to sell it. Apparently it wasn’t supposed to be on the floor When I found it. I never had the chance to A/B them. But I found the NS Starfire V to have a neck pickup with greater clarity, and the bridge pickup was more to my liking for overdriven sounds.

It also had a master volume I very much appreciated. And I liked the toggle switch locations better. plus...Guildsby!! It was also about ¼ of the price.

And while I still very much want to own a gibson they definitely lost some luster in my eyes that day. I’ve had my starfire for 3 and a half years and been quite happy with it! And it’s a Korean NS, people here on the page RAVE about how much better the 90’s ones were and the vintage ones also.

 

[shihan]

I owned a 1979 ES-335 for many years. While late ‘70’s 335’s are not the most desirable ones; it was an excellent guitar in every way. I did reluctantly sell it to keep my personal supervisor happy after I bought an X-500.
My ‘97 SF4 is very different, but equally wonderful in every way. I would say my 335 was like a Cadillac, and my SF is a sports car.

 

[powerwagonjohn]

I have a 1973 Starfire IV with a mahogany body, a 2009 Gibson ES-345 and a GSR Starfire VI They are all great playing guitars and all have their own sound and feel. If I need that Gibson ES sound there is nothing that does it like a Gibson. I seem to play all three the same amount if I am playing a semi-hollow body. It would be hard to choose one over the others. Lately it had been the GSR, before that was the ES-345 and a couple weeks ago it was the 73 Starfire. It is nice to have a choice.
Thanks John

 

[Quantum Strummer]

I've played a lot of Starfire IVs & Vs over the years but could never get fully down with the body size. I do have a '73 335 given to me by a close and no longer living friend that I'll never sell or give away, but I don't play it much. The "335" I do play is an '82 Ibanez AS-50. Body size 1/16th smaller than the norm and terrific low-wind Super 58 pickups that combine humbucker oomph with Telecaster-y treble bite.

-Dave-

 

[Mark WW]

The 335 "Style" guitar is my favorite body shape. I am down to 3 right now. As already stated a comparison between the Guild and the Gibson maybe shouldn't be an either or. I have owned (2) Gibson 335's and both had the dreaded (to me) 60's slim neck which I abhor. I don't remember which pups they had but they were not the 57's which I like a lot. I am extremely cheap so Gibson is completely off the table for me now that I am retired. My Guild is a Newark Street SF VI. The neck is a little bit on the thin side for me but it is playable. Unlike some other folks I rather like the mini hums and can't seem to find fault with the fact that the neck pup is a wee bit hotter than the bridge. But I have tried and failed to discern anything unlikeable about the pups but no one ever said my taste was beyond reproach. I also like the master volume feature and the inlays. And the amber coloring.

 

[walrus]

I have owned (2) Gibson 335's and both had the dreaded (to me) 60's slim neck which I abhor.

Gotta go back to the '50's and very early 60's for the fat "Les Paul-ish" neck! That prices most of us out!

walrus

 

[shihan]

Gotta go back to the '50's and very early 60's for the fat "Les Paul-ish" neck! That prices most of us out!

walrus

The late ‘70’s-early ‘80’s 335’s had fantastic necks; very reminiscent of ‘90’s SF’s. Quality varies, but some excellent 335’s from that period are out there.

 

[Mark WW]

Gotta go back to the '50's and very early 60's for the fat "Les Paul-ish" neck! That prices most of us out!

walrus

I have this weird thing about dot fret markers. I dislike them. Got to be some kind of block, capital or parallel inlays and the 50's styles Gibbies I have looked at all had dots. I wrote to Gibson recently about some neck specs and my answer was SILENCE. Interesting marketing approach. I have sent questions in the past and NEVER receive an answer however Guild...they answer every single time and pretty durn quick too.

Here are pics of what is left of my 335 style guitars...

Really cheap Grote Jazz 335 (Replaced all of the hardware including pups)

Ibanez AS73 - All stock except addition of Towner Bar and Bigsby. I purchased it new with the intention of replacing the pickups but I like them a lot.

