NGD D-55

SFIV1967

Venerated Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2010
Messages
18,442
Reaction score
8,956
Location
Bavaria / Germany
Guild Total
8
I think the bracing is scalloped red spruce.
The Tacoma specs for the D-55 didn't show the wood type used for bracing, only some guitars like D-50 Bluegrass Special, D-40 Bluegrass Jubilee, F-40 Valencia and F-30 Aragon show explicitely "red spruce bracing" in the 2006 catalog. It is well possible the bracing for the traditional models in Tacoma stayed with sitka spruce. Only in New Hartford this was changed to Red Spruce bracing.
Ralf
 

fronobulax

Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
Joined
May 3, 2007
Messages
24,708
Reaction score
8,836
Location
Central Virginia, USA
Guild Total
5
I didn't know the Cordoba company had also bought out Gibson. I wonder if it was Ren Ferguson that recommended that Guild quit making the American made D-50?
Not sure what you are saying or why.

Cordoba did not buy out Gibson. If you are jumping to that conclusion because of Ren Ferguson, he retired from Gibson and was coaxed out of retirement to work for Guild. He then continued to work for Guild after CMG bout Guild and Ren was pretty much exclusively in charge of setting up the Guild manufacturing facility in Oxnard.

Could you clarify whether you are saying Guild has discontinued the D50 or that they have not made any since the sale? If the latter, remember that Ren left Guild fairly soon after the factory was operational and had little to no input into what was and is produced. He did provide guidance as to which models would be easiest to produce in a new factory with an inexperienced staff.
 

Boneman

Senior Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Aug 22, 2021
Messages
1,357
Reaction score
1,623
Guild Total
6
Jan 1, 2005 price list:

1663710359637.png

Ralf
Interesting it doesn't notate what the bridge is made from, was it always ebony or did they use RW at any point along the way?
 

richt54

Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Dec 18, 2021
Messages
263
Reaction score
314
Guild Total
1
Not sure what you are saying or why.

Cordoba did not buy out Gibson. If you are jumping to that conclusion because of Ren Ferguson, he retired from Gibson and was coaxed out of retirement to work for Guild. He then continued to work for Guild after CMG bout Guild and Ren was pretty much exclusively in charge of setting up the Guild manufacturing facility in Oxnard.

Could you clarify whether you are saying Guild has discontinued the D50 or that they have not made any since the sale? If the latter, remember that Ren left Guild fairly soon after the factory was operational and had little to no input into what was and is produced. He did provide guidance as to which models would be easiest to produce in a new factory with an inexperienced staff.
It was off of a YouTube video. It was an explanation of the change of hands in ownership of Guild from Fender to Cordoba and it was stated that Cordoba Co had also bought Gibson. I had never heard that. But that is not true as others have stated. I should have checked the facts. Apparently Gibson is owned by an Investment Group not Cordoba.
"Gibson was owned by Norlin Corporation from 1969 to 1986. In 1986, the company was acquired by a group led by Henry Juszkiewicz and David H. Berryman. In November 2018, the company was acquired by a group of investors led by private equity firm Kohlberg Kravis Roberts."
 

richt54

Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Dec 18, 2021
Messages
263
Reaction score
314
Guild Total
1
The Tacoma specs for the D-55 didn't show the wood type used for bracing, only some guitars like D-50 Bluegrass Special, D-40 Bluegrass Jubilee, F-40 Valencia and F-30 Aragon show explicitely "red spruce bracing" in the 2006 catalog. It is well possible the bracing for the traditional models in Tacoma stayed with sitka spruce. Only in New Hartford this was changed to Red Spruce bracing.
Ralf
Is there a difference between a traditional D-50 and a D-50 BGS. I thought the regular models were called standard. And the higher models were the traditional. But back to the bracing on a D-55, that's why I wrote "I think". I still don't know why or who made the decision to change the tops on the D-50 BGS and the D-40,BJ from Sitka to Adirondack. It was an assumption by me that since the D-55 is the TOTL dreadnaught than I would assume that better woods would have been used. And perhaps calling Adirondack wood better is an assumption as well.
 

richt54

Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Dec 18, 2021
Messages
263
Reaction score
314
Guild Total
1
Not sure what you are saying or why.

Cordoba did not buy out Gibson. If you are jumping to that conclusion because of Ren Ferguson, he retired from Gibson and was coaxed out of retirement to work for Guild. He then continued to work for Guild after CMG bout Guild and Ren was pretty much exclusively in charge of setting up the Guild manufacturing facility in Oxnard.

