DV 73 - how many were made?

DV-72 NT

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Not sure I understand your question if you noticed that HG is High Gloss. If EVERY DV-7x has a high gloss finish then the presence/absence is almost certainly error. But if there were finish options then this is what we expect.

I wonder if the HG labels have the same hand writing? It is easy to imagine someone who was used to putting HG on the labels of other models doing that on a DV-7x even thought it was not required.
Thanks Frono. When I 1[SUP]st[/SUP] got my 72 I was confused about model designations since some are labeled HG, and advertised as such (not to mention a few being called Pueblo). I thought maybe there were NTs and NT HGs – the HGs being a separate model designation. So as you say, it may just be the label writer adding it out of habit.
 

davismanLV

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The way they built guitars decades ago (materials, processes, machines etc) was markedly different from the way they are produced nowadays. For me "vintage" implies a guitar that sounds like a NEW guitar in those days sounded, so it can be used to reproduce the authentic sounds of the artists of those days. It's the same as with wine, there were great vintage years and you want preserve that quality through storage of the original, or recreate it through blending.
Hey merlin, not sure you got what i was saying and I'm not sure you addressed what I was saying. Your " a guitar that sounds like a NEW guitar in those days sounded"makes absolutely no sense to me......... so i'm gonna say, If life and guitar life is an evolution. what would the vintage guitars evolve to??? i don't understand your post. I'll give you that my post was somewhat esoteric, however....... help!!!
 

highwayman

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Hi ,
As a newbie to LTG, I am very impressed with all the information you have provided about the DVs as follow-up to my question about DV73 production numbers.

Someone wanted to write down a list of all DV73s from LTG numbers. Mine has the SN AD730021.
Great guitar! Love it!

Happy New Year and greetings from Stuttgart,Germany!
 

West R Lee

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I know Hans tracks them, and Dave might. Hans has mine.....it's AD730033.

West

Hi ,
As a newbie to LTG, I am very impressed with all the information you have provided about the DVs as follow-up to my question about DV73 production numbers.

Someone wanted to write down a list of all DV73s from LTG numbers. Mine has the SN AD730021.
Great guitar! Love it!

Happy New Year and greetings from Stuttgart,Germany!
 

GardMan

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Yes, I started keeping a spreadsheet of the SNs of DV-7Xs that were selling on eBay, GBase, and/or Reverb a while back. No real purpose, other than curiousity... It started when I was trying to figure out how many NON-turquoise DV-72s there might be, keeping track of the number of malachite (I have 3 SNs) and coral 72s (I have 3 SNs) I had seen and trends in their SNs.
 

Bernie

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Bernie,
Here are a couple of threads I started when I bought by first two DVs, comparing them to my (now departed) '92 D-55 and '76 D-50:

http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...s-(D-50-D-55-amp-DV-73)&highlight=tale+dreads

http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...rather-verbose)&highlight=rosewood+comparison
Thanks GardMan, I'm going through theses two threads right now..Very valuable comments and very interesting comparisons...

To tell the truth I was guilty of "going along with you", because the subject has come up before.
Only just now did I see that West only said "thinner woods", and cited the same source I did.
It actually didn't contradict my point, but I repeat, I just haven't found anything explicitly saying they sanded the tops (on any DV's), even though that's obviously a detail one would expect. (...)
Anyway thanks to both of you for being gentlemen while I did my cactus impersonation: "Prickle-y"
:shame:
It's nice to be called a gentleman !, thanks Al (doesn't happen that often :fat: )...And don't worry, West forgave me anyway...
Doesn't seem to be in this post like I thought, but I think I read you saying somewhere Dvs had AAA tops : it's true of the DV 52s and I just wanted to add that comments on Reverb even mentioned AAAA tops on DV 72s and DV 73s...
Thanks all
Bernie
 

merlin6666

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Hey merlin, not sure you got what i was saying and I'm not sure you addressed what I was saying. Your " a guitar that sounds like a NEW guitar in those days sounded"makes absolutely no sense to me......... so i'm gonna say, If life and guitar life is an evolution. what would the vintage guitars evolve to??? i don't understand your post. I'll give you that my post was somewhat esoteric, however....... help!!!

