p90 Franz..

[Lensman]

Hi,

I was searching the forum but couldn't find the answer i was looking for. Maybe i overlooked it. Is there someting on the market like a Franz pickup in a p90 shape? I don't care much for the looks and as i understand from Lollar, Franz pickup are a bit different in construction?
I would love to try a Franzy pickup on my x500t..

 

[Walter Broes]

I don't care much for the looks

HUH?!?! :shock:

I don't know if anyone's "cracked the code" yet as in magnet type and wire gauge, but I guess if you want someone to wind one for you, a specialist like Lollar might be your best bet. It should be perfectly possible to wind one on a Gibson type bobbin, they're extremely similar size-and construction-wise, it's mostly the mounting system that's different.

I think a lot of the sound of a Franz as compared to a Gibson is that they're underwound in comparison - Franz pickups measure out between 5 and 6K, a typical Gibson P90 is between 7 and 8, more towards 8K. The magnet structure looks exactly the same, two alnico bar magnets under the coil.
The "underwound" idea would make sense to me, because as you put more wire on a coil, you get less treble and more midrange - which is how a Franz compares to a Gibson.

perceived output is about the same - and I think the magnets take care of that.

 

[Lensman]

Ehhhh not very convincing not to go for looks owning a Guild haha indeed. Sorry about that one. I was trying to say i am not going for the looks of a Franz pick up, just the sound. I will do some asking arround and will let you all know. If there's anyone who knows more allready, please let me know..

 

[jazzman]

The construction is basically the same as a P-90 although I am pretty sure the bobbin is a bit smaller than a P-90. You could just get an underwound P-90 and that would do the trick. Keep in mind that the Franz pickups were VERY inconsistent. I've had some that sounded FANTASTIC (and I"m sure that is the sound you're after) but I've had a lot of them that were just plain WEAK!
I've got a super clean '54 X-50 at the store right now that has a great sounding pickup!

It's been a while since I've been around everyone. It's good to be back!
-Bobby

 

[Lensman]

[a lot of them that were just plain WEAK!

By weak, do you mean less output or just bad sounding overall?

Lensman

 

[Walter Broes]

I have four pairs of them, all late 50's/early 60's, and they're all about the same, nothing inconsistent there, but I do realise that's a fairly small sampling.

Lensman, one guy's thin and wiry is another one's bright and twangy, you know?

 

[Guild Beginner]

In pictures (before I owned my CE-100D), I wasn't crazy about the look of Franz pickups, but in person they look great.

 

[jp]

Hi Lensman,
Welcome to the forum. Nice vid on your intro post. Regarding the Franz PU. . .

if you're willing to pay, an LTGer said Jason Lollar is convinced he can wind up a P-90 to sound very close to a Franz. Read about it here. . .

With what they're going for nowadays, you may even get that great sound for less than the price of vintage Franz PUs.

In pictures (before I owned my CE-100D), I wasn't crazy about the look of Franz pickups, but in person they look great.

Wholly agree. I don't think they look that much different, though I'd love to have some covers in black.

 

[jazzman]

by weak I mean the sound was super thin. That's just my preference though. Tone is subjective for sure! I like my franz pickups to be a little fuller and thicker sounding. I remember a late 50s X-350 I had and it was just BLAH. But I had a '53 X-350 just a couple years ago that was AMAZING!
My guess is that you'll find more good ones than "bad" ones but its that way with anything.
I"ve played 50s and 60s strats that had great sounding pickups and ones with not so good sounding ones too.

 

[Lensman]

I understand. It is a matter of taste. But i can imagine that a Franz would sound different on different guitars. Same with strats. I've owned a bunch of them and not all pickups sound good on a particular strat...
But i'm a twanger...
I think i'm going to try to fabricate a Franz sounding pickup starting with a p90... Wish me luck, i'm going te need it LOL