Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 27

Thread: Pickup for a 12 String Acoustic

  1. #11
    My DDS-12 (and DDS-6) came with a Barbera Saddle pickup. A little pricy ($300) but they sound great. They were good enough for the Guild factory to use. http://barberatransducers.com/

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom O View Post
    My DDS-12 (and DDS-6) came with a Barbera Saddle pickup. A little pricy ($300) but they sound great. They were good enough for the Guild factory to use. http://barberatransducers.com/
    these look amazing. they are the saddle. genius
    Wood

    1971 D25--The Br
    1973 D35 esh

    https://soundcloud.com/woody-adams/sets/not-metal

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by chazmo View Post
    Markus, good call. I think that might be a "newer" product from K&K, as in something introduced in the past 10 years or so. The description sounds like it might address some of the "fullness" of the sound that you'd want with a 12er.

    I like the PW mini on my F-512. Don't love it. Tremendous value, but my two observations about using it on stage are that it sounds a little bit quacky and feedback is an issue (probably the nature of the F-512 beast anyway). I'm a novice performer and really not sure what to expect re: feedback with an F-512.

    I actually have the K&K preamp box, but I've never used it. Maybe I should.

    Crank's observations about the K&K are very interesting, I will say that a multi-source system like the DTAR (now Seymour-Duncan) really caught my ear a few years ago in New Hartford. I don't know how it sounds on a 12-string (nobody had one), but it was heaven on the 6. I suspect a microphonic source would really help with quack and fullness on a 12-string too, but can't speak first-hand.
    Yes you should use the preamp...you'll boost the signal and won't have to turn everything else up so high it starts breaking up.

    Quack doesn't have anything to do with using a microphone or not.

    Nuuska can probably explain the issue much better than I.
    Last edited by GuildFS4612CE; 07-11-2019 at 11:24 PM.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom O View Post
    My DDS-12 (and DDS-6) came with a Barbera Saddle pickup. A little pricy ($300) but they sound great. They were good enough for the Guild factory to use. http://barberatransducers.com/
    Did your DD's come with the Baggs on board preamp that Doyle had Lloyd design in his prototypes? That's different from the Barbera passive PUPS...they are great in any case...just you'll need an offboard preamp if you install the Barbera passives.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by gibsonjunkie View Post
    I have the DTAR - multi-source, just like the ones that came in all my other Guilds. Love it!
    Didn't the DTAR come with higher headroom to deal with the quack?

  6. #16
    Richard...first you need to decide how and where you will be playing your 12 strings amplified...alone in your house...by yourself to accompany singing in public...in church in a group...with a band in a coffee shop?

    Different systems do different things...you might also ask your luthier for an opinion.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom O View Post
    My DDS-12 (and DDS-6) came with a Barbera Saddle pickup. A little pricy ($300) but they sound great. They were good enough for the Guild factory to use. http://barberatransducers.com/
    Agreed! Best pickups I've ever used.
    Dave

    1989 D-25
    1990 D-30
    2003 S-7CE
    2011 D-50 Std
    2013 DD-6RCE
    2014 Orpheum 12FSHM

    1996 Taylor 555
    2010 Jacobs Jagcaster
    2013 Martin 000-28EC
    2013 G&L Tribute JB2
    2017 Jacobs Strat


    http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default ... ID=1018446

  8. #18
    Senior Member adorshki's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Sillycon Valley CA
    Posts
    26,019
    Quote Originally Posted by GuildFS4612CE View Post
    Didn't the DTAR come with higher headroom to deal with the quack?
    Yes the later one, I think the dual source like Chaz mentioned.
    It used higher voltage allowing more headroom as Nuuska explained in this post about the op amp in his '70's F212:
    http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sho...k-Up-Question:
    " The National Semiconductors OP AMP LM4250 is powered with +/- 1,5V using two AA-batteries.
    According to datasheet it could be run with +/- 9V or even +/- 18V - leading to over 20dB more gain or headroom."

    Not saying the DTAR'S the same chip, I don't know, but the principle still applies.
    "IIRC" TXBumper was/is also a big fan of that system for that same reason.
    But I think even he rated the Barbera as superior if one could afford the coin.
    Last edited by adorshki; 07-12-2019 at 12:09 AM.
    Al
    "Time May Change the Technique of Music But Never Its Mission " - Rachmaninoff
    My 1st Guild: '96 Westerly D25NT "Hally" (10-31-96 stamped on heelblock)
    #2: '01 Westerly F65ce "Blondie"
    #3: '03 Corona D40e Richie Havens "Richie"
    All bought new!

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Bloomfield, CT
    Posts
    351
    Quote Originally Posted by adorshki View Post
    Yes the later one, I think the dual source like Chaz mentioned.
    It used higher voltage allowing more headroom as Nuuska explained in this post about the op amp in his '70's F212:
    http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sho...k-Up-Question:
    " The National Semiconductors OP AMP LM4250 is powered with +/- 1,5V using two AA-batteries.
    According to datasheet it could be run with +/- 9V or even +/- 18V - leading to over 20dB more gain or headroom."

    Not saying the DTAR'S the same chip, I don't know, but the principle still applies.
    "IIRC" TXBumper was/is also a big fan of that system for that same reason.
    But I think even he rated the Barbera as superior if one could afford the coin.
    The DTAR is advertised as being 18v. I don't know a lot of technical details, but it sounds great!
    2011 F-212XL(w/D-TAR)
    2011 F-47RC (w/D-TAR)
    2012 F-30 Aragon (w/D-TAR)
    2013 D-55 (w/D-TAR)

  10. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    San Jose, Ca
    Posts
    357
    Time for the impedance matching lecture for newbies. I'll try not to get too technical. It is the nature of piezo pickups that they need the input impedance of the next device in the signal chain to have a 1 Meg ohm input impedance. All soundboard transducers like the K&K mini and all undersaddle pickups use piezo crystals to turn vibration into and electrical signal. Run into a typical mixing board of around 800 ohms, the signal is bright and harsh. It is how piezo pickups react with the next device that determines the frequency response. With acoustic instruments, the first devise could be a pre, a DI box, a mixing board or an amplifier. You need something to match the impedance so you sound good. Virtually all acoustic pres and acoustic amps have the correct value input impedance. Some DIs do, some don't. Some mixing boards have a switch (labeled hi Z). If your guitar has a battery, it has an onboard pre amp so you are good to go. Regular electric guitar effects boxes and amplifiers usually don't match.

    Some well known quality devices are the RedEye, the Baggs PARA DI, numerous Fishman products, K&K, etc.Usually money buys mo bedder. I am fortunate to live by Teddy Randazzo, maker of Dazzo pickups. I have them in six guitars. I have six and twelve string Pono parlor guitars. They are identical in every way but the number of strings, but they have different pickup sets tailored to each guitar. The K&K is designed to sound good in the most variety of guitars. It is this compromise that necessitates a lot of EQ. With Dazzos I use little to no EQ. K&K is the one size fits all solution, and maybe the way to go if you are not a sound geek.

    Sometimes I think those that sell and install pickups don't want to lose a sale by pointing out the need to buy more gear. I can attest to the lack of this basic knowledge because I co host an open mike. 95% of K&K owners think they can just plug in, and they can if they want a harsh tone. It got so bad I had SunnAudio, another fine local company, build me a DI box we plug everyone into. Now those $4000 K&K equipped guitars sound good.
    Last edited by Br1ck; 07-12-2019 at 07:55 PM.
    Shut up and play your guitar- Frank Zappa

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •