F 512 Maple (Should I buy it?)

[Calvin]

Howdy;
I'm in the market for a 12 string guitar. I'm a fingerstyle player. Which F 512 sounds best for fingerstyle (maple vs rosewood)?

I've never owned a Guild before. I have the option to purchase a used Martin D12-20, 1971. The Martin 12 will be about half the price of the Guild.
What should I do?

A.) Buy the f 512 Maple
B.) Buy the f 512 (rose wood)
C.) Buy the used martin D12-20 for half the price
D.) None of the above

I appreciate any help you could offer. I'm nervous to purchase a guitar sight unseen. (It's even worse because I've never played a Guild.)
Thanks for any help you could offer.
Calvin

 

[awagner]

Don’t expect any of us to recommend a Martin over a Guild, although the D12-20 is a fine guitar.

My personal preference is rosewood, especially for fingerpicking, since it generally has a more nuanced, darker tone. I used to own a F412 which I found too chimey, but I have a different one now that I absolutely love, although it sounds best when picked and strummed.

Obviously it is preferable to try a guitar before you purchase it, but as the owner of 7 Guild rosewood 12 strings from 4 different decades (none of which I tried before I bought), I can tell you it is very unlikely you will be disappointed with the F512.

 

[dreadnut]

In a word, rosewood.

 

[wileypickett]

The rosewood is the F-512; the maple version is the F-412.

I've played a Martin D12-20. The sound was great, no doubt about it, but it wasn't for me.

I play all over the neck, and the Martin has 12 frets to the body, instead of 14, which makes playing above the 12th fret more difficult. It also has a slottted headstock, which some people love and some people find a nusiance to change strings on.

The main problem I had with it though is that it was a bear to play. The action was fine, I couldn't find any problems with the set up, but the guitar felt "stiff" to me. This was the only D12-20 I ever spent time with, so it may just have been this particular guitar.

I'm very fond of Guild's jumbo bodied 12-strings, more so than their dreadnaughts. The F-212XL; the F-412; the F-512 and the JF30-12 -- I love 'em all!

If you can't actually play the guitars before purchasing, see if your seller has a return policy. It might be worth paying the extra shipping costs in order to spend some time with the guitar, know what you're spending your money on, etc.

All the recommendations in the world aren't going to tell you anything close to what your ears will tell you.

Good luck -- let us know what you decide!

 

[Cougar]

...A.) Buy the f 512 Maple
B.) Buy the f 512 (rose wood)
C.) Buy the used martin D12-20 for half the price
D.) None of the above...

Hey Calvin, welcome to LTG! I have the F512 rosewood built in Oxnard, and it is really spectacular. But honestly, you cannot go wrong with either the F512 Maple or the rosewood. There's a big difference between the Guild jumbos (F512) and the Martin dreadnought. Besides the fact that Guild 12-strings are just the best and always have been. They're tops!

 

[GGJaguar]

Welcome to LTG! They are all different and, if possible, you should really play them. I've have played all 3 models and went with the F412.

 

[Brad Little]

I have a 512 RW, and and F-50 (its 6 string sibling) and think the RW would be a better choice for fingerpicking. I had a D-12-20 for a while (stolen from my son's apartment), and it was nice, but couldn't hold a candle to the F-212 I had (and still do) which is why my son had it. I think even many Martin purists would admit Guild is the 12 string leader.

 

[crank]

412 is now 512 maple.

I think you really have to play them. I bought a 412 and was going back and forth playing both a 512 and 412 and just liked the sound of my 412 better.

 

[davismanLV]

If you're buying online without having the guitar in your hand make sure whomever you buy it from has a decent return policy (that can actually happen, many are moments, some are 30 days) and chose your vendor wisely. I love maple. It's bright and resonant and honestly one of the best. I also like Rosewood which has a more fundamental and bassey sound. Both are good. If you're gonna record, maybe maple. But I'm not gonna recommend a 12 fret in general (Martin makes very nice guitars) because of what wileypickett said, I play all over the fretboard and up to 14 and 15th frets and that's important to have access and none of these are cutaways. So that's my input. If you can play them do, because it's such a personal thing, sound is!! But if not make sure you get a return policy that's not for you to FUSS over but if you really don't like it, then you CAN return it.

If you play cowboy chords and that's your life and you don't see it changing and then maybe the Martin would be good for you. Slot heads are nice. A bit lighter usually. I like 'em. Some people don't. So are you more confused yet???

 

[davismanLV]

P.S. - Calvin, welcome to LTG. We're full of opinions. Remember it's what YOU want that counts.

 

[wileypickett]

412 is now 512 maple.

Thanks Crank -- I'm so stuck Westerly-land, I forget sometimes that people still buy new guitars!

Calvin, my comments apply to vintage Guilds. I haven't tried out the current crop of Guild 12-strings. Not because I don't want to, rather I've just never run across any.

