From the idiocy of the Floyd, to the simplicity of the Tele

[Guildedagain]

A few months ago, I picked up a shredder with a Floyd Rose. I couldn't get enough of it, seemingly the best thing since sliced bread.

Since, I picked up a Telecaster and got serious about playing.

So today, I got the shredder out again and what a horror, never again, I never want to play it again or even look at it again until the day it sells.

The guitar was ok before, but oddly tuned to A = 432Hz, so a little flat, and I didn't mind then, but I do now so I went to sharpen it a bit, and if you ever thought working with the old fashioned Strat was a hassle about minor tuning changes, it doesn't hold a candle to the monstrosity that is the Floyd.

After a half hour of retuning, retuning, retuning, retuning, retuning, etc, etc with no end in sight, I gave up.

Feeling sorry for the person who gets it.

What an insane PITA, and how could people have ever been bamboozled into thinking this was a way forward, an improvement on something?

It boggles the mind.

I finally got it tuned up and almost stabilized, and instantly realized that country bends in G sound HORRIBLE as the high E string detunes as you bend the G up, just terrible.

I you want to frustrate yourself and sound like unmitigated carp, get a Floyd now.

Should this be in the ROTD thread?

Guitars are like dates or long term partners. As you get older, your patience for bs thins, and for me that is the last straw with a Floyd equipped guitar, and I'm now remembering the same experiences in the past, extreme frustration and the inability to play. My, how quickly we forget.

By comparison, the old Strat with 6 screw trem is a gem. Just before reaching for the shredder, I'd just gone from decked on my '74 Strat to mucho floating, to the point of pulling it up a whole step, easy peasy and the guitar still plays well, the whole endeavor took like 5 minutes.

Speaking of trem equipped guitars, I've been playing the Tremar equipped S-50 again, and what a sweetie. It's got its limitations, but it doesn't get in the way of your playing at all.

The reason I got it out was learning on bunch of difficult Townsend chords from Tommy, and the S-50 is one of only two guitars I have with 24.75" scale, which makes it a little easier.

I'm playing it unplugged, and it has a very convincing Who/SG tone, sounds just right, easy playing, light.

Rethinking ever selling that one, besides that it is probably one of the most unsellable guitars I've ever had.

Beware of entry level Guilds, easy to buy, tough to sell, but the icing on that cake is that they are very good guitars, even better as time goes on.

 

[crank]

Dude. Chill!

I have a Schecter knock off Floyd Rose on my Schecter Strat. I justs leave the locking nut loose and tune it like a regular non locking nut guitar. I can still even use the whammy bar as long as I don't go too nuts.

Back in the day... I used to sometimes break a string during gigs. I got so tired of that sending the whole guitar so far out of tune that it was impossible to finish the song and I just stopped using teh locking nut. Been very happy ever since.

Let it go!

 

[Guildedagain]

The ability to tune isn't the problem, I like fine tuners a lot actually.

It's the inability to stay in tune until it decides to.

 

[GAD]

I have probably 30 guitars with Floyd Rose bridges. There are millions of them out there. There is nothing wrong with the bridge design.

If you have trouble with the floating bridge then "deck" it so it only goes down and not up. That way you're not fighting all the other strings when you tune. EVH decked his Floyds, though that was mostly so he could use his D-Tuna that allows changing to drop-D with a Floyd.

If your strings are pulling permanently out of tune when you bend other strings then it's not set up right or you haven't locked the nut. Bending a string will pull the other strings slightly flat on a floating trem but most people don't notice this because they're just playing the one string when it happens. Similarly double-stop bends are not a problem.

 

[Guildedagain]

If you have trouble with the floating bridge then "deck" it so it only goes down and not up. That way you're not fighting all the other strings when you tune. EVH decked his Floyds, though that was mostly so he could use his D-Tuna that allows changing to drop-D with a Floyd.

I would never deck a Floyd, especially on a body that has the extra routing under the fine tuners for it to float. The angle of the bridge would be all wrong, leaned back 10º.

Much easier to sell the guitar.

I play more than one string when I bend the G, i.e. bending the G @ 5th fret against the B/E @ 8th fret (Key of C), a classic pedal steel lick. The Strat does ok at this and S-50 with Tremar does really really well, the Floyd is a miserable failure in this context.

Another way to find out how bad a Floyd sucks, change string gauges say from .009 to .010 and see how long it takes for the guitar to stabilize to a point where it is playable. I've decided it's too long for me.

It's nice when it works, but when you tune adjust one string and all 5 others go off by a few cents, rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat, I would just rather play the guitar.

There's a reason why Tele players are the best players out there.

 

[GAD]

I would never deck a Floyd, especially on a body that has the extra routing under the fine tuners for it to float. The angle of the bridge would be all wrong, leaned back 10º.

Much easier to sell the guitar.

I play more than one string when I bend the G, i.e. bending the G @ 5th fret against the B/E @ 8th fret (Key of C), a classic pedal steel lick. The Strat does ok at this and S-50 with Tremar does really really well, the Floyd is a miserable failure in this context.

