StarFire III (1966) misaligned neck pick up.

[nsurround]

HI,

I have a 1966 StarFire III that has the neck pickup poles not not in line directly over the strings. More so towards the low end strings as shown in the photo. I have had this guitar since the early 70's but was never sure that this was an issue or not or was an intentional part of the design. The Bridge pickup poles align directly over each string again as shown in the photo. Both pickups are exactly the same dimension with the first and last pole of each pickup the same distance across from each other. Not sure how the bigsby alignment could setup correctly with the bridge pickup but not the neck pickup unless something else is out of alignment. Any feedback on this would be appreciated.

 

[hansmoust]

Both pickups are exactly the same dimension with the first and last pole of each pickup the same distance across from each other.

That's what's wrong with your Starfire! It has two bridge pickups. A fingerboard pickup has a narrower pole piece spacing.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

 

[Quantum Strummer]

Many older guitars have minor amounts of string/polepiece misalignment due to errors in manufacture or (more commonly) not calibrating polepiece or magnet spacing based on the pickup's location. In my experience it doesn't matter sonically unless the misalignment is extreme, but it can be kinda annoying to look at. ☺ In this case if the bridge-calibrated pickup in the neck position sounds good I'd leave it alone, especially if it's a vintage one.

-Dave-

 

[nsurround]

If I did want to replace the current pickup in the neck position any real options? I would of course keep the original if I swapped out. Guild sells a neck LB-1 Nickle pickup but not sure of the pole spacing etc.

 

[GAD]

If I did want to replace the current pickup in the neck position any real options? I would of course keep the original if I swapped out. Guild sells a neck LB-1 Nickle pickup but not sure of the pole spacing etc.

Nickel won't match the chrome:

Just watch on Ebay/Reverb. They come up every now and again. You might have to be patient.

Here's a bunch of detail on the AntiHums and LB1 pickups for you:

Guild Anti-Hum and LB1 Mini-Humbucker Pickups

Guild AntiHum Mini-Humbucker Pickup Teardown

More non-AntiHum specific stuff at https://gadsguilds.com

 

[nsurround]

Thanks for the info. Forgot about the different metal covers (nickle vs chrome). I measured the string spacing vs the pole (center to center) and the neck pick up is exactly the same as the bridge pickup in pole spacing. The string spacing for the neck pickup is a little over a 3mm difference from its pole spacing . The low E lies just outside of its pole piece OD. So I have two bridge pickups! Not sure I can find a neck replacement outside of a used one but if anyone else has any ideas on this let me know. Thanks for all of the previous comments.

 

[nsurround]

After reading the link that GAD sent about the LB-1 pickups I can see that a previous owner of the guitar probably changed the orig neck pickup with a bridge pickup to balance better the volume between between the two pickups. When I purchased the guitar I do not remember getting the original neck pickup separate from the guitar. In any case, I may now just live with it or find a used original neck pickup somewhere.

 

[GAD]

The LB1 pickups were imbalanced in modern NS guitars - not the Antihums on the vintage US made Guilds.

 

[nsurround]

Again good to know about the NS vs Antihums. Thanks.

 

[GAD]

FWIW, when I was collecting data for my AntiHum project I saw a fair number of mismatched pairs for sale with two necks or two bridge pickups. It also wouldn't surprise me if someone bought the first AntiHum they found to replace the neck in yours not knowing there was a difference.

 

[kakerlak]

FWIW, when I was collecting data for my AntiHum project I saw a fair number of mismatched pairs for sale with two necks or two bridge pickups. It also wouldn't surprise me if someone bought the first AntiHum they found to replace the neck in yours not knowing there was a difference.

