12-String's Study on Mixed/Matched String Sets

[capnjuan]

Interest in mixing strings sets with off-guage strings has come up recently in a couple of other threads. To my knowledge, the most informative post on the subject is from our BBer 12-string which I have reproduced below. These are the links to the original thread and post: Original text at bottom of page 5 and Top of the thread ... pics of 12-String's 12 string guitars :shock: :shock: :shock: Anyway, I though the post pretty much set the bar on the subject ... personally I'm giving up the pole vault ... impressive stuff.



"I love having guitars of different make, size, body shape, and wood combination and I also love having a variety of different string set-ups as well. I keep a dealer's inventory of single string guages an custom blend my own sets. I bought "starter kits" which got me the same boxes you see in the music stores. Very handy. I buy replacements in bulk as needed. It's expensive to start with but cheaper in the long run.

I'll start with the set I use for standard pitch. some people prefer to tune this set a M2 or 2 frets low to reduce stress on the guitar and/or for ease of playing, and that's fine; this methodology works for all.


--E---------------B------------------G----------------D--------------------A-------------------E
.010------------.014--------------.023-------------.030-----------------.039---------------.047
.010------------.014--------------.008-------------.012-----------------.020w-------------.027

The .020w isn't standard in commercial sets, but it greatly improves the sound of the guitar. Some of them break but it's still worth it.

Now let's figure out a set for a very low Lead Belly range. The strings for the 1st, 3rd, 4th and 5th courses come directly from the set above, shifted to the next higher position. We can extrapolate guages strings for the 2nd and 6th courses and her's what we come up with:

--B-----------------F#---------------D-----------------A----------------------E-----------------B
.014-------------.018-------------.030--------------.039------------------.047--------------.058
.014-------------.018-------------.012--------------.020w----------------.027--------------.036

This sets the parameters for any tuning in between. For a less extreme low tuning try to split the difference proportionally. A set for 2 frets low might look like this (lighter guage players might try this at a M3 or 4 frets low, C, G, Eb, Bb, F, C):

---D----------------A----------------F-------------------C--------------------G--------------------D
.012--------------.016------------.025---------------.032-----------------.042-----------------.050
.012--------------.016------------.010---------------.014-----------------.022-----------------.030

If I want to make a set to stay in dropped D tuning for the life of the set I beef up the 6th course a little. Beefing up the 5th and 1st courses as well makes a good open G set. Similarly, you can microadjust to any specialized tuning you want. Right now one of my little Gibsons is strung from .008-.044 and tuned a m3 or 3 frets high. I have constructed a chart of string set guages for standard, and each of 1-5 frets low. When I want to try a really oddball set like the high one above, I figure out what note names I need, find as many as I can on my chart, and extrapolate the rest.

I often increase choral effect in the treble by mismatching strrings, using a .011 and a .013 instead of two .012s, for example.

Hope this makes sense,

' Strang"

 

[shepke]

Capnjuan directed me to the original post of the very useful information above. I plan to try these various mixed gauges out in the near future.

I love playing 12 string, but they can sometimes be touchy beasts. A lot of my friends who play guitar are a little scared of them and unless they have some experience with the 12 stringer usually go all demure on me when I hand them mine while we're playing. For me, one of the main problems has been getting the beast under control based on my own playing style and technique - getting the right sound balance between strings while at the same time increasing the ease of playing. My problem is that action and ease of playing always worked against tone. The lighter the strings, the thinner the sound. Working with mixed string gauges has helped a lot, and I suspect that the choice of particular gauges is going to be different for different players. Here's a version of what I posted elsewhere.
_________________________

I've been experimenting with string gauges on my 1974 F 112 recently. In the first place, I like a lower action so I normally tune down to D and capo at the 2nd fret. Also I like the overall feel of lighter gauge strings but I've always been put off by the thin and irritatingly bright sound of 10s and 14s on the high E and B. There's just not enough "body" to the sound for my tastes and the pitch always seems a bit ambiguous to my ears - especially when I'm finger picking. The octave G (which is usually a 10) has a similar effect. It just doesn't blend well with the wound G and tends to "ping" too much (if you know what I mean). Perhaps part of this is because I keep the action so low (slightly less than 5/64th at the twelfth fret with capo), but I wanted to try to solve the problem without raising the action significantly. I've tried lights from a variety of different manufacturers in an effort to solve this problem, but to no avail.

My solution was to try mixed gauges. Starting with an extra light set of Martin 80/20s (next time I plan to use another brand), I replaced the 10s and 14s with 12s and 17s respectively, and also used an 11 in place of the 10 for the octave G (I tried a 12 but I couldn't get it up to pitch without breaking). This did the trick and only raised the action very slightly. The sound is much beefier now without having to fight heavier wound strings, and the overall balance between strings is much better as well. So far it seems to be the best of both worlds.

 

[12 string]

Aw, shucks, Capn!

Sometimes I've posted a link in threads where this seems to apply; sometimes I wonder if folks are getting tired of seeing me touting my own stuff all the time. It sure is flattering that you deem it worthy of bringing up again. Thank you.

One important thing I'd like to add: If you compare string guages and tunings in my sets to those in most commercial "medium" and "heavy" 12 string sets you will find that they skew heavily to the bass end. Bass strings which I tune to D, A and E wind up tuned to E, B, and F#, for example, and often in the same set. If you use those sets you will put a lot more tension on the guitar than a .010-.047 set tuned to standard pitch. What I do keeps the tension in the same range no matter what set-up and tuning.

' Strang

 

[john_kidder]

I'm with you on replacing the G with a slightly heavier guage - "ping" describes it exactly.

 

[capnjuan]

Sometimes I've posted a link in threads where this seems to apply; sometimes I wonder if folks are getting tired of seeing me touting my own stuff all the time. It sure is flattering that you deem it worthy of bringing up again. Thank you. ' Strang

My pleasure Maestro. Reading a few threads around here ... the au courant subject is oil on guitars ... it's pretty clear that a lot of people ... including me ... think they know what they are talking about. Not speaking for the others but I find some relief in knowing that there actually are LTG BBers who know something useful. Thank you John

 

[chazmo]

Sometimes I've posted a link in threads where this seems to apply; sometimes I wonder if folks are getting tired of seeing me touting my own stuff all the time. It sure is flattering that you deem it worthy of bringing up again. Thank you. ' Strang

My pleasure Maestro. Reading a few threads around here ... the au courant subject is oil on guitars ... it's pretty clear that a lot of people ... including me ... think they know what they are talking about. Not speaking for the others but I find some relief in knowing that there actually are LTG BBers who know something useful. Thank you John

Good point, CJ! Hey, I almost always start a post with a disclaimer (since I know very little), but when I do know something, I blurt it out like a bad meal with a kaopectate chaser... 'Strang's string gauge info is gold, though. That guy's forgotten more about 12 string-dom than I know!

 

[Alec]

FWIW, 'Strang's "Lead Belly" B tuning set is just about what I play tuned to D . . . I did a tension calculation on the set, and I want to say it was in the 250lb range, which isn't that crazy -- but maybe I remember wrong.

I have been thinking about beefing up the strings a little and going another two steps down to C, but you get pretty limited in string selection once you go over about 56W.

Alec