Guild Starfire Newark Street for Jazz Guitar?

[zenguild]

Hello Community!

I have dabbled with acoustic guitar for a few years. I am wanting to explore jazz guitar. I am looking for a semi-hollow electric for jazz.

For various reasons, I have decided that I would like a Guild Starfire Newark Street. I am trying to avoid bigsby’s and whammy bars since jazz doesn't require them. I am concerned about "too much" feedback and "high fretwires"; I understand high fretwire is good for bends and vibrato, but I am looking for lower fretwire for easy of play and comfort. I am interested in buying new. Which guitar might be most suitable for jazz?

• Guild Newark St Starfire I SC ($500, Indonesia, no case)
  • arched maple
• Guild Newark St Starfire II ($750, South Korea, no case)
  • arched mahogany
• Guild Newark St Starfire IV ST Maple ($750, South Korea, with case)
  • arched maple

Thanks for any advice!

 

[drlucky]

Welcome! Sounds like the Starfire IV might be your best bet, at least IMHO.

 

[GGJaguar]

Welcome to LTG! Yes, the Starfire IV should fill your needs nicely.

 

[Walter Broes]

"Jazz" has long become too broad a term to pin down, you can play music that qualifies as Jazz on any guitar really. If you have a very specific tone you're after, the most efficient way of trying to get that tone is to look at what people are playing to get there.

 

[walrus]

I agree 100% with Walter, all of those 3 options will work fine.

walrus

 

[DeArmond Hammer]

Hi, @zenguild, welcome to LTG. I stopped pigeonholing guitars when I saw videos of Ted Greene playing jazz on his Telecaster. (Other videos show him playing big Guild hollowbodies that better match the conventional jazz guitar image.) You can't go wrong if you follow your own taste. There are two versions of the Starfire II, one of which has LB-1 pickups like the Starfire IV while the other has Dynasonic pickups. The Starfire I has its own HB-2 pickups, so you have three choices of pickups. You might find videos that give you a better idea of what sounds to expect from each guitar, if you can't try them in person.

Those facts stated, here are my unreliable opinions: I too am trying to learn some jazz guitar, and the first thing I've noticed is the harmonic complexity. A basic jazz chord has four notes instead of three. Who knew? So I want pickups and an amp that let me hear all the notes clearly and distinctly. To hear the notes in balance, I use the neck pickup with the treble turned down a little. I like a hollowbody for its resonance, which helps to reinforce harmonies. For clean playing as in jazz, I think a single-coil pickup can often give the notes a bit more clarity. So I would be especially interested in the Starfire II Dynasonic for your purposes. I haven't played one myself, but here's a nice demo of the guitar playing jazz style:



For an imperfect comparison, here's a demo of the LB-1 version of the SFII, and it also sounds great:

 

[davismanLV]

I'd buy that BLUE one they have on offer.... in the vids she handled the blues fairly well. Am I wrong??

 

[walrus]

Am I wrong??

I'm going to say "rarely" - I think that covers it, right?

walrus

 

[zenguild]

I'd buy that BLUE one they have on offer.... in the vids she handled the blues fairly well. Am I wrong??

Which one is the blue one?

 

[zenguild]

Hi, @zenguild, welcome to LTG. I stopped pigeonholing guitars when I saw videos of Ted Greene playing jazz on his Telecaster. (Other videos show him playing big Guild hollowbodies that better match the conventional jazz guitar image.) You can't go wrong if you follow your own taste. There are two versions of the Starfire II, one of which has LB-1 pickups like the Starfire IV while the other has Dynasonic pickups. The Starfire I has its own HB-2 pickups, so you have three choices of pickups. You might find videos that give you a better idea of what sounds to expect from each guitar, if you can't try them in person.

Those facts stated, here are my unreliable opinions: I too am trying to learn some jazz guitar, and the first thing I've noticed is the harmonic complexity. A basic jazz chord has four notes instead of three. Who knew? So I want pickups and an amp that let me hear all the notes clearly and distinctly. To hear the notes in balance, I use the neck pickup with the treble turned down a little. I like a hollowbody for its resonance, which helps to reinforce harmonies. For clean playing as in jazz, I think a single-coil pickup can often give the notes a bit more clarity. So I would be especially interested in the Starfire II Dynasonic for your purposes. I haven't played one myself, but here's a nice demo of the guitar playing jazz style:



For an imperfect comparison, here's a demo of the LB-1 version of the SFII, and it also sounds great:

Thank you so much for the feedback.

DeArmond Hammer: To hear the notes in balance for jazz, what is your guitar and amplifier of choice?

I ended up moving forward with a Starfire I SC (Indonesia). I had an opportunity on a deeply discounted Starfire II ST (South Korea), but I missed on the offer. The Starfire II Dynasonic does seem very interesting, but above my budget at the moment. For amplification, I had read one gentleman's review on a Fender Blues Junior in which he said he couldn't get a clean sound, but could with a Fender Champion 40. Following this and my budget, I went with the Champion 40.

I have been trying to find samples out there comparing semi-hollow electric maple archtops with mahogany archtops and I have not found many thus far. I wonder how different the mahogany is from the maple in the Starfire realm! I also wonder how different the DeArmond pickups are compared to the LB-1's. I seem to really be hooked on the Guild train. I am even looking at the DeArmond Tone Boss Soundhole Pickup for my acoustic!