Could you clarify whether you are saying Guild has discontinued the D50 or that they have not made any since the sale? If the latter, remember that Ren left Guild fairly soon after the factory was operational and had little to no input into what was and is produced. He did provide guidance as to which models would be easiest to produce in a new factory with an inexperienced staff.
Is there a difference between discontinuing and quit making the D-50s? Of course you know the reality, since they haven't been made since 2014. Has the question ever been asked of Ren about the fate of the D-_50? Is there a Chinese equivalent of the D-50 today? I was just asking or pondering the question.
 

chazmo

Super Moderator
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
Messages
25,443
Reaction score
7,105
Location
Central Massachusetts
Interesting it doesn't notate what the bridge is made from, was it always ebony or did they use RW at any point along the way?
Boneman, I think the D-55 has always had an ebony bridge. Recently Cordoba built one with a rosewood bridge, which was a mistake, and one of our members has sent the guitar in for warrantee repair/replace. Very early D-55s ('60s and '70s) I'm not so certain about as Guild "specs" have a tendency to change over the years.
 

SFIV1967

Venerated Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2010
Messages
18,442
Reaction score
8,956
Location
Bavaria / Germany
Guild Total
8
I still don't know why or who made the decision to change the tops on the D-50 BGS and the D-40,BJ from Sitka to Adirondack. It was an assumption by me that since the D-55 is the TOTL dreadnaught than I would assume that better woods would have been used. And perhaps calling Adirondack wood better is an assumption as well.
The two "Bluegrass" models got an adi top as adi can be louder compared to sitka spruce. In a bluegrass band a guitar needs to cut through. For the D-55 "louder" was never a design goal I think, sitka is more tamed which fits a high end D-55 much better. If you play both a new D-50 and a new D-55 next to each other the D-50 is boomier/louder and the D-55 can sound boring, at least that was my initial reaction when playing both next to each other. The D-55 sounds however much more controlled over the whole frequency spectrum.
For a smaller body like the F-30 (and later the Orpheums) adi tops also make sense to improve the "power" of the guitar, but be careful with adi tops on rosewood backs and sides for the Orpheums, they easily overpower when strumming them.

Ralf
 

SFIV1967

Venerated Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2010
Messages
18,442
Reaction score
8,956
Location
Bavaria / Germany
Guild Total
8
By the way, right at the end of New Hartford they did a limited run of only 3 D-55 (D-55 RS) with an adirondack top in year 2014! Our member @txbumper57 has one of them, here is one of his pictures:

1663852208603.png

Ralf
 

chazmo

Super Moderator
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
Messages
25,443
Reaction score
7,105
Location
Central Massachusetts
Is there a difference between a traditional D-50 and a D-50 BGS. I thought the regular models were called standard. And the higher models were the traditional. But back to the bracing on a D-55, that's why I wrote "I think". I still don't know why or who made the decision to change the tops on the D-50 BGS and the D-40,BJ from Sitka to Adirondack. It was an assumption by me that since the D-55 is the TOTL dreadnaught than I would assume that better woods would have been used. And perhaps calling Adirondack wood better is an assumption as well.
Rich, it was during the Tacoma era that red spruce tops were introduced for the "Bluegrass" models. The existence of a "Standard" series came during the New Hartford era. There really is no notion of "standard" models in Guild land, except for that Standard series.

Make no assumptions about what is "better" wood when it comes to Guild guitars. That's not really how things went, at least not since New Hartford... And one man's top-of-the-line is another man's second choice. Honestly, that's especially true when you compare the D-55 and the D-50 models...
 

David R.C.

Junior Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2021
Messages
31
Reaction score
10
Guild Total
1
Hi guys been unwell for a while and unable to play (got an R shoulder with serious problems with tendons and joint that have to be repaired/replaced) and it's breaking my heart the whole right arm is affected and in tons of serious pain.
So, my wife thought she would cheer me up knowing that I have longed for a D55e so she bought me for my 80th birthday last month end of, a brand new from Guild (Oxnard) D55e. We have been married 40 yrs and I lost both my original Guild F50R and F512 guitars in a messy divorce in 1978
I was overjoyed and almost in tears.
When I got to spend some time looking at it closely I noticed all was not well with the headstock.
I contacted my dealer here in the UK and in Cordoba USA (I'm still waiting for a reply from Cordoba that answers my query) and my dealer obtained another new D55e please see the photos I've attached, the third photo when you enlarge it also has some faults albeit not quite as bad as mine. The second photo is from a current Guild video showing a normal black headstock. That jet black headstock is what I have always admired with the mother of pearl Guild inlays in the headstock.
I would so grateful to hear from you guys what do you think about this, please?
21.9.22 vv.jpgIMG_2170.JPGWhat it should look like!.PNG
 

GGJaguar

Reverential Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2011
Messages
21,303
Reaction score
31,391
Location
Skylands
Guild Total
49
I would so grateful to hear from you guys what do you think about this, please?
So, you mean that you can see the wood grain of the headstock veneer instead of it being jet black? Maybe Guild is no longer staining their ebony so the woodgrain shows?
 

