Doyle Dyles Live on Facebook -- Highlights for those of you not on FB

adorshki

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I guess that's one way of looking at it... but OTOH,

What's the difference between endorsing a product for a paycheck, and endorsing a product for merchandise?
Absolutely NONE

... I'm pretty sure that DD is getting paid for being on the Guild team (as much as he does like Guilds, I am sure there is monetary value for his endorsement...)
That's a pretty big assumption; there's all kinds of compensation that don't necessarily involve cold hard cash such as assuming touring costs.
And for all we know maybe Cordoba will consider free instruments where NH didn't (assuming that was actually the case).
It may have been they simply couldn't justify a freebie to anybody at the time, even if they were owned by Fender; heck Doyle himself may have said "I want to pay for the guitar, compensate me in another way".
We may never know, and no snark intended but I don't really care... I think Guild's approach as Drumbob described was the most sensible.
Most fans assume if an artist is endorsing the brand then the maker's supplying 'em with at least one free instrument, but it's gotten a lot more complicated since then.
But yes it does seem to render the question of conflict of interest ("bribery") somewhat pointless.
If for example Doyle was tasked with maintaining a Facebook page and posting a certain amount of Guild references each month then I'd say "Yeah, actually for that he should be paid".
Same with in-store workshops, but again, all of these things can be and are compensated in a variety of ways these days.
Why is a paycheck somehow more legitimate?
I never meant to imply it was.
And BTW here's some discussion on the AGF about this very same question (how endorsements are compensated) , and apparently Taylor has a flexible attitude about what's free and what's not, and for who, too:
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=271308
:friendly_wink:
 
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adorshki

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Unless, of course, the tax man is involved...
Merchandise and services (living quarters, transportation provided as a condition of employment: think apartment managers who get housing as part of their pay) are also be taxable as income unless you meant something else I'm not getting?
I do trust that Doyle would declare those pennies on his eyes.
:smile-new:
 

PittPastor

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Merchandise and services (living quarters, transportation provided as a condition of employment: think apartment managers who get housing as part of their pay) are also be taxable as income unless you meant something else I'm not getting?
I do trust that Doyle would declare those pennies on his eyes.
:smile-new:

Doyle would, I believe.

But Frono brings up a good point. Unless it is declared in a 1099MISC from Guild, would an artist need to declare it on his return? I mean, assuming that some musician somewhere wanted to skip taxes. Probably never happens. I'm sure that guy in the subway I threw a dollar into the case of declared that dollar on his income tax. Musicians are sticklers like that....

Anyway, I guess guitar makers can do whatever they want. And if artists are OK with it, I'm with you adorshki, why should I care? It's not like I have a big enough talent that I'll ever be offered anything. Maybe a free sticker. I think I could score that with my talent. If I practice really hard, maybe a cleaning cloth.
 

fronobulax

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Merchandise and services (living quarters, transportation provided as a condition of employment: think apartment managers who get housing as part of their pay) are also be taxable as income unless you meant something else I'm not getting?
I do trust that Doyle would declare those pennies on his eyes.
:smile-new:

If you are attempting to evade taxes then barter transactions are much easier to hide than employment transactions.

If you are not trying to evade taxes then there are limits on reportable income and it is easier to manage the reportable value of a barter transaction.

If, for example, Doyle Dykes, Inc. exists then it is easier to treat have the barter income attributed to DDI than the employment income. And DDI has many legal ways to reduce taxes that DD does not.

There are tax consequences to being an employee as opposed to an independent contractor.

But yeah, my point is that whether you are trying to avoid taxes or not, barter income is a lot more flexible than employment income.
 

adorshki

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If you are not trying to evade taxes then there are limits on reportable income and it is easier to manage the reportable value of a barter transaction.
Just wanted to be sure that's what you were actually getting at, because yes, it may have advantages for both parties and at least partly explain why artist endorsement compensation has become so variegated over the last 20 years or so.
And the forms of compensation may not be equally beneficial for both parties, either.
Whose lawyers are negotiating the best endorsement compensation deal for their client, the artist's or the "company's"?
I seem to recall an actual "Barter Economy" movement a while back that promoted itself as creating untaxable income because no legal currency was involved, which of course the IRS immediately took measures to deal with.
So suspect any form of compensation tendered by companies seeking artist endorsement is reported to the fullest extent the law allows.
:smile-new:
Tongue is firmly in cheek there, I expect anybody to "game the system" to fullest extent of the available loopholes.
Speculating about whether or not a given entity intentionally evades reporting or not seems pointless.
Oh the thing about the tax handling of employee vs independent contractor income is quite relevant as well.
One thing that comes to mind is the tax-exempt status of employee contributions to health care plans.
And the potential to participate in company-sponsored 401K plans.
 
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Westerly Wood

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i figure he is doing it to get some Guild strings.
 