Good luck!

 

[Brucebubs]

Finger style with strumming - Rosewood.
Strumming with finger style - Maple

 

[Calvin]

Finger style with strumming - Rosewood.
Strumming with finger style - Maple

What do you mean by saying strumming with finger style?

Howdy;
Thank you for all of your replies. It appears we have a consensus on two things:

1.) Rose wood may be better suited for finger style play.
2.) A guitar should be played before purchase.

I’m not happy with either of these answers.

1.) I prefer the sunburst maples “look” the best. (I know you shouldn’t buy a guitar because of looks, but it looks so nice!)

2.) I don’t think I’ll be able to find any F 512s to play right now. I suppose I could wait a year, maybe two or three years to test drive each variation before purchase. This option sucks, which makes me lean towards buying the Martin now for cheaper, and possibly buying the F 512 further down the line.

I’m afraid your forum has only made my head spin. Sigh... if only I was wealthy and could buy both. Keep on for my self and give the other as a gift to a loved one.
Thank you again for your replies. I appreciate any and all advice on what I should do.
Calvin

 

[Brucebubs]

What I meant was if you are predominately a finger-style player who occasionally likes to strum - go Rosewood.
On the other hand if you are predominately a strummer that occasionally plays a little finger-style - go Maple

 

[evenkeel]

FWIW I have owned a F-512, a F-2512, a F-212 and a Martin D12-20. The only one still in my possession is the F-212. I also have played a friends D12-20. That guitar stand out as one of the best 12 strings I've ever played. Some times a guitar just has that special something and that D12-20 had it. Mine, while a very good guitar was just not quite as great. I also never warmed up to the slot head. The F-512 and 2512 I could never warm up to. The jumbo size was always a wrestling match. I also much prefer the more fundamental tone of the smaller body, mahogany 212 over the huge overtones of the jumbo, rosewood 512. To my ears my F-212 is one of those guitars that has that special something. I think of the tone of the 512 as to much of a good thing. I just find it overwhelming. Obviously I'm in the minority on this as most of the forum gang consider the F-512 the holy grail of 12 strings.

 

[Rich Cohen]

My only comment to add to all the expert advice already offered is that if you haven't been a 12 string player in the past, you are in for a totally different experience. The tonal and sonic possibilities are quite different from a 6 string, and open up playing experiences that are very different. If you sing along with your guitar, you'll have to adapt your style a bit also. Some folks say that the 12 string sounds like an orchestra or a grand piano. Thus, the sounds you get will blow you and your listeners away. On the other side, you'll find the mechanics of playing and tuning the 12 string quite different from the 6er, and could be a either a game changer for you, or a source of diffidence over time to the challenges of playing the 12er. I've always loved the sound and look of a 12er, but have not been able to make it my "go to" guitar. One final note -- using a capo on a 12er can be challenging. There are specialized capos for the 12 string, that attempt to accommodate the difference between the thickness of the paired strings.

Have fun!

 

[HeyMikey]

A word of caution. If you are considering an older guitar make sure you know what to look for in terms of cracks, loose braces, neck angle (especially on 12 strings), bridge lift, fret wear, etc., otherwise it could easily cost you $1000+ in repairs. Frets.com has a good section of information on how to check acoustic guitar neck angle, action, saddle height and more.

 

[Cougar]

...I'm very fond of Guild's jumbo bodied 12-strings, more so than their dreadnaughts. The F-212XL; the F-412; the F-512 and the JF30-12 -- I love 'em all!...

Jeez, I forgot to mention my JF30-12! What an oversight! The JF30-12 is a Guild jumbo 12-string that is essentially an F412 (or nowadays an F512 Maple) without some of the bling. So I've got Guild jumbo 12-strings in rosewood and maple, and I stand by my claim that you can't go wrong with either one because they are both outstanding. Both have excellent low ends, but the rosewood is a bit more bass-y.

The hunt is half the fun. Research, hunt, buy!

 

[GGJaguar]

The tonal and sonic possibilities are quite different from a 6 string, and open up playing experiences that are very different.

I have to echo everything Rich said. A 12-string guitar is not just a 6-string guitar with 6 extra strings. It's really a different instrument and should be approached as such. The first time I played a 12er was when I was still a novice player (less than a year) and I started sawing away on cowboy chords like I did on a 6-string. The sound was total mud. Lesson learned.

 

[Tom O]

Check out the Guild F-512 videos on Youtube to hear the difference between rosewood and maple. I don't have any rosewood guitars, but I love my DD-12MC. It works great for fingerstyle. I think Guilds have lower action then Martins from the factory. I liked the sound and action of by D-40 over the Martins I played when I bought it. A Martin buyer tried the D-40 I was buying and had the action on his Martin set like it.