Hey Davisman, I understood your post as saying that a "vintage" sound is the result of a guitar aging and being played etc. I did not agree with that. For me the term "vintage" reflects the conditions under which a guitar is produced in a given era, and includes factors such as quality of materials, build process and machinery, luthier skills, design details, etc. These things change over time and therefore, a new guitar today sounds very different than a new guitar 20, 40, or 60 years ago. So if you wanted to have the "vintage" guitar sound of let's say Leadbelly, you would not want his old guitar that has many additional years of aging, but one that was built in the same way that they built guitars in his era when he may have received it fairly new. The Martin Authentics or other special issues attempt to recreate guitars of specific vintages. I used a comparison to wine because the term "vintage" actually refers to wines from grapes of a specific harvest year. The opposite of a vintage building building process are processes that mimic the ageing of a guitar such as torrification, as this obliterates the vintage characteristics.
 

davismanLV

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Okay, I get what you're saying. It's a different point of view but certainly a valid point and it makes sense. Happy New Year!! :encouragement:
 

awagner

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I looked at all the pics... and this guitar is (IMO) DEFINITELY a DV-73 with a DV-72 serial number corresponding to a 1994 build. Perhaps it is a transition... maybe the first DV-73 "proof of concept" built on the existing DV-72 model? Predating the '94 AD73XXX DV-73s (corrected)? Maybe Hans knows?

IF you are considering a purchase... jump on it before someone else does! I don't think you will be disappointed!

I corrected a line in the post... the guitar in question certainly would not predate the LK DV-72s that were made in 1993. I meant that it predates the AD73 DV-73s in the SN lists for 1994. Just having a small "senior moment"...


So now I am wondering how many other DV73s have DV72 serial numbers, because that reduces the number of known DV72s out there and increases the amount of DV73s. Also, it would be interesting to know the completion date of this DV73 (AD721077) compared to AD73001.
 

West R Lee

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This is when we really need Hans. The only man alive who probably knows the answers.

West

So now I am wondering how many other DV73s have DV72 serial numbers, because that reduces the number of known DV72s out there and increases the amount of DV73s. Also, it would be interesting to know the completion date of this DV73 (AD721077) compared to AD73001.
 

GardMan

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Also, it would be interesting to know the completion date of this DV73 (AD721077) compared to AD73001.

Yes, it would. I'd settle for the date on the neck block. Maybe sanfran_dan will buy it and clue us in... or Hans might chime in , if it's in his records.
 

chazmo

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No doubt, West. The anomalies like this DV-72 that's really a DV-73 are probably very few. Again, I'm guessing transitional stuff before they cooked up the DV-73 model designation.

awagner, where did you get your information to begin with? If you're looking at counts based on serial numbers... I wouldn't trust that the lists aren't gappy. I.e., there might be a range of numbers associated with a given year, but the number produced is probably (and potentially significantly) less. Then again, maybe I'm wrong. :) I've learned that most of this is inscrutable. :)
 

adorshki

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Thanks GardMan, I'm going through theses two threads right now..Very valuable comments and very interesting comparisons...

It's nice to be called a gentleman !, thanks Al (doesn't happen that often :fat: )...And don't worry, West forgave me anyway...
:friendly_wink:

Doesn't seem to be in this post like I thought, but I think I read you saying somewhere Dvs had AAA tops : it's true of the DV 52s
I mentioned it as showing up on the specs page of the '97 catalog, but not in the actual product description I quoted.
and I just wanted to add that comments on Reverb even mentioned AAAA tops on DV 72s and DV 73s...
Thanks all
Bernie
I'm skeptical of the Reverb comments, I suspect puffery on part of sellers to help justify their asking prices.
Nowhere have I ever seen a "AAAA" top spec in Guild lit, (and granted not that I've seen a whole lot of it), but not even the Custom Shop models or the other top-of-the-line flattops showed anything higher than AAA, even in the 2001 price list when they had hit the height of their quality in Westerly.
Even the Benedettos used older more traditional grading terminology when they described an actual tap-tuned top:
"hand-graduated, tuned,very select, aged European spruce top", as seen here:
http://www.westerlyguildguitars.com/files/Guild2001.pdf
I don't think Guild ever even subscribed to a "AAAA" rating system which is largely determined by a given maker in any case; the rating system itself actually has no concrete standards and is primarily cosmetic in reference.
In counterpoint, it's been said before that what was "AA" and "AAA" for Guild might well have been "AAA" and "Master Grade" for makers like Gibson and Martin simply because Guild's buyer Willie Fritscher was so discriminating, hand-selecting the batches himself at the point of milling, as described here:
http://www.westerlyguildguitars.com/articles/woodselection.pdf
Note that article itself only specifies "AAA" as being the spec reserved for their highest end models.
Also note that a very high percentage of online ads with decent pics of Guild tops from the '70's forward usually show a nice degree of silking even on the entry-level models.
Anyway, coming back full course, that's why I mentioned I suspect in the end the sound quality of any of the DV's is going to come down to actual wood quality and bracing style, as opposed to any actual tap tuning, BUT:
It wouldn't surprise me if they actually took pains to ensure the top blanks were checked to be a certain thickness, maybe a little different than what would be spec'd for F50's and D55's for example, and corrected if necessary.
And although we never see it spec'd and rarely even discussed, I think they may have actually specified different top thicknesses for different body sizes.
I've often suspected my F65ce's top is a bit thinner than my dreadnought tops although like Dave I never got around to micing 'em.
 
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awagner

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awagner, where did you get your information to begin with? If you're looking at counts based on serial numbers... I wouldn't trust that the lists aren't gappy. I.e., there might be a range of numbers associated with a given year, but the number produced is probably (and potentially significantly) less. Then again, maybe I'm wrong. :) I've learned that most of this is inscrutable. :)

Chaz,

If the number of DV72s produced in 1994 is based on the serial # chart, then that number must be reduced by how many of them are actually DV73s, of which there appears to be at least 1. Necessarily, therefore, the number of DV73s must increase based on how many of them bear DV72 serial #s. This is true even if fewer than 197 DV72s were produced that year (based on the chart).
 

F312

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I put the mic to my DV52 at the rim of the rosette, and got 0.141 thousands of an inch, 3.514 mm. Don't know if that is consistent throughout.

Ralph
 
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adorshki

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I put the mic to my DV52 at the rim of the rosette, and got 0.141 thousands of an inch, 3.514. Don't know if that is consistent throughout.

Ralph

I suspect it will be for DV52's, and throughout the top, but comparison specs'll be interesting.
 
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chazmo

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Chaz,

If the number of DV72s produced in 1994 is based on the serial # chart, then that number must be reduced by how many of them are actually DV73s, of which there appears to be at least 1. Necessarily, therefore, the number of DV73s must increase based on how many of them bear DV72 serial #s. This is true even if fewer than 197 DV72s were produced that year (based on the chart).

Gotcha'. Yeah, that's actually what I was asking... I would not trust your production numbers if they are based on the serial number ranges, awagner. But yes if they were then they're obviously skewed by these mis-represented guitars.
 

awagner

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Yes, I started keeping a spreadsheet of the SNs of DV-7Xs that were selling on eBay, GBase, and/or Reverb a while back. No real purpose, other than curiousity... It started when I was trying to figure out how many NON-turquoise DV-72s there might be, keeping track of the number of malachite (I have 3 SNs) and coral 72s (I have 3 SNs) I had seen and trends in their SNs.

By the way, the "shop" is actually an auction house, and in addition to the DV73, they were also auctioning a DV72 NT-MK, bearing S/N AD720188. So you can add this one to your spreadsheet, if it is not there already.
 
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