Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-replaced with Ping tuners

[taabru45]

Maybe they are just old, maybe I've been spoiled by Shallers or Grovers, but, these seem to slip a little bit or have a looseness that I don't notice on my other guitars. I love the sound, but I think I've been spoiled by my other guitars that seem to stay in tune for months on end. Should I replace them, get used to them, what about mini grovers? Suggestions? :? Steffan

 

[capnjuan]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

Hi Steffan; I switched out 6-on-a-plate tuners for Grover minis. Keeping it original is one thing but if you want it as a daily player ... that's another. J

 

[taabru45]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

Thats what I was thinking CJ. Its such a sweet instrument, but also calling out to me for a couple of changes, such as I've replaced one of the G strings with an unwound that is at the same pitch, I'm going to use 2 extra light wound G....don't need the high end jangle. Also am going to switch positions of the octave strings... I do a lot of finger picking so I hit them from either direction, but think I'd likd the lower octave strings available for my thumb...don't think I'll put a bixby on it though.... :lol: :lol: Steffan

 

[capnjuan]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

...don't think I'll put a bixby on it though.... :lol: :lol:

Yes, I think you'd want to wait on that ... :wink:

 

[Brad Little]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

About ten years ago I replaced the 6 on a strip original tuners on my F-212 with mini Schallers (I kept the originals). The old ones just were getting a little tired, at least to me. Kept tune okay but were getting harder to tune. I'd do it again, although I might go with open back Grovers or Waverlys even though they don't fit as well without some alteration to them. The Schallers are a little heavier than I'd like, but they work well.

Brad

 

[Guildmark]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

There was a time I never would have considered open tuners. But they don't work badly on classical guitars, and I have noticed a few custom luthiers using them on steel strings in the past few years. Granted, Waverlys are about the price of a new Segue, but they have a traditional aspect about them, and a decent set of 6-on-a-plate tuners can work pretty well. I would give those old tuners a tune up before tossing 'em. Make sure all the screws are snugged down hand tight, the gears are properly lubricated and the grooves in the nut aren't binding the string. If that is all as it should be and you're still having trouble, it's time to retire them.

'at's my 2¢. Where's my change?

 

[gilded]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

I have a '68 F112 with original open-back tuners. I like it a a lot and play it frequently. The tuners are in good (but not great) shape.

Last year, I had a '70's G312. It sounded very good but it had mini-schallers (or grovers) on it. It was very neck-heavy and the neck dive was not fun to deal with. So, I sold it. I'm glad I did, because I play the F112 a lot more........

My point is, get some good tuners, but get the lightest tuners you can to replace the originals. That probably means open back tuners, or certainly 'on-a-plate' tuners. Does any body make an open-back 12 set these days? I dunno. I just did a google search and couldn't find any. Maybe check with WD Parts and see if they have some. I think WD owns Kluson, but I'm not sure.

I think there are some threads here about fixing up (tightening up?) the original japanese-made tuners, too.

Good luck.

 

[taabru45]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

Well, I'm takin' a few moments out to tell you about Ping...I was for no particular reason cruising thru my favorite music store tonight, played a few high end acoustics, very nice but just not like an old Guild. I noticed on one of the racks, tuners, so checked out what they had for a 12. There were a set of Ping tuners, on a strip..and $30 bucks...well hey! So I came home with them and a new set of D'Addario PB Medium strings which I thought I'd tune down a tone on my old 72 F112...W O W ! What a different guitar. The tuners fit right in even the screws. And even a tone lower, so sweet and rich, and in tune. So I took it to an open G. It just growls so pretty....so for a budget fix. I'm really happy with the Pings....back to the guitar now......grinning ! Steffan
These guys carry them too. http://www.guitarsplususa.com/machines.shtml
Here are a couple of (bad) pics)

 

[Jeff]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

Steffan,

My F20 has open tuners, I had it in to Brady recently for a tweak'n tune. I got it back & noticed straight away the tuners were much smoother. Only thing I could figure was he lubed them. Tuners started getting sticky again just about the time the strings gave up so I carefully backed the screw off on each tuner & flowed a drop of oil down into the brass innards, paying attention to the brass "friction bushing ?". Spun each one around with no load a couple times, makes a goodly difference. Brady didn't have very much tension set on the screws either.

 

[taabru45]

Re: Old tuners on a strip-72 F112-are mini tuners better?

Thanks Jeff. Its just such a pleasure to have them respond so nicely, very fine tuning. no problem...I'll be sure to add a drop of oil to the gears. Little things sure do make a difference when you are build on a foundation with a Guild tag on it. :lol: Steffan

 

[fungusyoung]

Great thread, thanks for starting & following up on it, Steffan!

My 73 F112 has the same issues you described in your original post. A couple of the keys in particular seem to slip quite a bit & then go pretty loose when I try to lock into an accurate tuning. I've been wondering if I should just wait a few years to replace them when I have the neck re-set (I'm maybe 5 years away), but your inexpensive and no drilling replacements sound worth trying maybe before then. Honestly, I really hate the thought of having to drill any extra holes. I mean, the tuners now ares not so bad that they prevent me from playing out with the F112... so I can deal with it for a while, but I'm truly glad this thread came up because I've also been considering replacement tuners in the back of my mind for a while.

 

[jp]

Hi Steffan,

The previous owner of my old T100 shelled out for Waverly open back tuners. Being the cheapskate, er ummm rather, the thrifty person that I am, I thought, "Wow I'd never pay that much for tuners." However, I've been very impressed with them. They hold tune very well, even when I'm leaning heavily on the Bigsby.

 

[taabru45]

Great thread, thanks for starting & following up on it, Steffan!

My 73 F112 has the same issues you described in your original post. A couple of the keys in particular seem to slip quite a bit & then go pretty loose when I try to lock into an accurate tuning. I've been wondering if I should just wait a few years to replace them when I have the neck re-set (I'm maybe 5 years away), but your inexpensive and no drilling replacements sound worth trying maybe before then. Honestly, I really hate the thought of having to drill any extra holes. I mean, the tuners now ares not so bad that they prevent me from playing out with the F112... so I can deal with it for a while, but I'm truly glad this thread came up because I've also been considering replacement tuners in the back of my mind for a while.

The only thing I'd do is re use the screws that are in there now. I used the new screws that came with the set on one side, but I think they are a touch thinner than the ones that came out, and don't quite snug down, the way the original screws do, and there is a wee bit of an angle when you start them and they work from there, you aren't cutting new threads. Go for it fungus, It'll give you a new guitar, and you'll feel like she's the queen of the prom. Steffan