Higher end Martins and their big fat necks!

Ridgemont

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Ok so here is nice story,

I was in Houston yesterday on business and on my way out of town I decided to visit Houston's nicest guitar shop, Fullers Vintage Guitar. Every time I go in, the same friendly guy helps me and sits patiently while a tinker on a couple of guitars. Well, I wasn't planning on playing any yesterday due to that reason, but I still wanted to look around. I have played almost every Guild they have in the store, so yesterday I was browsing the Martin selection. The owner (I presume), came up to me and said to point at something and he would let me play it.

Well I have been hammering on my "new" F30 for a while and really enjoy its tone. I also remember never really enjoying the tone of a Standard Series 000-18. So I asked to play the -18 just to see if that still held true after all this time spent with the F30. I picked a couple numbers on it, and yes, just as I had suspected, the Std-18 just wasn't for me. Just something about the finish in each note sounded too sterile with no personality. The F30 has a woody twang that is just lovely. The owner and I started talking guitars and he pulled an 000-18Authentic off the shelf for me to try. Now I never played an Authentic (pricey!), but it's cousin, the -18GE is similar in build and tone so I knew what I was getting myself into. I was expecting tone I just love and fall for but with a thick fat neck that is too uncomfortable in my hands. I wrapped my hand around the neck and WHAT?????? A fit like a glove! Sometimes I reach over and use my thumb on the low E and that was easy as well, even up to the 5th fret. The tone was phenomenal (of course) and now that cumbersome neck was easy as well. I pulled an 000-28EC off the shelf and tried it as well. Easy as butter. I then tried a 00-28VS (a little thicker of a neck, close to a classical) and it was more of a challenge, but doable. I have always loved the tone of these higher end Martins, but two things always got in the way: 1)Money, and 2) that thick fat neck.

Well neck problem solved! How???? My hands did not grow. I started thinking about it and decided it was my damned F30. It has a pretty thick, chunky C-profile neck that was difficult to play at first. After about a month, I am so used to it, I don't even think twice. The necks on my D25 and 000-15 are tiny compared to the F30. I guess the F30 has conditioned my hand to the larger necks. Well great, just freakin' great. Now I am itchin' for one of these nicer Martins...good thing I don't have any money! :lol: One of those 00 12-fret Martins sure would be fun to have. Maybe one day, but for now, I am just glad I now find the fat necks comfortable.

Oh and for what it is worth, the Std 000-18 has got nothin' on my F30! Nothing.
 

Frosty

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The 40's era Gibson necks aside, there is much to be said about the ergonomics of a well shaped neck. And by "well shaped", I mean thoughtfully carved to work with a human being's hand. I can remember my reaction the first time I picked up a guitar with a "low profile" neck... years ago and made by some guy in Lemon Grove, CA. It was all the rage... and I found it awkward at first. Then, after spending a couple of hours with the guitar I found it downright uncomfortable and encouraging of poor technique.

So, as it sounds like you've discovered, "big fat" is relative and doesn't mean "unplayable". We talked about the Martin Clapton guitar in another thread. The neck profile on that guitar is wonderful, IMO.
 

killdeer43

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Frosty said:
We talked about the Martin Clapton guitar in another thread. The neck profile on that guitar is wonderful, IMO.
I certainly agree with that assessment.
I will confess to having played a 000-28EC at my Martin dealer/friend's music store, and I'm always really close to taking it off his hands....I like it that much! :wink:

Joe
 

Ridgemont

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Frosty said:
The 40's era Gibson necks aside, there is much to be said about the ergonomics of a well shaped neck. And by "well shaped", I mean thoughtfully carved to work with a human being's hand. I can remember my reaction the first time I picked up a guitar with a "low profile" neck... years ago and made by some guy in Lemon Grove, CA. It was all the rage... and I found it awkward at first. Then, after spending a couple of hours with the guitar I found it downright uncomfortable and encouraging of poor technique.

So, as it sounds like you've discovered, "big fat" is relative and doesn't mean "unplayable". We talked about the Martin Clapton guitar in another thread. The neck profile on that guitar is wonderful, IMO.

You are right in that everything is relative. That is interesting that you say it encourages poor technique. I haven't had much time the the larger neck profiles, but it makes me wonder about my technique that has developed with some of the smaller necks....
 

bluesypicky

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Ridge,
If you remember back when I shot a first review of my F-30, my biggest "surprise" (litteraly) was the neck size. Didn't bother me, but it sure IS big. And surprising, on a little guitar the size of my LG-01 with it's tiny necky....
I reiterate: You MUST put your hands on a 000-MMV. In addition to a great rich sound, and being real affordable, the neck has (for me at least) the glove fit characteristic....
Only problem is you have to go to a GC.... And to one that has it in stock....
 

