'81 Guild M-80 Action Problem / Bridge Question

[adam79]

I have a '81 Guild M-80 (ver 2). I'm having a problem with the action on the upper frets. The strings, mainly the three high ones (G,B,e), are touching the frets. I'm looking for some advice on how to fix this problem. Is it just a matter of tweaking with the truss rod? The neck is straight as an arrow though.

Another thing I've noticed is that all the saddles on the tune-o-matic bridge are all the way at the top of the bridge. When I turn the screws to the left, the saddles don't move down, they just stay at their position.. they might be moving the smallest bit, but it's not noticeable. I might be wrong on this, but I thought that the saddles should move from the top to bottom of the bridge by turning the screws.

Please Help. Thanks,
-Adam

 

[dapmdave]

Adam,

I may not correctly understand your question, but... assuming you are talking about the saddles on a tune-o-matic style bridge, I think these are primarily adjusted for intonation (up and back within the frame of the bridge) by changing the length of the strings. I think you can adjust string height turning the bolts that hold the bridge to the body.

If this is just a matter of adjusting the bridge, working out minor neck issues, etc., you may find it relatively inexpensive to have it done at a trusted local shop. At least around here, this is probably 50 bucks or less, and if it ain't right you have some recourse.

Re-reading the question, I realize I don't know if you are referring to changing string length or height with the string saddles. If my answer above seems dumb, that's why. (aside from my just being kinda dumb, sometimes)

Anyone else?

Dave

 

[Punkybub]

Hi Adam,

The strings touching on the upper frets (I'm assuming upper means near the body of the guitar rather than near the headstock) might be fixed as Dave mentioned by raising the bridge. You'll need to loosen the strings to take pressure off the bridge for any adjustment, then turn the adjustment wheels (at the bottom of the bridge) to raise the bridge a bit. Retune and check the string height - repeat as needed to get it where you want it. Since the problem is only the top 3 strings, and if the bottom 3 are ok or close to it, you might only need to adjust the treble side.

Same idea with the saddles in the bridge - loosen the strings first so the saddles can move, then adjust. If they won't move the screws might be frozen or corroded - a drop of light oil (small drop!) could help if it's a corrosion issue. As Dave mentioned, the saddles are used for intonation, not so much for string height. A rough way to check intonation is to first tune the guitar to pitch, then hit the 12th fret harmonic on one of the strings. Now fret the same string at the 12th fret and compare pitch. The goal is for both notes to be exactly the same.

If the note when you play it at the 12th fret is flat as compared to the harmonic, you'll need to move the saddle piece for that string closer to the headstock. If the fretted note is sharp, move the saddle back toward the bottom of the guitar. Tiny movements in the saddles make big differences in pitch...

Hope this helps - taking your guitar in to your local luthier for a setup would be an easy way to fix it too, and shouldn't be too much as long as there are no other problems.

 

[adam79]

Hi Adam,

The strings touching on the upper frets (I'm assuming upper means near the body of the guitar rather than near the headstock)

No, I'm talking about the frets up by the nut/headstock. From the nut to the 7th fret the strings are pretty much on the frets (it's the worst at the first few frets). By the 7th fret, the strings start to raise up to where they should be; it's worse on the treble side (strings G,B,e). I hadn't touched the guitar for the most part of June, which was really humid, so the weather had to have caused this problem. I talked to my friend, whose the guitar tech at the local music shop, and he told me that alot of people have brought their guitars' in with the same problem. He recommended I give the truss-rod a small adjustment. I'm not sure what kind of tool I need to make the adjustment, cuz there's some kind of metal piece in the allen wrench slot.

 

[Punkybub]

Adam,

It does sound like a humidity problem if it just happened in the last month. I don't know the specifics of your truss rod setup but you might need an allen wrench to adjust it. If you can find out how, what you'd probably want to do is loosen the truss rod maybe 1/8 to 1/2 a turn and see if that helps. Ideally you want a slight, gradual dip in the neck after the first few frets, sighting down the neck from the headstock.

Careful adjusting the truss rod - they can break/strip/crack and that's a very very sad thing. Make sure you loosen the strings before you do any of that stuff, and go easy on it. If it feels stuck or like you need to muscle it you'd be better off spending the $ and having a pro do it.

The nut might be too low as well (if the nut was low to begin with, slight changes in the neck relief would be more noticeable). Check it by fretting a string on the 3rd fret, then tap the string at the 1st fret - it should just clear the 1st fret and make a tapping noise as it hits the fret. If it's laying on the fret the nut is too low for that string. Repeat with all strings to find which are too low. A luthier could shim it a bit to bring it up, or you might need a new one (more $).

Good luck - hope some of this helps.

 

[adam79]

Adam,

It does sound like a humidity problem if it just happened in the last month. I don't know the specifics of your truss rod setup but you might need an allen wrench to adjust it.

It's one of those trust rods that have the middle filled in with a metal piece, so an allen wrench won't work. You need a nut driver, socket wrench, or whatever it's called to make the adjustment.