A Nasty PayPal Surprise

richardp69

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Maybe it's been this way for a long time, I don't know, because I haven't had to refund anybody(recently at least) what they paid me via PayPal when they bought one of my guitars.

In the past if I gave a full refund, PayPal would take from me the net amount I received from the buyer after fees. They would then refund the fee itself from their funds so the buyer got a 100% refund.

Now, they refund the buyer 100% from my PayPal acct. and they no longer refund the fee from their funds.

It's a bit confusing, but here's an example. I sold a guitar for $1,850. I received $1,796.05 after fees and for whatever it's worth I'm fine with that. So, when I give the buyer a 100% refund he gets back the $1,850.00 and they take $1,850.00 from my PayPal account even though I only received $1,796.05 after fees. So, I have to eat the $53.95 in fees that I never even received.

I've always tried to be honest and up front using PayPal and never used the Friends option that has zero fees. I still don't want to do that because it just doesn't seem right to me but their policy in effect now kind of pushes a seller in that direction. Anyway, maybe old news for most/all of you but it was a surprise to me.
 

HeyMikey

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PayPal quietly made that change to their terms maybe a year ago. It is very sleezy and only encourages abuse. Use Reverb payments.

Unethical ebay buyers will use the PayPal fee and forced seller paid return shipping to squeeze out a partial refund after the sale. Even for simple buyers remorse the seller can take a big hit on fees and shipping when there is absolutely nothing wrong.

That is why you see more Reverb listings now with no description of condition, or simply a statement saying the pictures show the condition, or maybe also a restocking fee for returns.
 

Stuball48

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Richard
Thank you for taking Postal Money Orders. We have bought from and sold to each other around $6000 in guitars over the last 14 months and nari-a-problem -- not even a hiccup. I am not a PayPal fan - just not for me.
 

beecee

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Thank you for taking Postal Money Orders.

Up until a few months ago that was really the only way I'd accept payment when shipping....but I've only sold about 1/1,000th of the guitars Sir Richard has
 

chazmo

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Well, that really does suck, Richard. Sorry to hear it, and frankly that hardly seems fair. A refunded sale should be a wash for both parties, not costly to the seller. Having said that, if a seller takes credit cards, I'll bet there are fees they have to eat when money is refunded. Sigh. More proof that banks and credit card companies are out of tune with the economy.
 

Guildedagain

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I hear they want to put Chase Morgan ATM's in the lobby of PO's and do away with MO's probably. I prefer them over any other MO, except they're impossible to cash at a PO, conundrum.

Everything is about fees. Land of the Fee.

Took a lot of Postal MO's in the old days, 7 $500 ones for a BMW R/60.

I'm shocked to hear this about PPal, and disgusted, but not even a bit surprised, still highly disturbed and now prepared for it.

Everything I sell on eBay is a curio or antique, described. I insist on USPS Priority any issues be damned fully insured with signature confirmation. If someone refuses the signature confirmation, it's on them in print. Fully insured anyway.

On Reverb, I only do Reverb payments, I feel covered.

Most buyers I never hear a single peep from. Extremely rare, usually some silly thing like an office mailroom sorting mistake.

"Unethical ebay buyers will use the PayPal fee and forced seller paid return shipping to squeeze out a partial refund after the sale. Even for simple buyers remorse the seller can take a big hit on fees and shipping when there is absolutely nothing wrong."

This has always been true regardless of PayPal's decision to keep the fee after a transaction is undone. Unethical buyers have always found ways to do the same things. Sadly the old saying is true, they can't all be winners.

I remember when a gal sent me an expensive broken camera back, even ripped the new Varta battery off, and got eBay/PPal to issue a refund on an item I hadn't even received yet, by "filing a complaint" because refund was taking too long.

The PPal Cust Serv Rep told me "think of it as having a store, and to or three times a year, somebody comes in and shoplifts".

So, was he saying that as a lame excuse to why PPal would cave to the demands of a bad buyer, or is this more a comment about people?
 
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parker_knoll

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Reverb payments take a long time to send you the money and don't send it till you've shipped. This means you can't use the shipping fee to pay for the shipping. However, I did not know that PayPal now retains their fee even on refunds. Euch.
 
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