Ridgemont

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Hey Bluesy,

I will have to look for one of the MMVs. But I don't know...having to step foot into a GC could be a deal breaker. :lol: :lol: :lol: I can see it now, I will be in the high end acoustic room testing out a guitar with bad strings in dire need of a set up and I will get drowned out by some 14 year old kid with oversized pants and long hair plucking through "stairway to heaven" on an $99 Squier. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 

bluesypicky

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Ridgemont said:
Hey Bluesy, I will have to look for one of the MMVs. But I don't know...having to step foot into a GC could be a deal breaker. :lol: :lol: :lol: I can see it now, I will be in the high end acoustic room testing out a guitar with bad strings in dire need of a set up and I will get drowned out by some 14 year old kid with oversized pants and long hair plucking through "stairway to heaven" on an $99 Squier. :lol: :lol: :lol:
I know it's a tough predicament.... :lol: but no other road to the MMV though.
GC's holding you by the....(forgot the word) on that one! :lol:
 

Ridgemont

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Hey Bluesy,

I stumbled over to GC today....found me a fresh out of the box MMV.... :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: 8) I must say, that is one magnificent guitar. You weren't joking....all for $1500!!! I don't know how they did it but they did. There is a limited supply due to only being available at GC so that makes sense. There is no way they could produce something of that high quality and tone and send it for mass distribution...or could they? In either case, that is one fabulous guitar. I am on board! If I had the money, I would definitely pick it up, but hey it's not the right time. It really makes you think. Martin can provide a guitar of that nature for $1500 and the new Std Guild F30R will probably be going for ~$2000. :evil:
 

bluesypicky

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Ridgemont said:
Hey Bluesy,

I stumbled over to GC today....found me a fresh out of the box MMV.... :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: 8) I must say, that is one magnificent guitar. You weren't joking....all for $1500!!! I don't know how they did it but they did. There is a limited supply due to only being available at GC so that makes sense. There is no way they could produce something of that high quality and tone and send it for mass distribution...or could they? In either case, that is one fabulous guitar. I am on board! If I had the money, I would definitely pick it up, but hey it's not the right time. It really makes you think. Martin can provide a guitar of that nature for $1500 and the new Std Guild F30R will probably be going for ~$2000. :evil:
Hi Ridge!
Glad you could find one and now understand (and share) my enthusiasm.
You are pointing out the question that first came to my mind when I got mine: The profit margins.... I know these companies have huge overheads and are here to make money, but still makes you wonder when you can get a Martin of this quality for under $1500, what kind of profit they make when they sell an E.C. (or as you say Guild's margin on a $2000.00 F30....) :roll:
Regardless, that MMV still puts a smile on my face every time I grab it, and that's what matters!... I received my lifetime warranty registration card.... pretty cool, 1st time ever I buy a new guitar, and it's a Martin! Thumbs up on the MMV! Despite the GC exclusivity... :wink: and because of it too: I'm thinking GC, like it or not, is the only outlet with enough purchasing power to bring Martin down to a deal like this. Martin probably went for it with the idea that they will limit this reduced margin guitar to GC stores only, and with hope that, given the GC presence all over the country, it will sell them some more expensive guitars by baiting and switching....
 

krcrisp

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The MMV is also available through Musician's Friend, at least it was.

It is a very, very nice guitar for the money. I got mine used for $600, probably a great buy even though it needed 5 frets replaced. Not quite the complexity of tone of a HD28, but 85% of the way there for a lot less money.
 

bluesypicky

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krcrisp said:
The MMV is also available through Musician's Friend, at least it was.
Hi krcisp,
No, the 000-MMV is not at Musician Friends, only in stores.... But the Dreadnought MMV is (I suppose it is the one you are comparing to the HD 28, that you got?..).
 

kitniyatran

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But Musician's Friend IS Guitar Center; it's the mail order/online original.

$600 was Really a deal.
 

bluesypicky

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MandoSquirrel said:
But Musician's Friend IS Guitar Center; it's the mail order/online original.
Yes it is. And I was surprised not to be able to find the 000 there, but it is not.(I even called them and asked).
Why? Don't know. Maybe Martin decided to build even less 000 than Dread MMV's, but bottom line is you can only get the 000 at the stores.
 

kitniyatran

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Never seen the 000, but the dread MMV I tried a few years ago was worth at least twice the asking price.
Glad I found the Guild at around half the asking price, though. Otherwise, I'd have had to buy the Martin & pay more! :D
 

bluesypicky

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MandoSquirrel said:
Never seen the 000, but the dread MMV I tried a few years ago was worth at least twice the asking price.
I agree to the same with the 000. I have never seen the dread, but from what I've heard and read, I kinda hope I won't see one anytime soon, because I need to spend more money on another dread like a hole in the head right now... and I have a feeling I would have a hard time resisting it!. :roll:
 

Ridgemont

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They have the dread here at my local GC as well. Didn't play it though since am not really a dread guy. The tone and sound of the 000 was just so complex. Very bright, but I suspect that was the crisp new PB strings on it. I went home right away to test my GAD and it just wasn't the same. There was some similarity is fullness, but everything on the GAD was just toned down. Maybe the 4-month old strings aren't helping. Would I trade in the GAD for the MMV plus a little up charge? Absolutely! But that would be a huge expense considering the price difference. I have always had the plan to upgrade the GAD to something nicer line the OM-21 (I really like those) but the mmv would be a no brainer as well.
 

spiderman

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Personally I do not like the older style Martin necks, with stubby fingers they are a real pain to play. Martin low profiles are perfect, thank you Bob Taylor :twisted:

Harmony H-173 bought in 1960 (retired), Alvarez AC60S 2008, Eastman AC320ce 2008 "Hybrid", Guild GAD-JF30E(blonde) 2008, Guild JF55 1997, Guild D25M 1974, Martin Grand J35E 2009, Martin D12-20 1970
"I'm glad there are a lot of guitar players pursuing technique as diligently as they possibly can, because it leaves this whole other area open to people like me."
Richard Thompson
 
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