David R.C.

Junior Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2021
Messages
31
Reaction score
10
Guild Total
1
So, you mean that you can see the wood grain of the headstock veneer instead of it being jet black? Maybe Guild is no longer staining their ebony so the woodgrain shows?
What hurts my wife the most is she saw my original Guilds and knows what they should look like and, her having paid £3600.00+ is a very unhappy bunny.
 

fronobulax

Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
Joined
May 3, 2007
Messages
24,708
Reaction score
8,836
Location
Central Virginia, USA
Guild Total
5
It was off of a YouTube video. It was an explanation of the change of hands in ownership of Guild from Fender to Cordoba and it was stated that Cordoba Co had also bought Gibson. I had never heard that. But that is not true as others have stated. I should have checked the facts.

If you're going to the internet for information, LTG is almost always a better source than YouTube :)


Is there a difference between discontinuing and quit making the D-50s? Of course you know the reality, since they haven't been made since 2014. Has the question ever been asked of Ren about the fate of the D-_50? Is there a Chinese equivalent of the D-50 today? I was just asking or pondering the question.

Guild's last public statement that I saw was that they intended to produce the models New Hartford had done but they were not going to commit to any specific order in which they were produced. I also recall comments from Guild that they were more concerned with meeting demand for the models they were already producing in Oxnard than they were in increasing the lineup. So 'quit making" is an expected consequence of closing one factory and opening another. Everything else is a matter of intent. The current situation is that they have not announced their intent for a D50 but the door is still open. "discontinued" signals an intent to not produce it. It comes down to hope. If the available information squashes all hope of a D50 the "discontinued" is the word I would use.

The transitions from Hoboken to Westerly and New Hartford to Oxnard were similar in that the first models produced were chosen to be easy to produce and additional models were not introduced until the "bugs" were fixed in the general manufacturing process.

Ren almost certainly had input into the first model produced but given Guild's statements about producing the models New Hartford had done eventually unless Guild was lying it's hard to believe a decision not to make a D50 was made while Ren was at Guild.
 

richt54

Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Dec 18, 2021
Messages
263
Reaction score
314
Guild Total
1
By the way, right at the end of New Hartford they did a limited run of only 3 D-55 (D-55 RS) with an adirondack top in year 2014! Our member @txbumper57 has one of them, here is one of his pictures:

1663852208603.png

Ralf
Thanks for showing this. Didn't know they existed. I wonder if this guy knew he was getting an adi top whe he bought it.
 

David R.C.

Junior Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2021
Messages
31
Reaction score
10
Guild Total
1
Do they fit ebony on the mahogany neck at the headstock then?
 

David R.C.

Junior Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2021
Messages
31
Reaction score
10
Guild Total
1
So, you mean that you can see the wood grain of the headstock veneer instead of it being jet black? Maybe Guild is no longer staining their ebony so the woodgrain shows?
Do they fit ebony on the mahogany neck at the headstock then?
 

GGJaguar

Reverential Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2011
Messages
21,303
Reaction score
31,391
Location
Skylands
Guild Total
49
Yes, it appears that they do not stain the ebony veneer (overlay) any longer. Here is the description for the D-55 from the current Guild website:

The D-55 showcases Guild’s most recognizable headstock which is fully bound and features the Guild “Peak and Shield” inlay combination over a figured ebony overlay.
 

chazmo

Super Moderator
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
Messages
25,443
Reaction score
7,105
Location
Central Massachusetts
David, folks,

I think you are under a misconception.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with your headstock veneer, David (if that's what you're trying to show with the pictures). That is real ebony, as it's supposed to be, which has been in use since 2009 when New Hartford changed the headstock from a piece of jet black fibreboard to real ebony. Much real ebony these days comes with lighter streaks. Older headstock veneers were not ebony.

Also, I don't think that any dyeing of ebony to make it look jet black has been occurring. I don't think they did it in New Hartford, and I don't think they do it in Cordoba.

There may have been some veneers from New Hartford that didn't have much, if any, streaking in them simply because the wood supply at the time had blanks like that. These days, most ebony has the streaks.
 

wileypickett

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2009
Messages
4,964
Reaction score
4,489
Location
Cambridge, MA
In the old, old days many manufactuerers dyed their ebony (when they used real ebony) to appear jet black.

I prefer the undyed, streaky ebony myself. But that's just me.

If you're abolutely committed to a jet black headstock, you may need to look for Guilds from an earlier era.
 
Top