Slight bridge lift to worry about?

Boneman

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Seems the D25 I just nabbed probably hasn’t had any real play, or maintenance in its life, why it’s so clean. There’s really no wear on the back or front of the neck, no dimples in the frets, but the intonation is slightly off, it’s a bit sharp on each string. Then I noticed the bridge has a slight lift gap, higher on the treble side where I can slide a business card about 1/8” in, the low E side still good. See photos, is that something to be overly concerned with? If its ok to leave, is there anything I can do to intonate it? Bevel the saddle maybe? What is the consensus? Also threw a string action gauge on it for a data point. Thanks in advance (y)
 

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wileypickett

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It's possible the bridge has lifted enough to throw off the intontation. (This was the case on a few of my used Guilds; correcting the forward tilt of the bridge, either with a Bridge Doctor or by having the bridge reseated, also corrected the intonation issues.)

It's also possible that other factors are causing it.

The geometry of a guitar changes over time as the wood seasons and as the forward pull of the strings causes either some bellying behind the bridge, or the top to dip around the soundhole. Sometimes these changes are so slight as to be almost undetectable to the naked eye, but they can affect intonation. (I've seen this too.)

In which case, all that may be required is for the old saddle slot to be filled with rosewood and a new, properly intonated, saddle slot routed.

I'd show it to your luthier. I suspect s/he will recommend having the bridge reseated as the first course of action. Once that's done, I'd hydrate the hell out of it for a few weeks, then re-evaluate.

Even guitars that are otherwise in like-new condition, with little play on them, are still subject to the effects of string pull, especially if the guitar hasn't been properly hydrated.
 
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Boneman

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It's possible the bridge has lifted enough to throw off the intontation. (This was the case on a few of my used Guilds; correcting the forward tilt of the bridge, either with a Bridge Doctor or by having the bridge reseated, also corrected intontation issues.)

It's also possible that other factors are causing it.

The geometry of a guitar changes over time as the wood seasons and as the forward pull of the strings causes either some bellying behind the bridge, or the top to dip around the soundhole. Sometimes these changes are so slight as to be almost undetectable to the naked eye, but they can affect intonation. (I've seen this too.)

In which case, all that may be required is for the old saddle slot to be filled with rosewood and a new, properly intonated, saddle slot cut.

I'd show it to your luthier. I suspect s/he will recommend having the bridge reseated as the first course of action. Once that's done, I'd hydrate the hell out of it for a few weeks, then re-evaluate.

Even guitars that are otherwise in like-new condition, with little play on them, are still subject to the effects of string pull, especially if the guitar has not been properly hydrated.
Thank you for the thoughts on the matter Wiley. I’ll start to look into a fix then, to ensure another 40 years of good playing! In the meantime, I am hydrating the heck out of it now, though I would suspect the tone woods should be torrified by now.
 

Boneman

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The saddle looks very tall on that bridge. It has likely contributed to the bridge lift, given the torque that bridge is under.

Any evidence that the neck has been reset (perhaps overset)?
I don’t think the neck was touched, if anything’s been done to this guitar, they replaced the nut at one point but heck, it never even had a strap button for the neck heel installed. I don’t even know who I would trust to remove and reglue the bridge around me, I’ll have to research guitar repair guys nearby.
 

chazmo

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Well, until you find one, Boneman, go ahead and play it with light strings and maybe tune it down a 1/2 or something. To me, it doesn't look like it's ready to rip off, especially if you keep it under pitch.
 

Boneman

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Sounds good chazmo, thanks, that gives me some relief thinking it’s okay for now, no need to rush (y)
 

Guildedagain

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For sharp intonation go with the next step smaller strings.

Slight bridge lifting is not that big a concern and unlikely to change intonation.
 