Another way to find out how bad a Floyd sucks, change string gauges say from .009 to .010 and see how long it takes for the guitar to stabilize to a point where it is playable. I've decided it's too long for me.

It's nice when it works, but when you tune adjust one string and all 5 others go off by a few cents, rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat, I would just rather play the guitar.

There's a reason why Tele players are the best players out there.

Perhaps "decking" was a bad word to use. "Blocking" might be better. Some players stick a 9v battery between the counterweight and the front of the route, but a block of wood is better. This prevents the arm from being pulled up and does not affect the height of the bridge at all. They also sell little doo-dads that you can mount inside the trem cavity to block the trem from moving in one direction.

I get not liking a Floyd Rose, but it wasn't designed for pedal steel playing so I could easily argue that you're not using it for it's intended purpose and then getting mad that it's not working the way you want it to. It sounds to me like what you really want is a tele with a G-bender.

As for changing string gauges, I guess it's all about experience because I can do it in 10 minutes. Yes, when you change the tension on the strings you will have to rebalance the springs. It's not a bad design - it's just different. When used for what it's intended for, there is nothing better.

 

[matsickma]

Interesting to see the positive comments about the Guild S-50 with Hagstrom tremar. I was weened on that model guitar and pissed my brother off for selecting it in lieu of a T100 with dual Micky Mouse pups. However Hendrix came on the scene and I wanted a vibrato! Many don't speak favorably about the Tremar but I know how to handle just right.
It is a point of note that when I first played a Strat with it's vibrato I didn't care for it at all. Each style vibrato takes some getting used to how to get the correct effect. 80's hair band rock is Floyd/Kahler territory or EVH to Satroni and Vai. I probably spend most time with Bigsby models and it's quarks.
I have been hesitant to get a Surfliner Deluxe because of the Jaguar style vibrato being another version to get familiar with!

 

[lungimsam]

Bigsbys are the least hassle of all Whang bars to me! Easy to put strings on it for me too.
If I ever get another electric guitar it’ll Probly be an S-100 and I’ll be tempted to put a Bigsby on it.

 

[Guildedagain]

Always wanted a Bigsby, inally got one a couple years back, they look cool but are a disaster for my playing, never again.

Compared to restringing a Tremar equipped guitar, the Bisgby is a major PITA.

The Tremar does everything the Bigsby can, zero hassles, doesn't get in the way of your playing at all.

The Tremar is a Swedish design from 1961, the Bigsby an American design from the 1951 so it's not a big surprise really.

 

[lungimsam]

Do they still make Tremars? Sounds better than a Bigsby.

 

[Guildedagain]

Looks like Tremars were only made from 1961 to 1967?

Hagström Tremar - Fetishguitars.com

www.fetishguitars.com

 

[mushroom]

Bigsbys are the least hassle of all Whang bars to me! Easy to put strings on it for me too.
If I ever get another electric guitar it’ll Probly be an S-100 and I’ll be tempted to put a Bigsby on it.

And on the flip side, for me the Rickenbacker whammy is the biggest PITA to restring.

I thought they sounded great but it takes a while to learn.

As matsickma said earlier, they need learning so you know what you can and cannot do with them.

 

[Prince of Darkness]

Looks like Tremars were only made from 1961 to 1967?

Hagström Tremar - Fetishguitars.com

www.fetishguitars.com

Guild did use a Tremar (or at least a reproduction) on the Newark St. T-Bird, but I believe these have been discontinued

 

[lungimsam]

It’s says hagstrom vintage tremar. We’re they really using NOS parts?

 

[Guildedagain]

Vintage type or style they mean. It doesn't look quite the same.

It's undoubtedly newly made, prob Korea or China/Taiwan?

 

[Prince of Darkness]

It’s says hagstrom vintage tremar. We’re they really using NOS parts?

I doubt it. More likely, they are using the word vintage to indicate that this is the original Hagstrom design.

 

[Guildedagain]

The original is amazing, you just don't know it's there until you need to shake a chord a bit.

The base is narrower than the reproduction. More rounded.

My S-50;

 

[Midnight Toker]

Always wanted a Bigsby, inally got one a couple years back, they look cool but are a disaster for my playing, never again.

Compared to restringing a Tremar equipped guitar, the Bisgby is a major PITA.

The Tremar does everything the Bigsby can, zero hassles, doesn't get in the way of your playing at all.

The Tremar is a Swedish design from 1961, the Bigsby an American design from the 1951 so it's not a big surprise really.

I love the Bigsby I put on one of my Les Pauls! The first 1-2 string changes were a pain in the butt as the ball ends kept slipping off the little pins on the Bigsby. That problem was easily solved by simply holding the ball end between the tips of my thumb and pointer finger, open end of the “ball” laying flat, then bending the string over my thumbnail. It leaves just enough of a kink in the string about a 1/2-3/4” from the ball end so you can easily slip the ball on the pin w/ one hand without it requiring constant hard tension to keep it from slipping off. Stringing that guitar is now just as easy as any other.