Newark Street Guild Starfire VI - Bone stock

 

[walrus]

Nice threesome, Mark!

walrus

 

[Dano]

I had both at the same time for awhile and did many A/B comparisons (not recorded) -- a 2013 Gibson es335 and a 1997 SF4 in Mahogany. Similar measurements as far as nut width and neck size. The SF4 had the Seymour Duncan era pickups and sounded great; it was also more resonate and sounded better unplugged. The main difference between the two is where the neck sits (and thus the bridge). The SF4 has the bridge in the "correct" alignment centered with the middle of the f-holes whereas the 335 is shifted forward, and thus has a longer neck. So when playing strapped, the es335 just felt better to me and seemed to respond better in my hands -- you know, those slight neck bends, etc. The SF4 was recently sold...

 

[Mark WW]

Nice threesome, Mark!

walrus

Thank you. I went through a lot of guitars to get down to those three. I REALLY wanted a fat necked Gibby 335 with block markers so I wrote to Gibson inquiring what might come close and they never responded. Great sales technique. So I bought the cheap Grote with the Mickey Mouse ears and stripped and replaced a lot of its guts. With the exception of Guild I don't really care that much what is on the headstock. For me it is 1) Aesthetics 2) How it plays 3) How it sounds.

Honestly I think the Ibanez Artcores and such are the most free of any issues and all of the ones I have owned have been playable right out of the box but I do have them set up professionally anyway. BUt that is just my personal experience and not a negative judgement regarding any other specific brand.

 

[Guildadelphia]

I have to agree, Ibanez Artcores are really incredible values, especially the models that still come w/ the Super 58 pu's (which continue to be really great sounding lower output vintage PAF style 'buckers). If you really want something a step up (and still for a tick less than $1,000) the Ibanez "Artstar" Series 335 style guitars take things up to another level with beautifully finished fretwork w/ boutique style rounded "hot dog" shaped fret ends, fancier woods, hardshell case, and pristine overall fit and finish that is very reminiscent of a Japanese made Ibanez rather than the Artstar's Indonesian origin.

 

[dreadnut]

'60's ES-335's are upwards of 10X the price of '60's SF-4's. Just sayin'.

 

[Mark WW]

I have to agree, Ibanez Artcores are really incredible values, especially the models that still come w/ the Super 58 pu's (which continue to be really great sounding lower output vintage PAF style 'buckers). If you really want something a step up (and still for a tick less than $1,000) the Ibanez "Artstar" Series 335 style guitars take things up to another level with beautifully finished fretwork w/ boutique style rounded "hot dog" shaped fret ends, fancier woods, hardshell case, and pristine overall fit and finish that is very reminiscent of a Japanese made Ibanez rather than the Artstar's Indonesian origin.

You are probably correct. The weird thing is I had an AS93 with Super 58's and it was a nice guitar for sure but for some unknown reason I preferred the cheapo ceramic pickups in this AS73. Now I mostly play clean and had long wanted the 58's but in the end...

 

[GSFV]

I have weighed in earlier. And while I really dream to own a Gibson 3x5 (probably a 345, because the Veritone circuit seems like a cool think in certain applications??) I am even further away from that now than I was when I first posted. I just swapped out the entire wiring harness and capacitors, switches, input jack, etc etc. Got a really respected guy in town to do it and paid for quality parts! I wasn't disappointed in the StarFire before hand. But this thing has come ALIVE! It is like a whole new guitar. So even if you factor in the electronics swap, it is still a third to a quarter of the price of a 335. I agree with Mark, I don't dislike the NS PUPs. I think they're very versatile and usable.

If you have cash to throw around and won't be happy with anything but a Gibson, then go gibson. You won't be happy with anything but one. But if you just love the 335 style, and want a great guitar! Go with a Guild. I highly recommend the NS ones. Wait a little while and swap the electronics. Totally worth it in my book!

 

[powerwagonjohn]

A case can be made to own both if one can afford it. I waited a long time since 1975 when I first wanted a Starfire, then later a Gibson. GSFV sounds you have found the guitar of your dreams, enjoy.
Thanks John