Boneman

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Well sadly even with it tuned down and playing it some, humidifiers in the case, I just noticed it appears to be lifted ever so higher, where I swear I can now see the glue stretching, so I slacked off the strings, and am talking myself into fixing it myself. pros and cons? I suspect many will say nooo, take it to someone. But certainly can’t be difficult with patience and the right tools no? I definitely do not want the finished f’ed up, and I would take care to ensure that, not confident someone I take it to would do the same. We all read that horror story of the D55 getting finish checked cause of the “luthier” Sam Ash referred him to didn’t be cautious with temp changes in the hot sonoran desert. Anyway, I’ll think long and hard before I get after it, might take it to someone experienced yet, but also don’t want to spend good money after bad, and who knows how long it’ll be out of commission. If I do it, I will learn another useful skill and it will get done asap. :unsure:
 

Boneman

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Hey there, for whomever is interested, I finally got around to popping the bridge off and reglueing it. So by this time tomorrow I ought to be able to see if I did a good enough job :) I know I did mess up just a bit of the finish on the leading edge as I wiggled the spatula under it, but all in all it wasn’t really difficult and indeed there was about a 1/4” of finish under the outer edge where the glue didn’t adhere and caused the lifting. I meticulously scraped that finish off and cleaned and sanded up both surfaces, scored them before slathering glue on (Titebond original) and securing in place with the Stew Mac bridge caul. Probably spent more on the repair tools than paying someone to do the job, but now I have the tools and the know how so was worth the expense to me. Photo proof follows, what you think? ;)
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PreacherBob

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Hey there, for whomever is interested, I finally got around to popping the bridge off and reglueing it. So by this time tomorrow I ought to be able to see if I did a good enough job :) I know I did mess up just a bit of the finish on the leading edge as I wiggled the spatula under it, but all in all it wasn’t really difficult and indeed there was about a 1/4” of finish under the outer edge where the glue didn’t adhere and caused the lifting. I meticulously scraped that finish off and cleaned and sanded up both surfaces, scored them before slathering glue on (Titebond original) and securing in place with the Stew Mac bridge caul. Probably spent more on the repair tools than paying someone to do the job, but now I have the tools and the know how so was worth the expense to me. Photo proof follows, what you think? ;)
25F97530-FA53-4847-96F8-B1B46DD2C162.jpeg
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That’s a fine job Boneman! You’ll be doing neck resets in no time. Is that an older clamp and caul set or a newer one? The ones I have from stew Mac some years ago look very different and have the thumb screws on each end of the caul. I see threaded holes but maybe yours didn’t come with them. It’ll be just fine and I haven’t had one fail yet, maybe 20 or so.
 

Boneman

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...Not to mention the satisfaction of doing it! (y)
Indeed! Similar to the refret I did for the first time, was very fulfilling :)
That’s a fine job Boneman! You’ll be doing neck resets in no time. Is that an older clamp and caul set or a newer one? The ones I have from stew Mac some years ago look very different and have the thumb screws on each end of the caul. I see threaded holes but maybe yours didn’t come with them. It’ll be just fine and I haven’t had one fail yet, maybe 20 or so.
Thanks PB!! It was their newest one, and the wings of the caul use the hex head screwdriver that it comes with to raise or lower. The c-clamps I also bought from them when I needed to repair a crack back when. The caul also has two threaded screws that line up with the outer pin holes to get it in the right spot :) I'll post photos once I pull off the rig.
 

chazmo

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Looks like a good job, boneman. (y) You might look into some colored lacquer to clean up the edges when you're all done here with the reattachment. Test it on some raw wood first to try to get a reasonable color match to your yellowed lacquer in the burst.
 

Boneman

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Here are the after photos, you can see the front edge is a little rough, and the one spot on the back on the treble side. Not terrible, being the first time I ever did it. I strung it up with what I had on hand which are only .11s and brought up to pitch no problem, sounds pretty good 👍🏼 Will likely upgrade to .12s or .13s after its broken in :)
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Boneman

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Oh and here is the gratuitous money shot, now fully dressed and ready for a night out lol. Polished body, oiled fretboard fresh strings, mm mmm.
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davismanLV

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Good job!! I like your spirit of adventure! I'd mask off the bridge and then use one of those stain touch up pens you can buy from Minwax. A light goldy color like Golden Oak might do it. Test first on raw wood. Anyway, congrats!! (y)(y)
 
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