NAMM 2021 Reimagined Starfire Bass

[fronobulax]

just bring back M-85 bass instead of messing around w 339 SF bass! and/or the return of JS bass!

Ever the cynic, I'm going to say that if enough people agreed with your opinion, the NS M-85 would still be in the lineup.

This bass is generating conversation. It remains to be seen how well it sells in general, and how well it sells in particular to people who already have a Starfire bass.

 

[fronobulax]

Call me stodgy if you will, but I'm gonna buck the trend and say that I'm not crazy about the "look" of either the pups or the bridge/tailpiece. Oh well, at least it's not a floating bridge.

Appears it might have a bound neck, which I would also not prefer. Wondering if that has anything to do with the finish flaws (random, "fogged", de-laminating clear coat) along the fretboard edge I've seen on a significant number of unbound NSs.

At that price point, I'd be very surprised if these aren't being made in China, which would be the final nail in the coffin for me (though this is not the appropriate place to discuss why).

Might be a bound neck. Snagged another pic from Guild and the treble side fretboard "over" the body looks bound.

As noted above based upon my memory of the 6 string Starfires, I would bet on Indonesia, not China.

And I just noticed, no chesterfield logo on the headstock :-(

 

[Minnesota Flats]

just bring back M-85 bass instead of messing around w 339 SF bass! and/or the return of JS bass!

^This! SF body proportions are perfect, IMHO. M-85-II or JS-II in 'burst!

Also agree with Mellowgerman about body dimensions.

I don't see that this TOM-style bridge would offer a wider range of intonation adjustment than the current design (if anything, it looks like less) so "why"?

 

[fronobulax]

I don't see that this TOM-style bridge would offer a wider range of intonation adjustment than the current design (if anything, it looks like less) so "why"?

My hypothesis is that it would be easier to explain how to intonate due to fewer moving parts. Extrapolating from other experience, you can move the whole bridge up or down and you can move individual saddles forward or back. The traditional bridge has those adjustments but you can also manipulate the saddles. So it is simpler and in many applications that is A Good Thing. If your set up is close to one edge of the design specs I can imagine you might be happier with the results from a traditional bridge but for a mainstream player this might be a better choice. Anecdotally, every how to adjust/intonate thread I recall has been about the traditional style bridge,

To the extent that Alembic during the late 70's represented the state of the art in basses, this setup seems to have more in common with an Alembic than the traditional bridge.

 

[mellowgerman]

so "why"?

I think it's all about making these a lot cheaper to produce. The Guild harp bridge and bisonic pickups are completely unique in their design and therefore requires them to be made specially for Guild. That tune-o-matic style saddle already exists in chinese production, as does the generic precision bass pickup. So all this bass would require in these departments are the tailpiece, which is a simple metal part to produce and the fancy chrome mounting rings for the generic precision bass pickup. They're cutting out a lot of cost with this design. A friend of mine also pointed out, it almost looks like this is a virtually flat top and back. That could also cut some cost if it were the case and not just an illusion of the photo

 

[SFIV1967]

I am willing to bet that these are made in Indonesia, not Korea

You won!
You also notice no Chesterfield in the headstock as it belongs to the low cost "Starfire I" line made at P.T. Samick in Indonesia.

And the CMG photographer didn't even bother hiding the lousy wiring in those Indonesian models...

Compare to a SPG Korea made Starfire Bass II where you see no wires due to the almost perfectly made wiring harnesses in them:

Ralf

 

[mavuser]

Ever the cynic, I'm going to say that if enough people agreed with your opinion, the NS M-85 would still be in the lineup.

#1- i was comparing the M-85 to the idea of a "mini SF bass" like a Gibson 339 is a smaller Gibson 335, given those 2 options (an M-85 vs. a mini SF bass), I sure hope M-85 would win, with both Guild and it's customers.

#2- i'd say you are giving Guild way too much credit as far as my opinion, who agrees with it, and what Guild could, would, or should do, with that information.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Good point about the headstock: just painting/screening "Guild" on there would simplify production and thereby likely lower the cost thereof.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

I'll await specs before passing final judgement (as to whether or not I'd be seriously interested in purchasing).

 

[mavuser]

every time i look at the photo of this bass, the value of a used Newark Street Starfire Bass increases. buy, buy, buy!