Yeah, Hans could answer better as to how likely yours was to have accidentally left the factory with two bridge pickups. As for replacing it, if it sounds good (or pretty good), I wouldn't bother trying to replace it with anything but a vintage neck pickup. If you're keen on that, I'd keep an eye out for one and then try it out and sell off the extra bridge pickup if you think the neck one sounds better. In this case, I don't think you'd be devaluing the guitar any by replacing the existing neck pickup with a factory-correct one, even if it left the factory as a goof-up. And you ought to more-or-less break even after selling the current vintage pickup.

I think that there's a hole stamped in the center of the base plate of either bridge or neck pickups on the vintage ones that lets you know which you're looking at when you're scouring ebay/reverb; I just don't remember which of the two has the hole.

 

[GAD]

The bridge has the hole.

Here's a neck to compare:

Both from https://www.gad.net/Blog/2018/03/09/guild-anti-hum-lb1-mini-humbucker-pickups/#gallery-8

 

[nsurround]

Just remembered that I had taken some cell photos of the backs of the pickups when I had the guitar apart etc. Will post if I find them. Now thinking I might purchase the LB-1 Neck (7K) pickup and try out even though it will be nickel instead of chrome. Since the LB-1 probably matches the original bridge pickup (7K) and pole to string will be a better alignment. Would keep the original neck(bridge) pickup in case of sale etc. The flower power finger board was custom by me in the early 70's. What did I know? In any case, will let you all know if I install the LB-1 neck pickup in the near future.

 

[nsurround]

Well I found the photos and as you can see the neck pickup does not have a hole in it like the bridge pickup which is what GADs article said was correct. However the pole spacing is exactly the same on both of them. I suppose it is possible that this was an error when being manufactured originally. Assembly person thought it was a neck pickup because it did not have the hole. Just a guess. Maybe there were antihum bridge pickups that did not have a hole.

 

[GAD]

It's also possible that not all bridge pickups have holes in them. That's just something we've observed over time. Do you happen to know what they measure?

I *think* that the hole helps to identify the baseplate during assembly since it should have differently spaced holes than the neck. I could make up all sorts of reasons for that like the early ones not having that until the line workers complained but I absolutely don't know for sure.

 

[kakerlak]

Pole spacing aside, after looking at your first pictures again, I think we have to say that neck pickup is still skewed a little off center. If it was centered with too wide a pole spread, the D and G strings would be the closest to centered, with both E poles falling a bit outside the CtC spread of the strings. On yours, the high E looks pretty well centered, with the rest gradually falling farther past each string as you go towards the low E.

You might see whether you can cheat it over towards the high E when you put it back together. Sometimes you can scoot 'em over a little while you snug everything down; sometimes the holes are such that it pulls itself tight right back where it started no matter how much persuasion you offer.

[Edit] you could also flip it around 180° to put the poles under a slightly wider cross section of strings.

All in all, I doubt it makes a huge sonic difference either way, with those being pretty small pole screws on a humbucker. Not like it's a strat...

 

[davismanLV]

Not debating anything already said, but in the closeup photo is the string spacing off, shifted towards the treble side or is the photo just taken at an angle. I see more excess space on the bass side than the treble. Is it just the photo?

 

[Nuuska]

Hello

I see same as Tom. Picture is taken from angle - but not THAT much. More space on low E side on fingerboard. In both pictures one can see that low E goes almost straight all the way to Guildsby, while high E makes a turn at the bridge. (Not talking about break angle here.) All this leads to conclusion, that it might be BRIDGE pickup in slightly wrong place.

To check and make sure - first adjust the sideways location of the bridge so that strings are even over fingerboard, Then have a look and see what pup is where.

 

[mellowgerman]

Sounds like you may indeed have two bridge pickups, but I'll throw in another vote for centering the floating aluminum bridge. From my first glance at your photos, that's what stood out to me before anything else (uneven space between outsides of fretboard and your E strings)

 

[DThomasC]

I see the strings off center too. If it were my instrument I would center the bridge and not think about it any more.

Do you want to replace the pickup because you don't like the way it sounds, or because it looks like it must be wrong? If you like the way it sounds then spend less time thinking about it and more time playing.