Tuners on '64 Starfire not working well

Norrissey

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I'm posting to request advice/suggestions - the original tuning machines on my '64 Starfire II are not working well.
I have to retune pretty much every song and sometimes mid-song! Can the tuning machines be adjusted/serviced or do I need to replace them?
If replace-what would be the best replacements? Thanks in advance for your help. Pics of the guitar and tuners attached.
 

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Midnight Toker

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Have you increased string gauge recently? Most tuning issues are actually at the nut. First try some graphite in the notches of the nut. Unless your tuner pegs are wobbly or the worm drive defective, most tuners, even cheap ones, still don't just simply jump out of tune every time you start playing. Most often it's strings getting pinched in the nut groove then dropping flat as soon as you do any bending or hard strumming. ;)

I have a 64 T100d and I have Grover tuners on it. They work fine and can be found on ebay or amazon at a decent price. Lot's of options to keep a vintage look as well.
 

Norrissey

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Have you increased string gauge recently? Most tuning issues are actually at the nut. First try some graphite in the notches of the nut. Unless your tuner pegs are wobbly or the worm drive defective, most tuners, even cheap ones, still don't just simply jump out of tune every time you start playing. Most often it's strings getting pinched in the nut groove then dropping flat as soon as you do any bending or hard strumming. ;)

I have a 64 T100d and I have Grover tuners on it. They work fine and can be found on ebay or amazon at a decent price. Lot's of options to keep a vintage look as well.
Thanks Midnight Toker and GAD! The nut is in good shape, time to get some Grovers I think!
 

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I would try disassembling and cleaning them thoroughly first. Sometimes, there is a buildup of gunk that is annoying. Also, try tightening the screw of the gear, if you haven't already. They can loosen over time. If you go the new tuner route, also check for an acceptable tension. Grovers (and copies) adjust tension through the button mounting screws, everyone else with open tuners, use the screw on the gear. Ive run into some new tuners, both as parts, and on guitars, that were pretty loose from the factory.
 

Nuuska

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A guitar player in my regular band was pissed up with his strat going flat all the timeand said he's going to ditch it into lake next time we have gig on nearby island. I asked to have a look at it - he refused for weeks - finally gave in - I immediately noticed that the strings were slipping at tuner posts - showed him another way to thread the string - problem solved - he played that guitar for years until he got cerebral thrombosis . . .


Like discussed before - while tuning - always end with tightening the knob - while even the best tuners have minimum slack in gear. And have the strings correctly attached to posts.
 

Midnight Toker

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^ You'd think that would be common knowledge for any stringed instrument owner. Sadly it's not. I've seen people that have been playing for 25+ years still leave way too much slack in the string before tightening.....producing 6-7-8-9 wraps around the post. That doesn't help when stretching your strings out. By the time they are properly stretched, it'll be time to change them again!! :cautious:
 

Norrissey

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A guitar player in my regular band was pissed up with his strat going flat all the timeand said he's going to ditch it into lake next time we have gig on nearby island. I asked to have a look at it - he refused for weeks - finally gave in - I immediately noticed that the strings were slipping at tuner posts - showed him another way to thread the string - problem solved - he played that guitar for years until he got cerebral thrombosis . . .


Like discussed before - while tuning - always end with tightening the knob - while even the best tuners have minimum slack in gear. And have the strings correctly attached to posts.
Thank you for suggesting that. I do often restring my guitars but this particular set was put on by a luthier and are stable. I think the tuners are the culprit.
 

Guildedagain

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I've never met an old tuner I didn't like. Clean em, lube em, Tri Flow. Use the side adjusting screws to adjust tension properly per string, I usually go lighter on lighter strings.

Recently bought an old Silvertone with repop Klusons, my God they were horrible, the slop back and forth unimaginable as well as the ratio not quite right.

I know the guitar would play a million times better if I put original USA Waverly strip tuners on it, way cheaper quality than your old Grovers, and I looked through my stash, found the right strip tuners and the guitar is amazing now.

Always tune up in pitch, that's how these work, and most other old tuners. If a string goes sharp, hmmmm, yep, that's your nut, just tug on the string to get it, stretch it, rather than detune/retune.

The Grovers you have on are very fine tuners, I call dibs if you take them off, they're junk right? ;]

If they really are worn out, look at replacing them with identical tuners with lower miles. These buttons are the prettiest Grovers ever, I personally only like SFIII with these, if I was looking for one, and these were gone by '66, they put some really really rank low end Japanese tuners on with horrible looking keys earning GAD's most scathing comments, like why Guild, why? Oh, the money, they were cheap, but also in the 60's it was hard to get tuners, more demand than supply.

When they did slap those tuners on a guitar, I don't have much interest, but most have now been converted to sealed Grover Rotomatics, which are very nice tuners, but to me, considerably heavier than the open back Grovers which really go back to the "Golden Age", the 1930's.
 
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Walter Broes

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The Grover statites on my own '61 SFIII were shot and worn out too, and I've replaced them with new butterbean Grovers, was totally worth it, and the tuners dropped right in, no drilling or even changing out bushings required.

It's not ALWAYS the nut folks!
 

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I wish there were a decent drop-in for the Japanese tuners on my ce-100. They keep it in tune, but they have to be cranked pretty tightly.
 

dreadnut

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Those are nice tuners, if they aren't turning smoothly, simply give them a small drop of oil and adjust the tightening screw if necessary.

Also, as previously mentioned, always stop tuning on the way up, not on the way down.
 

Shakeylee

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The Grover statites on my own '61 SFIII were shot and worn out too, and I've replaced them with new butterbean Grovers, was totally worth it, and the tuners dropped right in, no drilling or even changing out bushings required.

It's not ALWAYS the nut folks!
whereas it isn't always the nut, the OP's picture shows little to no wear on the gears of their very fine grovers
 
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