No! No! No! No! No!

Midnight Toker

Midnight Toker

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twocorgis said:
Most folks would turn vegan if they saw the way the meat that they currently eat was grown and harvested, so why not?
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I recently saw a tv series that toured a top notch restaurant in Australia located on a farm where every single thing they serve was grown/raised on the property. 100% completely self sustained. The plant's feeding the animals, the animals in turn feeding the plants. While visiting the hog pen, the owner/master chef/butcher called this enourmous hog by name which ran up to them being all playful like a golden retriever, asking to be pet and scratched. The host then asked, "how can you butcher and eat an animal that you actually know...and love?" His answer was quite profound. "How can you eat an animal you don't know? That you know nothing about? How it lived, what it was fed?" The host paused for a second, then said he'd never thought about it that way and that he was absolutely right. 👍🏻
 
fronobulax

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If "lab grown" makes you shudder, consider the following:

You have a child with a defective heart valve. It can be surgically replaced but with what?

  • A valve from a pig?
  • A valve from a organ donor?
  • A valve grown in a laboratory?

While the lab grown valve is still research and development and not common practice it has three obvious benefits.

  • It is less likely to be rejected as foreign tissue.
  • The supply is more predictable given the size of the child and donated valve must match.
  • The "natural" valves will not grow with the child and will have to be replaced when the child reaches adulthood. Evidence so far is that the lab valve will grow.

It's going to be a lot harder to unconditionally reject lab grown products if (when) that's what's best for your kid.
 
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fronobulax said:
If "lab grown" makes you shudder, consider the following:

You have a child with a defective heart valve. It can be surgically replaced but with what?

  • A valve from a pig?
  • A valve from a organ donor?
  • A valve grown in a laboratory?

While the lab grown valve is still research and development and not common practice it has three obvious benefits.

  • It is less likely to be rejected as foreign tissue.
  • The supply is more predictable given the size of the child and donated valve must match.
  • The "natural" valves will not grow with the child and will have to be replaced when the child reaches adulthood. Evidence so far is that the lab valve will grow.

It's going to be a lot harder to unconditionally reject lab grown products if (when) that's what's best for your kid.
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Especially if that heart valve has been grown from genetically modified (there's those words again) cells that don't produce the proteins on their surface (primarily HLA-antigens) that cause the most common types of rejection.
 
Opsimath

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fronobulax said:
If "lab grown" makes you shudder, consider the following:

You have a child with a defective heart valve. It can be surgically replaced but with what?

  • A valve from a pig?
  • A valve from a organ donor?
  • A valve grown in a laboratory?

While the lab grown valve is still research and development and not common practice it has three obvious benefits.

  • It is less likely to be rejected as foreign tissue.
  • The supply is more predictable given the size of the child and donated valve must match.
  • The "natural" valves will not grow with the child and will have to be replaced when the child reaches adulthood. Evidence so far is that the lab valve will grow.

It's going to be a lot harder to unconditionally reject lab grown products if (when) that's what's best for your kid.
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I am absolutely all for that kind of application. I just don't want lab grown "meat" on my plate. If someone else wants to eat it, that's a-okay with me, but I'll pass, thank you very much.

And yes, I could likely eat an animal I know. I wanted to eat Opey (calf of my milk cow, Madeline), but now he's just a big pet because husband and son balked and I have to buy overpriced albeit nameless beef from the grocery store. What I found online when researching home grown beef was along the lines of "The old timers say the most delectable beef is a steer raised on Jersey milk". That's why I wanted to eat Opey.
 
fronobulax

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Rocky said:
Especially if that heart valve has been grown from genetically modified (there's those words again) cells that don't produce the proteins on their surface (primarily HLA-antigens) that cause the most common types of rejection.
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I don't recall GMO involved in organ replication, just standard cultivation techniques. But if that's wrong then I didn't make the point I thought I was ;-)
 
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fronobulax said:
I don't recall GMO involved in organ replication, just standard cultivation techniques. But if that's wrong then I didn't make the point I thought I was ;-)
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I believe GMO has been used experimentally for growing of porcine organs/tissues in vivo (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5617878/), but I don't know if that's been used in 3D tissue culture. I've been out of that for a while.
 
Balderdash

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For a close comparison, it might be worth considering the product line available from Beyond Meat, on grocery store shelves to some extent since 2012. All their meat substitutes are made directly from plant processing and come apparently close to simulating chicken, beef, pork, and sausage. In theory, their product line alone would avoid cattle and pig production, with the global warming contribution of those activities and the butchering process of killing all the animals we chew on. I am not qualified to rate how well their products duplicate the animal products, because I’ve never tried them. I am not alone. Their market acceptance has been a bit dismal, with the company struggling to succeed. Trying to take this new ‘genuine animal cell lab process’ to a significant operation of scale would likely meet with a similar lack of marketing success and public acceptance. Just my guess.
 
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dreadnut said:
It just ain't natural.
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Not much on this world is anymore. This seems to be an interesting alternative protein source, but so are insect based or plant based alternatives. It is also noteworthy that the average sedentary urban dweller actually does not require much protein at at all to stay healthy. On the other hand they have huge deficiencies in fibre and other nutrient intakes that cause a huge burden to the health system.
 
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I know a vegetarian. He doesn't like the Beyond Meat stuff. I looked at the sodium content and decided the real stuff was better for my blood pressure.

I would question just how much water and carbon and other greenhouse gases it would really take to replace all the things we use live animals for with this process. So many people think it's easy to replace these staples, but we've never ramped up anything large enough to see. There are a lot of products made with feed animal content beyond just the meat for consumption.
 
GardMan

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In my lecture on recombinant DNA technology (I taught intro Cell Biology for most of my 30+ years on the faculty at the University of Utah), I had a small section on genetically-modified organisms, using "Roundup-Ready" crops as an example of how they were generated. But, I also pointed out that pretty much EVERY ORGANISM WE EAT, be it plant or animal, is genetically modified... in some cases, by recombinant DNA technology, in others by thousands of years of selective breeding. About the only exceptions would be those organisms harvested directly from the wild...

I also enjoyed pointing out to all my vegetarian students that, when they eat a nice crisp salad for lunch before lecture, they are actually eating those veggies ALIVE... for only a LIVING plant cell maintains the turgor pressure needed for "crispness."
 
dreadnut

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JohnW63 said:
I know a vegetarian. He doesn't like the Beyond Meat stuff. I looked at the sodium content and decided the real stuff was better for my blood pressure.

I would question just how much water and carbon and other greenhouse gases it would really take to replace all the things we use live animals for with this process. So many people think it's easy to replace these staples, but we've never ramped up anything large enough to see. There are a lot of products made with feed animal content beyond just the meat for consumption.
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Yeah, you can't get somethin' for nothin'.
 
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LAY'S SG.jpg
8 BILLION PEOPLE? I'M JUST SAYIN'...
 
HeyMikey

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richardp69 said:
I am an old man, don't adapt to change well and am not real excited by the new and improved approach. In short, I am a dinosaur. Lab grown meat won't be finding it's way to my table, ever.
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Ditto.

Lab grown meat? Yeah, that’s a hard “no”! With the FDA’s stellar record what can possibly go wrong?
 
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