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Couple more "simplifications":
A)-One rather than three piece neck (no center strip)
B)-Headstock appears to be a separate piece, attached via a scarf joint. Heel may also be a separate piece.

The second item would likely allow for less waste wood (compared to current production neck) which would result in reduced materials cost over a large number of units. Since the initial, rough wood working is probably automated, I would think that the headstock and heel joinery would not increase labor costs significantly. All just guesswork on my part, off course.

 

[SFIV1967]

Couple more "simplifications":
•One rather than three piece neck (no center strip)
•Headstock appears to be a separate piece, attached via a scarf joint. Heel may also be a separate piece.

Correct, that is how all the other models in the Indonesian "Starfire I" line are built. Obviously most models there have solid colors so nobody noticed, just the "Starfire I DC Cherry" is in a transparent Cherry finish and you see the exact same construction of the neck there:

They even saved the little nails to mark the position (vs. right the SPG Korea made version)

Ralf

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Thanks for confirmation. I haven't really paid much attention to current-production Guild guitars, so did not realize this.

 

[SFIV1967]

Thanks for confirmation. I haven't really paid much attention to current-production Guild guitars, so did not realize this.

Well, it was confusing for everybody at first...
A year ago at NAMM 2020 they introduced that new low cost Starfire line and called them all "Starfire I" ! We guessed "1" for the lowest cost...

They added something like SC (Single Cut) or DC (Double Cut) to the model names. So anything with Starfire I and SC or DC means Indonesia.
Production for those is done at P.T. Samick, in Cileungsi near Bogor, West Java, Indonesia. (ISG serial numbers = Indonesia Samick Guild).
Labels are still under the Newark St. Collection but clearly marked with ISG and Indonesia.
On that below label example, which GAD had posted in his review, "SF-1SCGVT/SFG" means Single Cut with Guild Vibrato Tailpiece/Seafoam Green.

...which is that left guitar in the picture below:

The normal and higher priced Newark St. models continue to be produced at SPG in Korea, so it is not a shift of production.


During Summer NAMM 2020 they added a new "phantasy" model to the "Starfire I" line called Starfire I Jet 90.
It's a bit like what Fender did with the Parallel Universe and Alternate Reality series. Mix existing designs into something new.

And now for Virtual NAMM 2021 that Starfire I Bass.


Ralf

 

[mellowgerman]

Another realization I just had: one more bet I'd be willing to make regarding the TOM style saddle and G tailpiece (instead of the Guild harp bridge), 19mm fender standard string spacing to accommodate the precision bass pickup.

 

[SFIV1967]

19mm fender standard string spacing

I have no idea about basses, is that "good" or "bad" or what is preferred or what was on the "normal" Starfire basses?
Ralf

 

[mellowgerman]

I have no idea about basses, is that "good" or "bad" or what is preferred or what was on the "normal" Starfire basses?
Ralf

I believe "regular" Guild bridge spacing from string to string is 17mm or thereabouts. To me, that's what I'm used to and it feels like home. 19mm is standard Fender spacing, which makes for an extra 6mm across all 4 strings. Very noticeable difference in feel, but more importantly here, if they're trying to save money by implementing a regular precision style pickup, they need the string spacing to line up with the poles.
Personally, the most important and impactful measurement to my technique is the "short-scale", from nut to bridge saddle, though 19mm bridge spacing does feel a little bit clumsy to me after years of playing a Starfire

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Good call about the string spacing, MG. I also prefer 17mm.

 

[lungimsam]

This new model isn't a Starfire bass to me.
Looks more like a Staronado or Coronafire bass. (Starfire/Fender Coronado mix). Add block inlays and a pick guard and you are done.
But it does look nice. https://www.musicradar.com/reviews/fender-semi-acoustic-coronado-bass-ii

 

[mavuser]

it seems to me the club bass is popular right now, seen a few of those Hofner club reissues around. Guild should bring back the NS M-85-1 with a neck pickup. why they would discontinue that and the hollow NS Aristocrat w the Franz reissues...is baffling. I am happy to own the hollow GSR M-85 bass, and a real SF bass (and one Jetstar bass, for now). the glory days are ancient history, it seems.