Westerly Wood

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Being out of production and therefore collector's items, those would be hard to put a value on.
:glee:

:)
priceless Al. Doyle knows what he is doing. I imagine some back room in Oxnard, most likely under ground bunker, beneath the facility, tunnels, and finally a room full of Guild PB light gauge strings. Doyle is in there, searching. You know, the pack with the .25 g string. yeah
 

adorshki

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:)
priceless Al. Doyle knows what he is doing. I imagine some back room in Oxnard, most likely under ground bunker, beneath the facility, tunnels, and finally a room full of Guild PB light gauge strings. Doyle is in there, searching. You know, the pack with the .25 g string. yeah

Ever in pursuit of new realms of experience, I have finally freed myself of the addiction to uncoated PB lights with an .025 G.
My newfound and legal high is GHS Silk & Steel Mediums, tuned down a whole step, as evidenced here:
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/showthread.php?199255-Al-s-Farewell-Tour&p=1843368#post1843368
 

PittPastor

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:)
priceless Al. Doyle knows what he is doing. I imagine some back room in Oxnard, most likely under ground bunker, beneath the facility, tunnels, and finally a room full of Guild PB light gauge strings. Doyle is in there, searching. You know, the pack with the .25 g string. yeah

raiders_of_the_lost_ark_warehouse_scene.jpg


Doyle: I just know those are here somewhere.
Guild: You find them, they're yours.
 

Westerly Wood

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raiders_of_the_lost_ark_warehouse_scene.jpg


Doyle: I just know those are here somewhere.
Guild: You find them, they're yours.

perfect pic, exactly what i was thinking Pitt, just maybe a room or bunker 1/50th of that size :)

i loved that scene from that movie.

oh and you guys know that Al actually has a basement in his house with hundreds of these packs of strings right?
 

adorshki

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Two Packs of Vintage 1980's Guild Phosphor Bronze L-350 Acoustic Guitar Strings! Original Case Candy
https://reverb.com/item/19564602-tw...0-acoustic-guitar-strings-original-case-candy
yd92tx0boyahqix7xmui.jpg


"One pack is missing its plastic packaging and one string."
Guess which one?

And joking aside, I seriously doubt the strings shown in this ad are actually available:
gui3500350.jpg

Fender stopped offering the L350's with the .025 G in around '04, even though the spec sheets listed 'em all the way through Tacoma, and that was the last packaging they ever came in.
I wonder if those're the lost Corona s/n records in Fender's Scottsdale headquarters that Doyle's wandering around in, there?

oh and you guys know that Al actually has a basement in his house with hundreds of these packs of strings right?

Nope just one left, for my D25.
Been usin' the D'Addario EJ-16's with the subbed-in .025 for actual playing.
But they all got those colored ball-ends.
Not the L-350's, those were a real man's string.
By god you could even use the .012's for tuna fishing leaders.
 
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adorshki

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Yes, but isn't that hundreds of packs with the .25 g string missing (since they were used in other sets?)?

Nope.
If they'd had the .025 I woulda used the whole set.
:friendly_wink:
Soon as I saw what Fender had done, change the set gauge mix (and supplier) without any warning except the ".024" where it used to say ".025" on the same package art , I started looking for a new brand.
Which was how I converted to D'Addario-ism after realizing they were the original makers in the first place.
They're also one of the few (if not the only one) who offer an .025 single (PB025) for us purists.
(Or "former purists" as the case may be. :glee: )
It just occurred to me, I wonder how much of the perceived lack-luster sound quality of Corona guitars was due to Fender having switched to their own captive string maker during that same time?
I realized something wasn't quite right when I first re-strung the D25 with a set and didn't even pay attention to the string envelopes.
Had to go back and look at an unopened set to figure out they'd slipped a ringer in there.
Comparing the new strings to an "old" (unused) set revealed a different colored alloy on the wound strings so I knew it was more than just a single string gauge change.

So, no, suspect all those hundreds of unsold strings are probably the still-born L-355/M-455 "Balanced Tension" sets:
guild_l355_balanced_phosphor_set.jpg

:smile:
 
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Westerly Wood

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Nope.
If they'd had the .025 I woulda used the whole set.
:friendly _wink:
Soon as I saw what Fender had done, change the set gauge mix (and supplier) without any warning except the ".024" where it used to say ".025" on the same package art , I started looking for a new brand.
Which was how I converted to D'Addario-ism after realizing they were the original makers in the first place.
They're also one of the few (if not the only one) who offer an .025 single (PB025) for us purists.
(Or "former purists" as the case may be. :glee: )
It just occurred to me, I wonder how much of the perceived lack-luster sound quality of Corona guitars was due to Fender having switched to their own captive string maker during that same time?
I realized something wasn't quite right when I first re-strung the D25 with a set and didn't even pay attention to the string envelopes.
Had to go back and look at an unopened set to figure out they'd slipped a ringer in there.
Comparing the new strings to an "old" (unused) set revealed a different colored alloy on the wound strings so I knew it was more than just a single string gauge change.

So, no, suspect all those hundreds of unsold strings are probably the still-born L-355/M-455 "Balanced Tension" sets:
guild_l355_balanced_phosphor_set.jpg

:smile:

D'Addario-ism

:)
 

Tom O

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Cougar, The DD12 sounds good but my DD6 is slightly better. They really need to be plugged in to shine. Doyle just recorded a song on the Mike Huckabee show. I think it will air on June 12th. Enjoy your Gibson. My 64 J-50 is hard to beat.
 
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