 

[DeArmond Hammer]

Thank you so much for the feedback.

DeArmond Hammer: To hear the notes in balance for jazz, what is your guitar and amplifier of choice?

I ended up moving forward with a Starfire I SC (Indonesia). I had an opportunity on a deeply discounted Starfire II ST (South Korea), but I missed on the offer. The Starfire II Dynasonic does seem very interesting, but above my budget at the moment. For amplification, I had read one gentleman's review on a Fender Blues Junior in which he said he couldn't get a clean sound, but could with a Fender Champion 40. Following this and my budget, I went with the Champion 40.

I have been trying to find samples out there comparing semi-hollow electric maple archtops with mahogany archtops and I have not found many thus far. I wonder how different the mahogany is from the maple in the Starfire realm! I also wonder how different the DeArmond pickups are compared to the LB-1's. I seem to really be hooked on the Guild train. I am even looking at the DeArmond Tone Boss Soundhole Pickup for my acoustic!

Hey, it sounds like you got a nice rig. @GAD liked the Starfire I SC in his review. I forgot that it could split the humbuckers, so you can play with a single-coil DeArmond kind of voice without changing pickups or guitars. Guild shows that guitar delivering a nice jazz tone in its demo video.

The Champion 40 sounds like a smart choice that will be as versatile as your guitar. I have an earlier Fender modeling amp, the Vibro Champ XD, and I enjoy all the different amp models it contains. I'm sure you can get nice clean tones from the Champion. A lot of jazz guitarists prefer solid state amps over tube amps for their clean tones.

I've been practicing my jazz chords on a recently acquired Guild archtop with a single-coil pickup. (Look for my New Guitar Day post when I take some photos.) Before I got an archtop, I used a versatile semi-hollow like yours, an Epiphone ES-335 Pro. I haven't been too picky about amps for jazz practice, because most amps can give a nice clean tone at low volume levels. These days, though, I'm favoring a vintage Ampeg tube amp that was designed with clean jazz tones in mind.

Please post a photo of your new rig when you get a chance!

 

[Mr_Christopher]

Thank you so much for the feedback.

DeArmond Hammer: To hear the notes in balance for jazz, what is your guitar and amplifier of choice?

I ended up moving forward with a Starfire I SC (Indonesia). I had an opportunity on a deeply discounted Starfire II ST (South Korea), but I missed on the offer. The Starfire II Dynasonic does seem very interesting, but above my budget at the moment. For amplification, I had read one gentleman's review on a Fender Blues Junior in which he said he couldn't get a clean sound, but could with a Fender Champion 40. Following this and my budget, I went with the Champion 40.

I have been trying to find samples out there comparing semi-hollow electric maple archtops with mahogany archtops and I have not found many thus far. I wonder how different the mahogany is from the maple in the Starfire realm! I also wonder how different the DeArmond pickups are compared to the LB-1's. I seem to really be hooked on the Guild train. I am even looking at the DeArmond Tone Boss Soundhole Pickup for my acoustic!

Just a quick note on the Fender Blues Jr. I own the IV version and it’s the sweetest amp I’ve ever owned. I mostly play clean and cover a lot of country and also a fair amount of pseudo jazz. Tubes have a lot to do with amp headroom so I wonder what tubes the guy who said he couldn’t get a clean tone from was using.

Also, I think maple is a little brighter than mahogany but you could google to confirm, way back I read up on tone-woods and as I recall that was the conclusion.
I mostly use a Gretsch 5420 or a Guild T-50. I love my Blues Jr. Anyhow good luck on your choices!

 

[JohnW63]

I have a NS X175 in sunburst, and I put flat wounds on it because I think they have more of a jazzy sound. I've been able to get "jazz tones" out of all my amps, with that setup. 1 tube amp and three solid state ones. Mine has the P90 style pickups, not the special "dynasonic" ones shown in another thread. I would think all of the above listed guitars could pull of that tone too.

 

[davismanLV]

Which one is the blue one?

https://letstalkguild.com/ltg/index.php?threads/ngd-ns-x175-manhattan-special.203210/

 

[adorshki]

I'm going to say "rarely" - I think that covers it, right?

walrus

Well done.

 

[stantheman]

Myself, I'd wait for an Indonesian Capri.
Will You be using regular strings?
The Capri if You opt for the Korean is every bit as nice as an ES-175 IMHO.

If waiting is too much of a drag the Starfire I has a single cutaway model with a stop tailpiece with a small block under the
bridge and tailpiece (that's the one I got) and it is sweet and very light too. Plus these Starfire One's have the only pull-coil
split that actually sounds decent. If I'm near the popcorn machine or neon She'll stay in humbucking mode.

 

[shihan]

You didn’t list the NS X-175 in your first post, but it’s an excellent guitar, made for jazz. As JohnW63 said above, with flatwounds you are in Kenny Burrell land. I’m very impressed with mine. I know you wanted to buy new, but you can get an as new used one in your price range.

 

[JohnW63]

I have an NS X-175 in maple. with the wammy bar, that I need to sell. Not very many hours on it. Let me know....